First Post, but feel I need to tell you some stuff!

Dingerbel

Newbie
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2
Hi everyone, I am Tony, I live and work in Bangkok Thailand and have been here for 4yrs. I was given T2 for my birthday last year (happy 40th to me) in August, so I am pretty new to it all. I guess this was down to a combination of bad living lifestyle and total laziness, anyway, I just wanna share some stuff with you about how things have gone on here in the land of smiles.

As you no doubt know, the NHS does not stretch this far east, so all medical cover has to be paid for, its pretty cheap to be honest and I have to say I have no complaints at the level of care you get here. However, even though T2 effects a large number of Asian folks, the level of support for a new T2 seriously lacks. The info they have is outdated and all they want to do is stick you on as much medication as possible to make you go away. So needless to say I have had to work the majority of this stuff out for myself. I have looked at great sites like this and I bought books on diabetes and diets, but the best help has come from the nice people that post here. You cannot get better advice than from people who have been through it themselves and this again is why I am now posting (I am no expert, a newbie but things are working well).

Background done, let me tell you what I have been up to, to get all my levels down to normal...

When first diagnosed my levels were all bad, I mean everything. I had bad sugar level at over 300 (after fasting) hepatitis on my liver caused by fat on it, high blood pressure, high bad cholesterol and very low good cholesterol. I was in panic mode, not knowing what to do and where to go and getting really no help. Once calmed down a started to search the internet and found a guy called Timothy Ferris, he wrote the 4hr working week and a new book called the 4hr body. The book has nothing to do with diabetes, he doesn’t even suffer from it or anything. Anyway in that book is there is a diet called “the slow-carb diet” and it said I would lose 9kg in a month, plus you don’t have to count calories and stuff. Ok so I gave it a try, I am not kidding you it worked!

This is the diet:

Rule 1 avoid “white” Carbs - all Bread, rice, pasta, cereal, potatoes, tortillas and fried food with breading, no dairy at all!

Rule 2 Eat the same few meals over and over again

Rule 3 Don’t drink your calories, just have plenty of water, you can have red wine every night but not white or beer

Rule 4 Don’t eat fruit, sounds crazy because of everything we get told, but get and read the book and find out why its fascinating

Rule 5 (the best rule) take one day off a week, the best rule!

Stick to those rules and it will work I promise. I combined it with cycling 4 times a week to work and back plus a long Sunday ride out. I have lost a total 20kg , feel fitter stronger and I no longer take any medication. I eat spinach like I am Popeye and then on a Saturday I pig out on take-aways beer chocolate and everything else I can lay my hands on, Sunday I weigh myself and I have added 2kg, but by Tuesday I am back down to pre gorge weight. I was at my doctors today and told her I took myself off metformin over a month ago and told her what I have been doing, she didnt seem happy and wants me back in two months to see how its going, she was surprised at how much weight I had lost and how normal my levels were.

I have nothing to do with either the book or Timothy, I am just telling you what worked for me, so good luck if you want to do it, the book is called the 4-hour body by Timothy Ferriss!
 
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Indy51

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Congratulations on your weight loss, but I have to ask whether you are measuring your blood glucose to be sure that this diet is actually helping control it?

If not, I'd seriously suggest your start measuring before your meals and 1-2 hours afterwards. An excellent resource for all thing diabetes is the Blood Sugar 101 website (and book):

http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/index.php

If the diet is also working for your BG control, excellent news on that front too. I'd be worried by the day off and eating anything though - I'd definitely be checking BG levels on that day.
 
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Scandichic

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Congratulations on your weight loss, but I have to ask whether you are measuring your blood glucose to be sure that this diet is actually helping control it?

