Covid and Work, Covid Advice and General Chat

[MrsA2]

Making a will and setting up power of attorneys are NOT morbid or depressing things to do that only arise because of COVID
They are sensible, practical documents each and evey adult should set up for themselves. My husband and I have had them for a few years now and we are fit and well. We set them up prior to doing some longer term travelling, and after having to deal with the horrendous situation of a single friend suddenly dying intestate (without a will). It cost thousands to sort out and her money didnt go to the people she wanted it to.

Its worth doing years before anyone is likely to need care or help. We had everything set up for my mother who did develop dementia. It made a difficult situation much easier in that we could sort finance and health issues quickly.

Its easier to have conversation about it with your relatives when you are fit and well and can put your views across

I say, everyone do it now

 

[bulkbiker]

Fascinating thread on testing..
https://twitter.com/HowardSteen4/status/1293524731916943362

Second wave deaths
https://twitter.com/PishPishCat/status/1293554761590071298

The effectiveness of cloth masks.
http://www.asahi.com/ajw/articles/13523664

Interesting stuff.

 

[KELI]

I'm so sorry that you are in this position. I have read through the guidelines for education and childcare settings. The fact that it can recommend wearing masks in shops and on public transport (both now mandated) then almost glibly say that you don't need to in an education or childcare setting is nothing short of a scandal.

I couldn't agree more.

It's amazing how somehow COVID-19 recognises a school gate and apparently it doesn't come in to primary schools. Along with everyone else who works in a primary school we have been told no PPE use from September unless we are dealing with a suspected case at school, then it's full PPE mask, gloves and apron. I'm vulnerable with type 2, slightly obese (forever trying to lose weight) but also have asthma and now high cholesterol. I'm dreading going back to school. I love my job and the age group I work with (KS1) but it's impossible to social distance no matter how hard you try. If a child needs help and support you automatically give them that support. I have an extremely vulnerable teenager with half a lung missing and a vulnerable husband. I'm very worried about the way the government are leaving those adults who work in schools high and dry but insist that any other place of work that has people gathering together must wear PPE or have shields or transparent screens up. It's madness!

 

[Tannith]

Yep saw that and not surprised as it's hardly rocket science. Makes me laugh when you get all these "experts" saying risk of transmission is low in schools. Er,,,, bar being open to key workers children and vulnerable and those with care plans schools were mostly closed in the physical sense between March and July and now it's the summer holidays so of course transmission would be low!! It's when you open them for all and sundry come September you will see the rate go up. I would love to see the Government with egg on it's face again but not at the expense of illness and deaths, me included!!

I've kind of accepted now that unless I win the lottery I am back in September and will almost certainly pick it up at some stage, which as I said before practically makes all my efforts at lowering my risk since March pretty pointless.

I can't take my pension out without a massive tax hit and I've got no other income options bar a pay packet. The irony is that my mother is very wealthy but is in care with dementia. I know that the mum of two years ago would loan me a few grand but even though I am Power of Attorney I cannot even request a loan through the Court of Protection and even if I could the backlog with the COP will be horrendous.

So as I live alone, and it sounds morbid, I have taken out an LPA for myself with my sister given instructions in the event that I fall ill or worse. I had a will anyway but I also have had to make two documents for my sister generally telling her account numbers, phone numbers, cancellation policies of all my affairs and my mum's affairs so she can deal with both in the event that I end up in hospital or worse. Hopefully I won't obviously but you have to be prepared. Horrible thing to have too write and even more horrible telling my sister that this is what she will have to do in that event. So the lack of concern from the Government re the forgotten clinically vulnerable to Covid has far reaching repercussions not just for us but our families.

Sorry for such a dour - half glass empty post!!

So sorry to hear of your situation Max. And Keli too. Normally you would just walk out & get another job but now there aren't any. I hope the teaching unions press for masks being made compulsory.

 

[LooperCat]

Our posts crossed over Max. No apologies needed. I have seen elsewhere that teachers have written wills etc. It does feel like we are on a run away train at the moment with everything going full steam ahead. Yes economy dreadful, schools need to open etc. I do however feel that the probably relatively small group that are faced with a perfect storm with regard to risk are not even on governments radar,if we are we are unimportant.

I updated my will as soon as I went back to work for the ambulance service.

 

[Max68]

I couldn't agree more.

