Diabetes after pancreatitis

noralee

Newbie
Messages
3
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Six months ago I had severe acute pancreatitis. I got a trip in an ambulance and 2 weeks in hospital. They couldn't find any reason for the pancreatitis, no gall stones and I was a regular but not heavy drinker. I can't remember most of the first week but I spent the 2nd week on a combined insulin and glucose drip, with the ratios adjusted 2 hourly. This drove me into hypos a couple of times. Other times I was hitting 18 to 20 mmol/l when they took me off the drip.

I finally got seen by a diabetes nurse, who said some rude words about her colleagues. She made them take me off this regime, and sent me home with a blood glucose meter, novorapid insulin and instructions to test before meals and inject if higher than 15 mmol/l. I was given zero dietary advice (other than no alcohol) after describing my usual diet and the only follow up was to be a HbA1c test at 3 months.

I followed a diet of no sugar or bread, but continued to eat pasta, rice, potatoes, beans and some meat but not large amounts. I didn't need the insulin after the first day home. My BGL readings slowly came down and stabilized around 8.2 mmol/l pre-meal. I lost 10 kg in the first 6 weeks or so but my weight has stabilized since then.

My physio prescribed a steroid injection into an inflamed bursa not long before the 3 month blood test. I had no idea this wasn't such a good idea until I read the handout I got after the injection.

My 3 month HbA1c results were 63 mmol/mol and 68 mmol/mol repeated 2 weeks later. All my other bloods are perfect except just on the top end of the cholesterol stuff. BMI is also 22.5.

The doctor gave me diagnosis of Type 2 diabetes, and a diet plan of lots of meat and vegies except potatoes, no rice, pasta, bread, sugar, dried fruit or bananas, some beans. (I also don't eat dairy). I've followed this and my pre meal BGL average is now 7.2 mmol/l. I calculate I'm eating under 100 g of carbs/day. I mostly walk about 5 km/day and I'm now getting back to riding an ebike and doing 2 to 6 hours of gardening stuff 3 days/week.

The doctor recommends no drugs (tablets or insulin) until we see whether diet and exercise is enough.

I'm a scientist (physics, measurement, data) and tend to over analyze things. I guess I'm doing OK? Enough?

Questions
My pre breakfast reading is always higher (8 to 8.5 mmol/l) than my pre lunch and dinner (5.8 to 7.5 mmol/l).
I've read about dawn syndrome and such. Is this a problem? How could I get it down?
I've started taking a reading 2 hours post dinner and its 8.5 to 10.5 mmol/l.

The data scientist in me is going to self-fund a CGM for 15 days and do some experiments.
Things I want to try
- How much does a 30 min walk lower my BGL?
- High glycemic vs low glycemic carbs - does it matter?
- What happens overnight?
Does any one else have some recommendations for things I could try over the 15 days on a CGM?

I hope this isn't too long a read.
 

EllieM

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Given that your pancreatitis induced the diabetes, I have to wonder whether they have tested your insulin production (cpeptide test) to see whether your issue is lack of insulin (caused by T3c diabetes) rather than T2. T2 diabetics generally start by overproducing insulin as their issue is insulin resistance.

Having said that, if your issue is reduced insulin reduction you are obviously still producing some, and it may well be that cutting the carbs as per your doctor's suggestion is doing the trick.

I think you could learn a lot from a cgm (be aware of its limitations and maybe consider checking the levels with a meter if they surprise you.)

Maybe experiment to see if a small piece of cheese (or small amount of carbs) eases your dawn phenomena? (As a T1 diabetic who produces no insulin at all I find a very small amount of carbs calms my liver down and restrains it from pumping out too much sugar, but that is just me and may not apply to others.)

I think you have got this - being a scientist will help you here. Just be aware that a single sample probably isn't enough and there are a scarily large number of things that can effect blood sugars.

Good luck
 
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noralee

Newbie
Messages
3
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Thanks for the link. I'd come across type 3c diabetes in my reading but that link covers it better.
I haven't had any tests for insulin production, or tests or much interest in whether my pancreas is producing enough enzymes.
I'll bring it up next appointment.
Even in hospital I looked "too well" for my blood results, this sometimes doesn't help, but is better than the opposite.
 
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Melgar

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Tablets (oral)
@noralee , @EllieM has covered your concerns. I 100% agree a c-Peptide test would be very informative with regard to your insulin production. I'm also assuming your healthcare team looked into EPI.

Walking. I exercise to bring my blood sugars down. I do a long hike 4 days a week adding a strenuous hill climb into the mix. I do shorter walks on the remaining 3 days. I live in a mountainous area so that is an option for me. I always walk after a meal. If you live in a relatively flat area then a brisk walk. The amount of exertion, in my opinion, is the key to bringing blood sugars down. It needs to be a brisk walk, not a slow steady one; A walk that raises your heart rate is what you are looking for. ( assuming you do not have heart issues) .

I would recommend monitoring your blood sugars during your walk. A while back I had issues with unstable blood sugars ( damaged intestines from coeliac ) so my blood sugars would drop dramatically even walking. It's extremely unlikely that will happen, but while you are wearing your cgm it may be worth taking note what your blood sugars are doing, that's from my experience. With a strenuous walk you may see a rise in blood sugars, it's natural, but this is usually temporary. You may likely see lower blood sugars the following day.

I do not eat after 5pm. This helps with that my dawn phenomenon ( DP) . DP is normal, but with diabetes our pancreas' ability to control that natural rise in early morning blood sugars is compromised.
 

noralee

Newbie
Messages
3
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
I don't think anyone has looked at EPI (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency) at least not since leaving hospital. The diabetes nurse at the local medical center did think out loud about a referral to an endocrinologist, but it didn't eventuate. I'll follow up with questions at next appointment. I had some of the symptoms of EPI early on, but rarely now.

The bit I'm really learning is you have to research and hack yourself, and the sample size is always n=1. Things, that to a newbie look completely contradictory, do work for some people.
 

Melgar

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"The bit I'm really learning is you have to research and hack yourself, and the sample size is always n=1. Things, that to a newbie look completely contradictory, do work for some people."

I 100% agree with that statement @noralee.

I also agree with you pushing to see an Endo. If it was me I would want them to look into EPI.
 

Bcgirl

Well-Known Member
Messages
470
Type of diabetes
Type 3c
Treatment type
Diet only
Hi, your story is so very similar to mine. Almost twenty years ago I too ended up in the hospital with severe acute pancreatitis. I was, and still am, a non drinker. No cause was ever determined. I spent 16 days in the hospital and two months of “no food by mouth”. I was on insulin in the hospital but got off that almost immediately. I had a follow up surgery as my pseudo cyst kept growing , so it was attached to my stomach where it drained safely.
i was not diagnosed as diabetic until a few years ago, but when I look back at my blood tests I was always prediabetic…and never told. At that time blood test results were never passed on to patients, I just trusted the doctors…..
I currently keep my diabetes in check with a strict very low carb diet. Although I was originally told to a solid fat know eat it with abandon and have had no problems. I have never had a recurrence of the pancreatitis.
i have just started Creon as I was having issues with gaining weight….i kept losing. Feeling good now. I have to accept that I will never see an endo, there isn’t one in my city and the wait list for other places is too long…it just won’t happen (I’m in Canada).
great idea to use a CGM. I prefer the Dexcom G7. The libre was never even close to accurate for me. Hope you can get a c peptide test and a fasting insulin also. Mine are both low normal.
best of luck to you!
 
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