If not, I'd seriously suggest your start measuring before your meals and 1-2 hours afterwards. An excellent resource for all thing diabetes is the Blood Sugar 101 website (and book):

http://www.phlaunt.com/diabetes/index.php

If the diet is also working for your BG control, excellent news on that front too. I'd be worried by the day off and eating anything though - I'd definitely be checking BG levels on that day.
Have to agree with Indy here. Worried about the potential long term damage you may be doing to yourself on the day off. Would buy meter and measure at start of food and 2 hours after. Would do this for a couple of weeks so that you can look at your levels. Weight loss is awesome - many congrats!
 
A

Avocado Sevenfold

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Rule 2 Eat the same few meals over and over again

I think in the long term, this would get boring and therefore be unsustainable. Maybe that 's just me.
 

Scandichic

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3,708
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Michael Gove and his insane educational? policies!
Rule 2 Eat the same few meals over and over again

I think in the long term, this would get boring and therefore be unsustainable. Maybe that 's just me.
Agreed. Did this with Greek yoghurt and smoked mackerel. Can't eat them at the no'
 

Indy51

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Perth, Western Oz
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I think the same meals over and over is maybe to do with training people to view food as fuel and break the patterns of emotional eating. I've heard other people give the same advice during the weight loss phase - Dr Oz being one.
 
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A

Avocado Sevenfold

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I think the same meals over and over is maybe to do with training people to view food as fuel and break the patterns of emotional eating. I've heard other people give the same advice during the weight loss phase - Dr Oz being one.
I see your point.
 

Dingerbel

Newbie
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2
hi and thanks for your replies, yes I do check my blood, certainly not as regular as that as I really dont feel the need to, I did when I first started on the diet and exercise, but really no longer feel the need. 2 hours after meals is what I normally do now and I have never been outside the ranges of 80 - 115 mg/dl (4.7 -6.3 mmol/l). A HbA1c latest result of 5.3

As for the same meals, well to be honest, yes I suppose it could get boring if you dont have the imagination to change it up a little for yourself. You can eat egg, fish, chicken, beef, pork, veggies of all types, salad and lots of beans and lentils. And as long as you dont deep fat fry em, cook em how you want!

As I said, this really isn't advice I am giving here, I am just saying what has worked for me, if you feel you wanna give it a try and see if it works for you, then crack on, otherwise, dont bother and good luck with whatever works for you!
 
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mysterylady

Active Member
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33
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Hi thanks for this post I think ill give this a try im sure mine would improve to with weight loss I know my symptoms improved last time I lost weight
So glad you've found what works for you
 
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runner2009

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I've been following Timothy Ferris since prior to being a diabetic and being a diabetic.

I can attest to the weight loss Dingebel says is possible.

When I was diagnosed my a1c was 13.6 and I had lost so much muscle I could hardly walk.

I started out following a consistent carb diet of 2 servings if any type of carb at each meal.

As I got fitter I moved more towards Dr.Bernstein's diet without the fat and basically no high density carbos with no or very little dairy - TF believes diary is contributor to fat gain.

My last 2 A1c have been 4.9 going from 50 units of 75/25 down to about 6 units per day.

I became fitter but was unable to gain back my muscle so I began to follow TF's program as outlined in his 4 Hour Body and have put on about 8lbs of muscle without increasing my waist size

I don't follow his diet 100% because the beans and lentils shoot my BG, but TF has said that he recommends beans and lentils because without them he has wayless long term compliance with his program.

TF is a true citizen scientists and has hooked himself up with a CGM to monitor his BG after eating different foods to either optimize fat loss or muscle gain.

He also recommends ingesting 30grams of protein within 30-minutes of waking up for maximum fat loss and muscle gain - might not be a good idea for some diabetics?

One of his recommendations that TF has concerning the 1-day a week carbo feast day is to do exercise prior to eating so that the muscles are 'primed' to uptake the glucose.

He has you go to the restroom and do sets of squats, and wall pushups - I've added jumping jacks.

I agree that there is something here for diabetics - the kettle ball swing is brilliant - and his philosophy is minimal effort or medicines for the maximum results.

IMO, we as diabetics have to be cognitive that what works for non diabetics may not work for us.

