From memory there's a separate sheet that you have to sign that gives Swansea the green light to access your medical records. If you do not complete this then I don't believe that they can speak to your doctor. The only problem is if you don't let them speak to your doctor then they probably won't renew your license.
Driving with Diabetes
- Thread starter PMJ
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From memory there's a separate sheet that you have to sign that gives Swansea the green light to access your medical records. If you do not complete this then I don't believe that they can speak to your doctor. The only problem is if you don't let them speak to your doctor then they probably won't renew your license.
I thought that when you signed the consent form it cut both ways. Swansea speak to your doctor and vica versa?
Yes we are safer and at least the cops here won't beat and then kill us.
It doesn't matter if it's a government or private health worker.
TheBigNewt
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Diabetes police includes healthcare personnel? I guess they all work for the gubment so it's all fair. Never fly around here. That being said if a family member came to me about a demented geezery type patient of mine and they said he was not fit to drive, he took off last week in his car and ended up in Vegas baby and they had the cops out looking for him, I'd be obligated to participate in getting his license pulled. But certainly not for "hypo unawareness". That's a pretty vague mysterious entity IMHO.
Americans .... always scared of the government!
I know I know it was supposed to be by the people for the people but it never was was it.
You live in a two party one ideology state.
Don't worry though the rest of the world are mostly frightened of your government too.
TheBigNewt
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And for good reason. The Trumpster's a Wild and Crazy Guy! I'm waiting for the degenerate in North Korea (has anybody done a buccal DNA swab on him? I'm not sure he's got all the chromosomes) to throw the Bombs Away switch over there. Could get ugly.
This is why I DONT want a libre on the NHS.
I self fund at the moment and find my libre reads lower than my meter. If they downloaded my libre it would show hypos that I didn't have! Particularly the first 24-48 hours when it seems to be at its most inaccurate. Today it read LO. Which is below 2. I felt fine. Did a test and it was 4.8. Now if I was driving I would indeed eat something first at 4.8 but I most definitely was not below 2mmol.
It's not so bad I guess if you have blood tests to back it up but what if it's reading you as hypo and you don't know about it so don't do a blood test to support NOT being hypo?
That is what worries me about the libre. It fibs sometimes. Particularly at the lower end of the scale.
I self fund at the moment and find my libre reads lower than my meter. If they downloaded my libre it would show hypos that I didn't have! Particularly the first 24-48 hours when it seems to be at its most inaccurate. Today it read LO. Which is below 2. I felt fine. Did a test and it was 4.8. Now if I was driving I would indeed eat something first at 4.8 but I most definitely was not below 2mmol.
It's not so bad I guess if you have blood tests to back it up but what if it's reading you as hypo and you don't know about it so don't do a blood test to support NOT being hypo?
That is what worries me about the libre. It fibs sometimes. Particularly at the lower end of the scale.
He does indeed seem crazy.
Crazier than the little fat guy arming himself to keep you lot at bay!
Hey I made a simple little tune in honour of N Korea.
https://soundcloud.com/jacksbackband/the-emperors-secret-rocket-garden
TheBigNewt
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You have a very valid point in favor of NOT yanking your driving rights based on external data which may not be accurate. We all know the Libre can be totally in accurate, and that's the CGM most of you use. And I wager that was what was outfitted with OP that resulted in his driving privileges withheld.
TheBigNewt
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Nope I have been driving since the 1970's and without telling porkies on my renewal forms the DVLA have never contacted my GP or any other HCP regarding my diabetes. I know this because I asked my GP if DVLA ever contacted him regarding licence renewal.
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Yes there is medical consent form @Diabeticliberty and the DVLA do contact your HCP's if they need to check anything.
I renewed my licence earlier this year and it was back in 7-10 days, but the time before that it took around 7-8 weeks, on ringing the DVLA to ask why it was taking so long they explained that they were carrying out medical checks, so I can only assume that they had wrote to my Dr and hospital Consultant to verify what I'd wrote on the renewal form.
I have just been snooping in on the DVLA Website and found this (yes indeed, I am the veritable King Of Copy And Paste):
DVLA notification by drivers or healthcare professionals
Applicants and licence holders have a legal duty to:
Doctors and other healthcare professionals should:
In law it is the duty of the licence holder or applicant to notify the DVLA of any medical condition that may affect safe driving. This notification by people with licences issued by the DVLA (because they live in England, Scotland or Wales) may be done via GOV.UK – see Medical conditions, disabilities and driving.