It's amazing how somehow COVID-19 recognises a school gate and apparently it doesn't come in to primary schools. Along with everyone else who works in a primary school we have been told no PPE use from September unless we are dealing with a suspected case at school, then it's full PPE mask, gloves and apron. I'm vulnerable with type 2, slightly obese (forever trying to lose weight) but also have asthma and now high cholesterol. I'm dreading going back to school. I love my job and the age group I work with (KS1) but it's impossible to social distance no matter how hard you try. If a child needs help and support you automatically give them that support. I have an extremely vulnerable teenager with half a lung missing and a vulnerable husband. I'm very worried about the way the government are leaving those adults who work in schools high and dry but insist that any other place of work that has people gathering together must wear PPE or have shields or transparent screens up. It's madness!

Madness it is indeed and totally understand your feelings,. I popped to a solicitors yesterday to take documentation for mum's house sale there. First time since early March I have been indoors anywhere bar my house or mums house, which is empty anyway. Rang the buzzer with my mask on and when I entered there was just the Receptionist sitting behind a three way Perspex screen! She probably sees one, maybe two people an hour and she gets a nice box to sit in!

This is what the "what's the fuss about brigade" seem to forget when it comes to schools. Shop staff aren't in the presence of any individual for long, same as above with Receptionists, Drivers, Postal Workers and the like, and many work outside for much of the day or in a vehicle on their own. Many Office workers have options to work from home or it's likely that screens will protect their bubble in the Office,. Many Bank workers are still working from home and get this, Union Staff are still working from home.

There has been a higher rate of infection in Taxi Drivers and Bus Drivers and yet they don't spend all day with the same passengers, so when it comes to us at schools, certainly with regard to being with the same people for a large part of the day, we are on a par with Health Workers and Care Home Staff, which I wouldn't be surprised if they have probably the highest rates of infection and possibly deaths in the Occupation tables although I am happy to be corrected on that.

As Keli quite rightly says no PPE for School Staff but it's deemed understandably important for Health Workers and Care Homes. Bizarre!

 

[Max68]

So sorry to hear of your situation Max. And Keli too. Normally you would just walk out & get another job but now there aren't any. I hope the teaching unions press for masks being made compulsory.

What the Government should have worked out is that is that there will be staff and children who are vulnerable. Not only that but there will be some very nervous parents who would prefer not to send their kids back yet so there is still massive scope for Home Learning to continue for various groups, presented by vulnerable staff. As an LSA I on Zoom merely sat there and observed as you had to have two staff in a Zoom lesson at all times. I could easily do that supporting a Teacher taking a lesson in say Manchester for instance as there is absolutely no reason for an LSA to be on camera. Months ago it would have been easy for the Government to have created a database of vulnerable children and staff from every school and a long term Home Learning Plan could have been put in place countrywide utilising all vulnerable school staff. But sadly this Government hasn't done one proactive thing re this Pandemic, merely reacted (badly in many cases) to every situation!

 

[JRT]

What the Government should have worked out is that is that there will be staff and children who are vulnerable. Not only that but there will be some very nervous parents who would prefer not to send their kids back yet so there is still massive scope for Home Learning to continue for various groups, presented by vulnerable staff. As an LSA I on Zoom merely sat there and observed as you had to have two staff in a Zoom lesson at all times. I could easily do that supporting a Teacher taking a lesson in say Manchester for instance as there is absolutely no reason for an LSA to be on camera. Months ago it would have been easy for the Government to have created a database of vulnerable children and staff from every school and a long term Home Learning Plan could have been put in place countrywide utilising all vulnerable school staff. But sadly this Government hasn't done one proactive thing re this Pandemic, merely reacted (badly in many cases) to every situation!

I think that is the most frustrating thing,it would make perfect sense to join together students and pupils virtually if vulnerable. The government are either to stupid,don't care,or are just sitting back and waiting for it to be done on a local level.! One thing did occur to me. I wonder if government dont want to sanction use of PPE as already in short supply?

 

[KELI]

I think that is the most frustrating thing,it would make perfect sense to join together students and pupils virtually if vulnerable. The government are either to stupid,don't care,or are just sitting back and waiting for it to be done on a local level.! One thing did occur to me. I wonder if government dont want to sanction use of PPE as already in short supply?