Also, the disease is ever changing and I believe that for best long term results is that we continually test our BG before and at the minimum of after every meal.

I would highly recommend his book but remember too it has a target audience for 20 to 30 something male hence the full title of the book The 4 – Hour Body | An uncommon guide to rapid fat-loss, incredible Sex, and becoming Super Human.

Sent from the Diabetes Forum App
 
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mysterylady

Active Member
Messages
33
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Diet only
I've been following Timothy Ferris since prior to being a diabetic and being a diabetic.

I can attest to the weight loss Dingebel says is possible.

When I was diagnosed my a1c was 13.6 and I had lost so much muscle I could hardly walk.

I started out following a consistent carb diet of 2 servings if any type of carb at each meal.

As I got fitter I moved more towards Dr.Bernstein's diet without the fat and basically no high density carbos with no or very little dairy - TF believes diary is contributor to fat gain.

My last 2 A1c have been 4.9 going from 50 units of 75/25 down to about 6 units per day.

I became fitter but was unable to gain back my muscle so I began to follow TF's program as outlined in his 4 Hour Body and have put on about 8lbs of muscle without increasing my waist size

I don't follow his diet 100% because the beans and lentils shoot my BG, but TF has said that he recommends beans and lentils because without them he has wayless long term compliance with his program.

TF is a true citizen scientists and has hooked himself up with a CGM to monitor his BG after eating different foods to either optimize fat loss or muscle gain.

He also recommends ingesting 30grams of protein within 30-minutes of waking up for maximum fat loss and muscle gain - might not be a good idea for some diabetics?

One of his recommendations that TF has concerning the 1-day a week carbo feast day is to do exercise prior to eating so that the muscles are 'primed' to uptake the glucose.

He has you go to the restroom and do sets of squats, and wall pushups - I've added jumping jacks.

I agree that there is something here for diabetics - the kettle ball swing is brilliant - and his philosophy is minimal effort or medicines for the maximum results.

IMO, we as diabetics have to be cognitive that what works for non diabetics may not work for us.

Also, the disease is ever changing and I believe that for best long term results is that we continually test our BG before and at the minimum of after every meal.

I would highly recommend his book but remember too it has a target audience for 20 to 30 something male hence the full title of the book The 4 – Hour Body | An uncommon guide to rapid fat-loss, incredible Sex, and becoming Super Human.

Sent from the Diabetes Forum App
Hi Runner
Does your cholesterol go up when your on the low carb high fat diet Id assume that it would do, im thinking of trying this out but Its like it goes against all were taught on how to lose weight I haven't read the book that you talked about but I looked at a site called LCHF for beginners Diet Doctor and its pretty much saying what you are saying its saying don't use any low fat things eat cheese n butter and things high in fat
http://www.dietdoctor.com/lchf if you have time would you have a look at the site and tell me if its on the same lines as what you were saying

thanks michelle
 

zand

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I have found that my cholesterol went down when I was eating LCHF. I am much less hungry when I eat full fat butter. milk, cheese even lard etc, therefore the diet is easier to stick to than most. It does take a bit of getting used to though.
 
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mysterylady

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Hi Zand thanks for replying its crazy isn't it to think that I could be better off eating the full fat things I love butter to but haven't had any for weeks instead ive been having the proactive that is supposed to lower cholesterol Im sure the diabetes nurse I see on Thursday is going to tell me to do the complete opposite does your doctor know your on a LCHF diet and are they ok about that
 