For people with licences issued by the Driver and Vehicle Agency in Northern Ireland, the options for direct notification are given on the NI Direct page: How to tell DVA about a medical condition.
Circumstances may arise in which a person cannot or will not notify the DVLA. It may be necessary for a doctor, optometrist or other healthcare professional to consider notifying the DVLA under such circumstances if there is concern for road safety, which would be for both the individual and the wider public.
The General Medical Council and The College of Optometrists offer clear guidance about notifying the DVLA when the person cannot or will not exercise their own legal duty to do so.
The GMC guidelines 2017 (reproduced with permission) state:
1.In our guidance Confidentiality: good practice in handling patient information we say:
1.Trust is an essential part of the doctor-patient relationship and confidentiality is central to this. Patients may avoid seeking medical help, or may under-report symptoms, if they think that their personal information will be disclosed by doctors without consent, or without the chance to have some control over the timing or amount of information shared.
60.Doctors owe a duty of confidentiality to their patients, but they also have a wider duty to protect and promote the health of patients and the public.
62.You should ask for a patient’s consent to disclose information for the protection of others unless it is not safe or practicable to do so, or the information is required by law. You should consider any reasons given for refusal.
64.If it is not practicable to seek consent, and in exceptional cases where a patient has refused consent, disclosing personal information may be justified in the public interest if failure to do so may expose others to a risk of death or serious harm. The benefits to an individual or to society of the disclosure must outweigh both the patient’s and the public interest in keeping the information confidential.
68.If you consider that failure to disclose the information would leave individuals or society exposed to a risk so serious that it outweighs patients’ and the public interest in maintaining confidentiality, you should disclose relevant information promptly to an appropriate person or authority. You should inform the patient before disclosing the information, if it is practicable and safe to do so, even if you intend to disclose without their consent.
About this guidance
2.Doctors owe a duty of confidentiality to their patients, but they also have a wider duty to protect and promote the health of patients and the public. This explanatory guidance sets out the steps doctors should take if a patient’s failure or refusal to stop driving exposes others to a risk of death or serious harm.
Fitness to drive: doctors’ and patients’ responsibilities
3.The Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (DVLA) in England, Scotland and Wales and the Driver and Vehicle Agency (DVA) in Northern Ireland are legally responsible for deciding if a person is medically unfit to drive. This means they need to know if a person holding a driving licence has a condition or is undergoing treatment that may now, or in the future, affect their safety as a driver.
4.The driver is legally responsible for telling the DVLA or DVA about any such condition or treatment. Doctors should therefore alert patients to conditions and treatments that might affect their ability to drive and remind them of their duty to tell the appropriate agency. Doctors may, however, need to make a decision about whether to disclose relevant information without consent to the DVLA or DVA in the public interest if a patient is unfit to drive but continues to do so.
Assessing a patient’s fitness to drive
5.When diagnosing a patient’s condition, or providing or arranging treatment, you should consider whether the condition or treatment may affect their ability to drive safely. You should:
6.If a patient has a condition or is undergoing treatment that could impair their fitness to drive, you should:
a. explain this to the patient and tell them that they have a legal duty to inform the DVLA or DVA
b. tell the patient that you may be obliged to disclose relevant medical information about them, in confidence, to the DVLA or DVA if they continue to drive when they are not fit to do so
c. make a note of any advice you have given to a patient about their fitness to drive in their medical record.
7.If a patient is incapable of understanding this advice – for example, because of dementia – you should inform the DVLA or DVA as soon as practicable.
8.If a patient refuses to accept the diagnosis, or the effect of the condition or treatment on their ability to drive, you can suggest that they seek a second opinion, and help arrange for them to do so. You should advise the patient not to drive in the meantime. As long as the patient agrees, you may discuss your concerns with their relatives, friends or carers.
9.If you become aware that a patient is continuing to drive when they may not be fit to do so, you should make every reasonable effort to persuade them to stop. If you do not manage to persuade the patient to stop driving, or you discover that they are continuing to drive against your advice, you should consider whether the patient’s refusal to stop driving leaves others exposed to a risk of death or serious harm. If you believe that it does, you should contact the DVLA or DVA promptly and disclose any relevant medical information, in confidence, to the medical adviser.