Personally, I just don't think the government care. All they care about is getting the kids back to school and adults back to work so they can pay their taxes and restart the economy.

I'd quite happily buy my own PPE if I was allowed to wear it in September. My school does have PPE available but it's for first aid purposes and personal care use which I did use in June/July.

My head teacher was fantastic and very understanding in June/July when the school was open to certain year groups and keyworkers but September will be a whole new ball game and no-one knows how it's going to go because no-one has enough evidence because this has never happened before in our lifetimes and we're all learning as we go along but I do feel it is very unfair that every other business has PPE of some form and schools don't. Even the links people have posted on here show children in masks sat at tables with clear screens around their desks. We have to sit two children to a table side by side. As soon as they chat to each other they are going to face each other with only a few centimetres between them.

 

[Tannith]

Personally, I just don't think the government care. All they care about is getting the kids back to school and adults back to work so they can pay their taxes and restart the economy.

I'd quite happily buy my own PPE if I was allowed to wear it in September. My school does have PPE available but it's for first aid purposes and personal care use which I did use in June/July.

My head teacher was fantastic and very understanding in June/July when the school was open to certain year groups and keyworkers but September will be a whole new ball game and no-one knows how it's going to go because no-one has enough evidence because this has never happened before in our lifetimes and we're all learning as we go along but I do feel it is very unfair that every other business has PPE of some form and schools don't. Even the links people have posted on here show children in masks sat at tables with clear screens around their desks. We have to sit two children to a table side by side. As soon as they chat to each other they are going to face each other with only a few centimetres between them.

What about starting a petition on Change.org asking for teachers (&kids) to be ALLOWED to wear PPE? That wouldn't risk refusal if the Govt is trying to avoid supplying it.

 

[Jbicheno]

Madness it is indeed and totally understand your feelings,. I popped to a solicitors yesterday to take documentation for mum's house sale there. First time since early March I have been indoors anywhere bar my house or mums house, which is empty anyway. Rang the buzzer with my mask on and when I entered there was just the Receptionist sitting behind a three way Perspex screen! She probably sees one, maybe two people an hour and she gets a nice box to sit in!

This is what the "what's the fuss about brigade" seem to forget when it comes to schools. Shop staff aren't in the presence of any individual for long, same as above with Receptionists, Drivers, Postal Workers and the like, and many work outside for much of the day or in a vehicle on their own. Many Office workers have options to work from home or it's likely that screens will protect their bubble in the Office,. Many Bank workers are still working from home and get this, Union Staff are still working from home.

There has been a higher rate of infection in Taxi Drivers and Bus Drivers and yet they don't spend all day with the same passengers, so when it comes to us at schools, certainly with regard to being with the same people for a large part of the day, we are on a par with Health Workers and Care Home Staff, which I wouldn't be surprised if they have probably the highest rates of infection and possibly deaths in the Occupation tables although I am happy to be corrected on that.

As Keli quite rightly says no PPE for School Staff but it's deemed understandably important for Health Workers and Care Homes. Bizarre!

I am an LSA who works in Year 6 (10-11 year olds. Most of the children are as big as me so social distancing is impossible. Teachers have been advised to remain 2 meters distant from pupils however, no such advise for LSAs who are often sitting with the children to support their learning throughout the school day. As with most schools, ours has advised no PPE but I requested to be allowed to wear a face visor which I would provide. My headteacher has agreed to this but I must explain to all that I have mitigating circumstances, though not what they are, to do this.
I am completely confused as to how it is necessary to wear a face covering in any other indoor environment where you are not eating or drinking but this is not necessary in a classroom of 30 pupils and 2 adults. Most restaurants and pubs are adhering strictly to the 2 meter rule and staff are wearing face coverings. No such luxury in school.
I am very anxious about returning in September. I too have no choice at the moment. I am a well controlled type 2 diabetic who is 59 years old and female so perhaps not so high risk as some but high risk enough to wish that the government would make PPE mandatory in school as it has done elsewhere.

 

[Max68]

What about starting a petition on Change.org asking for teachers (&kids) to be ALLOWED to wear PPE? That wouldn't risk refusal if the Govt is trying to avoid supplying it.