zand

Master
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10,798
Type of diabetes
Type 2
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Diet only
Hi Zand thanks for replying its crazy isn't it to think that I could be better off eating the full fat things I love butter to but haven't had any for weeks instead ive been having the proactive that is supposed to lower cholesterol Im sure the diabetes nurse I see on Thursday is going to tell me to do the complete opposite does your doctor know your on a LCHF diet and are they ok about that
No. my doctor doesn't know. I have been type 2 for 3 and 1/2 years. I had been trying to stave off diabetes for some time, but finally succumbed to it when a heart problem meant I couldn't do much exercise - even a short walk was a problem. I went to my nurse shortly after being diagnosed with type 2. I was given the booklet from diabetes UK. I read it and had a problem in that I didn't agree that eating wholemeal carbs was a good idea. I also like to eat lots of portions of veg, so the standard info about that didn't impress me either. The worst thing was that diet fizzy drinks were mentioned as a good option to regular fizzy drinks. I had read a few books about insulin resistance and searched a few websites too - enough to convince me that all those sources were correct and this booklet was wrong. So I promptly filed it and got back to doing what I had tried to do before, which was LCHF.

In September last year (3 years after diagnosis) my GP did blood tests and told me that out of 300 diabetic patients, my results were by far the best. He wished all his patients were like me and that he didn't know what I was doing. but whatever it was , it was working. I started to tell him, but he wasn't interested. So he still doesn't know.

Sadly, things have gone a bit awry since then. I had a nasty chest infection, then broke my sternum and a rib (watching football!) then had a minor operation and I have let things slip a bit with the LCHF. I am getting back to it, but have asked my GP for metformin to help me with my BG's

As regards cholesterol, I haven't got any hard facts to hand, but I know the NHS guidelines are too strict because they are pushing statins. So many people try to lower their cholesterol when they really don't need to. Cholesterol is perfectly natural and is produced by the body and necessary for good health, particularly heart health. Low Cholesterol is far worse than high.
 
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mysterylady

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Hi Zand
you've done really great doing it your own way and it proves that it does work, im not surprised that the doctor didn't let you continue saying how you had done it im afraid a lot of doctors don't want to stray from what they have been taught and led to believe its about time that they did surveys on the different ways of treating diabetes I know when I left the surgery after being diagnosed I was given a healthy eating menu and it was saying bread for breakfast n for lunch I thought that's not going to do for me I've always felt that I put weight on when I eat bread before I was diagnosed I was trying to eat healthy n having Weetabix no sugar n skimmed milk for breakfast n crisp bread with cottage cheese n tomato lunch or a sandwich and a normal dinner and couldn't lose any weight turns out I was doing my self harm by having all those carbs
no wonder you had let things slip after all you've been through recently How are you feeling now are you over your operation and doing well again on your eating plan
 
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zand

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Yes, I am feeling fine now, thank you. The big problem was that I needed to eat a high carb low fibre diet for one day, 2 days before the op. Since then I have found it hard to get back on track. I am starting again, and am on day 3 and already have more energy. I am eating more fruit than I would normally though, just until I get back into it again. I have another appointment with my GP in 2 weeks time, when he gets back from his holiday.
 
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mysterylady

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Hi Zand
What kind of things would you be eating for breakfast lunch and dinner
I was diagnosed 2 weeks ago and have cut. Almost all carbs out and trying to stay on a low calorie diet which is bad for me I think because I e just been reading about it and it says that if u cut ur carbs out you have to add Fat to get your energy or else you put your self in starvation mode so would help me if I knew what things other people would be having
 

zand

Master
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10,798
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Well, I have a problem with breakfast, because I don't like eggs. But the old - fashioned bacon, egg, sausage, mushrooms, tomato is ideal. Just no bread or potato or fruit juice. I have bubble and squeak, but with mixed veg, no potatoes, or maybe bacon and tomatoes.

For lunch (I am at home) I have soup, or salad, or veg. Others on the forum will be a bit more helpful to you on this subject as I am a fussy eater and not very imaginative!

Sorry!
 
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Spiker

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hi and thanks for your replies, yes I do check my blood, certainly not as regular as that as I really dont feel the need to, I did when I first started on the diet and exercise, but really no longer feel the need. 2 hours after meals is what I normally do now and I have never been outside the ranges of 80 - 115 mg/dl (4.7 -6.3 mmol/l). A HbA1c latest result of 5.3

You seriously have a BG below 6.3, 2 hours after an all you can eat takeaway binge?