10.Before contacting the DVLA or DVA, you should try to inform the patient of your intention to disclose personal information. If the patient objects to the disclosure, you should consider any reasons they give for objecting. If you decide to contact the DVLA or DVA, you should tell your patient in writing once you have done so, and make a note on the patient’s record.
Responding to requests for information from the DVLA or the DVA
11.If you agree to prepare a report or complete or sign a document to assist the DVLA’s or the DVA’s assessment of a patient’s fitness to drive, you should do so without unreasonable delay.
DVLA notification by drivers or healthcare professionals
Applicants and licence holders have a legal duty to:
- notify the DVLA of any injury or illness that would have a likely impact on safe driving ability (except some short-term conditions, as set out in this guide)
- respond fully and accurately to any requests for information from either the DVLA or healthcare professionals
- comply with the requirements of the issued licence, including any periodic medical reviews indicated by the DVLA.
Doctors and other healthcare professionals should:
- advise the individual on the impact of their medical condition for safe driving ability
- advise the individual on their legal requirement to notify the DVLA of any relevant condition
- treat, manage and monitor the individual’s condition with ongoing consideration of their fitness to drive
- notify the DVLA when fitness to drive requires notification but an individual cannot or will not notify the DVLA themselves
In law it is the duty of the licence holder or applicant to notify the DVLA of any medical condition that may affect safe driving. This notification by people with licences issued by the DVLA (because they live in England, Scotland or Wales) may be done via GOV.UK – see Medical conditions, disabilities and driving.
For people with licences issued by the Driver and Vehicle Agency in Northern Ireland, the options for direct notification are given on the NI Direct page: How to tell DVA about a medical condition.
Circumstances may arise in which a person cannot or will not notify the DVLA. It may be necessary for a doctor, optometrist or other healthcare professional to consider notifying the DVLA under such circumstances if there is concern for road safety, which would be for both the individual and the wider public.
The General Medical Council and The College of Optometrists offer clear guidance about notifying the DVLA when the person cannot or will not exercise their own legal duty to do so.
The GMC guidelines 2017 (reproduced with permission) state:
1.In our guidance Confidentiality: good practice in handling patient information we say:
1.Trust is an essential part of the doctor-patient relationship and confidentiality is central to this. Patients may avoid seeking medical help, or may under-report symptoms, if they think that their personal information will be disclosed by doctors without consent, or without the chance to have some control over the timing or amount of information shared.
60.Doctors owe a duty of confidentiality to their patients, but they also have a wider duty to protect and promote the health of patients and the public.
62.You should ask for a patient’s consent to disclose information for the protection of others unless it is not safe or practicable to do so, or the information is required by law. You should consider any reasons given for refusal.
64.If it is not practicable to seek consent, and in exceptional cases where a patient has refused consent, disclosing personal information may be justified in the public interest if failure to do so may expose others to a risk of death or serious harm. The benefits to an individual or to society of the disclosure must outweigh both the patient’s and the public interest in keeping the information confidential.
68.If you consider that failure to disclose the information would leave individuals or society exposed to a risk so serious that it outweighs patients’ and the public interest in maintaining confidentiality, you should disclose relevant information promptly to an appropriate person or authority. You should inform the patient before disclosing the information, if it is practicable and safe to do so, even if you intend to disclose without their consent.
About this guidance
2.Doctors owe a duty of confidentiality to their patients, but they also have a wider duty to protect and promote the health of patients and the public. This explanatory guidance sets out the steps doctors should take if a patient’s failure or refusal to stop driving exposes others to a risk of death or serious harm.
Fitness to drive: doctors’ and patients’ responsibilities
3.The Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency (DVLA) in England, Scotland and Wales and the Driver and Vehicle Agency (DVA) in Northern Ireland are legally responsible for deciding if a person is medically unfit to drive. This means they need to know if a person holding a driving licence has a condition or is undergoing treatment that may now, or in the future, affect their safety as a driver.
4.The driver is legally responsible for telling the DVLA or DVA about any such condition or treatment. Doctors should therefore alert patients to conditions and treatments that might affect their ability to drive and remind them of their duty to tell the appropriate agency. Doctors may, however, need to make a decision about whether to disclose relevant information without consent to the DVLA or DVA in the public interest if a patient is unfit to drive but continues to do so.