Good idea that. I have started one.

http://chng.it/QSFsRY6Qwg

 

[JRT]

Good idea that. I have started one.

http://chng.it/QSFsRY6Qwg

Have signed and shared

 

[Tannith]

Have signed and shared

Me too but I would have preferred to see it also ask for masks etc to be allowed as I think there is more likely to be Govt support for that, as it costs them nothing whereas organising home learning would be harder and more expensive for them to do, and would also not get the parents back to work which I suspect is Boris' main reason for reopening schools.

 

[There is no Spoon]

wish that the government would make PPE mandatory in school as it has done elsewhere.

Hi Jbicheno,
I have been working all through the outbreak in constant contact with the public, adults and kids alike and I can understand how you are feeling, kids do not socially distance and the adults are even worse. I live in Aberdeen and even in the midst of this new outbreak I see people here take off face masks and hand it to there mate to wear.

As far as I recall, government guide lines are such that for a prolonged period,of time (above 3-4 hours) a face mask or shield becomes ineffective, this is why office staff are not required to wear one. You are in the class with the kids all day. This would be an easy thing to sight when not supplying you or teachers with PPE.

But if the above is true, prolonged period, then I would not stress yourself to much, face coverings seem to be more for brief contact with strangers in a shop or on public transport than a full day with the same people each day.

From day one WHO and other bodies have said face masks do not stop you catching covid,
The mask is to stop you spreading it.

 

[Max68]

Me too but I would have preferred to see it also ask for masks etc to be allowed as I think there is more likely to be Govt support for that, as it costs them nothing whereas organising home learning would be harder and more expensive for them to do, and would also not get the parents back to work which I suspect is Boris' main reason for reopening schools.

Agree but your suggestion re a petition re PPE was aimed at Kelli so I wasn't going to tread on toes with regard to that one. Nothing stopping anyone doing a petition for just that though. The more options the better!

 

[lucylocket61]

Hi Jbicheno,
I have been working all through the outbreak in constant contact with the public, adults and kids alike and I can understand how you are feeling, kids do not socially distance and the adults are even worse. I live in Aberdeen and even in the midst of this new outbreak I see people here take off face masks and hand it to there mate to wear.

As far as I recall, government guide lines are such that for a prolonged period,of time (above 3-4 hours) a face mask or shield becomes ineffective, this is why office staff are not required to wear one. You are in the class with the kids all day. This would be an easy thing to sight when not supplying you or teachers with PPE.

But if the above is true, prolonged period, then I would not stress yourself to much, face coverings seem to be more for brief contact with strangers in a shop or on public transport than a full day with the same people each day.

From day one WHO and other bodies have said face masks do not stop you catching covid,
The mask is to stop you spreading it.

Sorry, but I am struggling to get the logic of your post.

For example, simply changing a mask for a fresh one every few hours would work for one of your points.

Where is the evidence that being in a room for several hours is not harmful? Viral load is a real issue.

 

[Max68]

Hi Jbicheno,
I have been working all through the outbreak in constant contact with the public, adults and kids alike and I can understand how you are feeling, kids do not socially distance and the adults are even worse. I live in Aberdeen and even in the midst of this new outbreak I see people here take off face masks and hand it to there mate to wear.

Us humans do some strange things when you just don't think. On the golf course we all touch putters, Three Musketeers style, after we finish rather than the usual hand shake and even I, a desperate stickler to risks, offered up the handle rather than the other end!!

 

[LooperCat]

As far as I recall, government guide lines are such that for a prolonged period,of time (above 3-4 hours) a face mask or shield becomes ineffective, this is why office staff are not required to wear one. You are in the class with the kids all day. This would be an easy thing to sight when not supplying you or teachers with PPE.

So change it every lesson, or at break and lunch. Most school days are structured in to five hourlong lessons in a 2-2-1 arrangement.

But if the above is true, prolonged period, then I would not stress yourself to much, face coverings seem to be more for brief contact with strangers in a shop or on public transport than a full day with the same people each day.

And if just one of the people in that classroom is infected and therefore freely breathing virus over the rest of the people enclosed in the space with them?

I won’t be going back to supply teaching (if I’m not able to wear PPE) for the time being; if I need extra money I’ll get a bank shift transporting actual Covid patients for the ambulance service. It’s safer.

 

[Mr_Pot]

I hope the majority of teachers are young, fit and not vulnerable. If those on here are any sort of cross-section it doesn't sound like there is much chance of children getting a proper education any time soon.