I suspect that the "day off" might be a part of the TF diet that doesn't apply to diabetics.
 

runner2009

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333
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San Francisco
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Hi mysterylady

Yes, my LDL shot up when I started the diet, but remember that I was eating mostly Monounsaturated fats, and I eat no dairy including butter. I also do not use any oils in my meals and the oils I get are from mostly vegetable products like avocados, nuts seeds and olives.

I basically follow a combination between Dr. Bernstein's and Timothy Ferris' 4-hour Body diet. I too can't believe eating saturated fats in large amounts is good for you. So I practice portion control ( or try too ).

According to what I've read and I am not saying it is true it is the combination of high density carbs and saturated fats that cause the problem, so by eliminating high density carbs from your diet saturated fats are ok.

I just don't think they know - look at coconut oil it was first bad for you, then it is good for because it is like mothers milk and now they did a study where they say it ages you because it affect the cell telomeres http://wodmasters.com/crossfit-nutrition-saturated-fat/

I believe we have to accept that we are diabetics and carbohydrates, especially high density carbohydrates are bad for most of us and we have to accept that if we want good BG control we can't eat them. So we have to eat something else, but because of our diabetes we have issues with kidney disease and cardiovascular disease so we have to watch our fats and proteins.

The other issue is that our disease is always changing because it is progressing or in remission because of our life style changes or who knows what. So we have to monitor and test and test and adjust.

For me to continue to lose weight I have to constantly food journal and measure otherwise the food creeps up. So if I do eat fats - which I am now doing - I practice strict portion control and moderation and spend the money on free range meats and organic butters.

So again my diet would be boring to most - no dairy - except for a little cream in my coffee and butter occasionally on popcorn, no oils, no high density proteins or grains. Lots of variety of vegetables at every meal, no sugary fruits except for berries, eggplants, cucumbers. I eat lots of egg whites with veggies, nuts and nut butters and chia seeds and of course fish. Now, I do make braised organic pork belly but eat very little just to satisfy my hunger.

The last thing I believe in is exercise. I believe like Dr. Bernstein that you have to move and get that heart rate up on a daily bases - he believes that getting ones theoretical max heart rate above the maximum is ithe important factor in preventing heart disease and he will work with his patients increasing the rate as slowly as 1-beat per month.

I use it both to get in better shape and for BG control by decreasing my insulin resistance An example last night I reduced my insulin by two units and this morning I woke up with fasting of 127mg/dll . I then did 2 sets of 1:30 minutes of jumping jacks, 20 push ups and 30 kettle ball swings. My BG afterwards was 103mg/dll

When I first got out of Hospital, I could barely walk let alone do a push-up or kettle ball swing, but I stared walking hills, and doing squats and wall push-ups a couple of times a day and slowly over 8-months I got better.

Basically I am a type 1.5 treated like a type 1 ( the diagnostic codes here in the states ) - I think that no mater what I do I will always be on insulin and because I am a diabetic I am different than the non diabetic and I am trying to embrace that fact even though it is a pain in the ass.

Three things I know for sure;I am going to work hard for the rest of my life in keeping my BG as close to normal as I can, through diet and exercise and Meds that have a proven track record and that do not stimulate the beta cells for more insulin production, and second I know for a fact that being a diabetic has prolonged my life because even if I caught this in the pre-diabetic stage, I would not have had the discipline to do what was necessary to be healthy for the duration. thirdly, what works for non-diabetics doesn't necessarily work for diabetics, we are treated as if we are 'normal' people with diabetes, but just like an alcoholic can't have a 'normal' relationship with alcohol, we diabetics can't have a normal relationship with food especially carbs. Embrace that fact and then we can live a normal life ( lol sounding like a zen master here )





Sent from Runner2009 Burt
 
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