Assessing a patient’s fitness to drive
5.When diagnosing a patient’s condition, or providing or arranging treatment, you should consider whether the condition or treatment may affect their ability to drive safely. You should:
- refer to the DVLA’s guidance Assessing fitness to drive – a guide for medical professionals, which includes information about disorders and conditions that can impair a patient’s fitness to drive
- seek the advice of an experienced colleague or the DVLA’s or DVA’s medical adviser if you are not sure whether a condition or treatment might affect a patient’s fitness to drive.
6.If a patient has a condition or is undergoing treatment that could impair their fitness to drive, you should:
a. explain this to the patient and tell them that they have a legal duty to inform the DVLA or DVA
b. tell the patient that you may be obliged to disclose relevant medical information about them, in confidence, to the DVLA or DVA if they continue to drive when they are not fit to do so
c. make a note of any advice you have given to a patient about their fitness to drive in their medical record.
7.If a patient is incapable of understanding this advice – for example, because of dementia – you should inform the DVLA or DVA as soon as practicable.
8.If a patient refuses to accept the diagnosis, or the effect of the condition or treatment on their ability to drive, you can suggest that they seek a second opinion, and help arrange for them to do so. You should advise the patient not to drive in the meantime. As long as the patient agrees, you may discuss your concerns with their relatives, friends or carers.
9.If you become aware that a patient is continuing to drive when they may not be fit to do so, you should make every reasonable effort to persuade them to stop. If you do not manage to persuade the patient to stop driving, or you discover that they are continuing to drive against your advice, you should consider whether the patient’s refusal to stop driving leaves others exposed to a risk of death or serious harm. If you believe that it does, you should contact the DVLA or DVA promptly and disclose any relevant medical information, in confidence, to the medical adviser.
10.Before contacting the DVLA or DVA, you should try to inform the patient of your intention to disclose personal information. If the patient objects to the disclosure, you should consider any reasons they give for objecting. If you decide to contact the DVLA or DVA, you should tell your patient in writing once you have done so, and make a note on the patient’s record.
Responding to requests for information from the DVLA or the DVA
11.If you agree to prepare a report or complete or sign a document to assist the DVLA’s or the DVA’s assessment of a patient’s fitness to drive, you should do so without unreasonable delay.
Fairygodmother
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Oh Big Newt, why are you so angry about this country's desire to ensure people who use insulin have hypo-awareness?
The Newt is a Yankee Doodle Dandy and they all ride horses. If you have a hypo in the saddle the horse just stops giddeeing up and does stuff that horses do. They don't need to be hypo aware in the States. (Mr Newt please note I am only gently poking mild fun at you. I have read a lot of your posts since I became active on this Forum and you make a lot of sense on a lot of stuff
)
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The Newt is a Yankee Doodle Dandy and they all ride horses. If you have a hypo in the saddle the horse just stops giddeeing up and does stuff that horses do. They don't need to be hypo aware in the States. (Mr Newt please note I am only gently poking mild fun at you. I have read a lot of your posts since I became active on this Forum and you make a lot of sense on a lot of stuff
I was brought up round "nags" myself & you are pretty much spot on.! If the rider loses concentration? The horse loses purpose.
They sort of respond to rider posture too..
I remember the horse that was Aragorn's in the LOTR movies, a quick lick then laying down so that he could get back on after he went over the cliff after killing the Warg rider.
Fairygodmother
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I was wondering how to broach this...? I'll hold my hands up too!
Back on topic though, @PMJ , I know some of the places I've worked at where some of the workforce may at one time or another have a vehicle off the road? Arrangements are made & a colleague pitches in with a lift.
(I've also known sympathetic employers when a collegue has been banned for a misdemeanour.)
There have been mentions already about "reasonable adjustment." A word to your boss (or even a backup letter from the doc.) stating you have been advised not to drive for a certain period while the assessment is proceeding..
But to be frank. If you've not had any 3rd party intervention (as stated earlier.) & you work closely with your HCPs on this? I can't see any long term issue...
Just remembered. About 9 years ago? I got an inner ear infection causing loss of balance. I was advised not to drive for two weeks. (Though I'd already took the initiative to hang the keys.)
I've renewed my licence thrice sinse (the maximum term on return.) & there have been no repercussions regarding the doc's advisory..
Still wishing you luck.
