Getting hypo alerts with libre, blucon and xDrip+

[Scott-C]

I'm so excited to find this thread! Been using the Libre for yonks but want to tighten my control to avoid making my retinopathy worse. Have just ordered the Nightrider, and an Android phone (i currently use iPhone) and am working my way through the Nightscout instructions... So pleased that I can use this really helpful thread too Does anyone know if I will be able to use my Apple watch for this, either with my iPhone or with the Android phone?

Hi, queenofit, I see it's your first post, so welcome to the forum!

Can you use it with iPhone/Apple watch? Well, yes and no, kind of.

There's three bits involved: libre sensor, blucon transmitter, and the receiving app. All that the transmitter does is read the sensor every 5 mins and then bluetooths it to the app.

I'm running it on an android phone as the app I use to receive from the transmitter, xDrip+, is an android app and simply won't work on iPhone. I also send the results to a non-Apple smartwatch.

But, the blucon makers, Ambrosia Systems make an inhouse app called LinkBluCon. It has an ios version. I'm not familiar with ios, but if you have a look around wherever it is ios people get apps you'll probably find it.

There's some recent tweets from them showing it running on Apple watches:

https://mobile.twitter.com/ambrosia_sys?lang=en

The problem, though, is that although Ambrosia have built a damned good transmitter, their app is kinda basic and nowhere near as good as xDrip+. I haven't looked at linkblucon for a while so don't know what the current state of play with it is - they'd been promising to introduce alerts, don't know if they've done it yet.

So, you will be able to use it on ios and apple watch but will have to rely on an app which is miles behind xdrip.

There is another option, though. There's a guy, Johan DeGraeve, developing an ios version of xdrip. Not being an ios user, I've no idea how good or bad it is but here's the link:
https://github.com/JohanDegraeve

The android set up definitely works well. You might lose the glam of your iPhone, but look on the bright side - you'll be using an extremely sophisticated app which is so underground that it doesn't even have a wikipedia page - how hip is that!?!

It's also good for winding up fitness watch owners. There's a couple at work who go on and on about how theirs measure heart rate, sleeping patterns etc etc, so it's always fun just chucking in, "does it tell you what your bg is? No? Mines does."

Have fun with it - it takes libre into a different league!

 

[queenofit]

Hi, queenofit, I see it's your first post, so welcome to the forum!

Can you use it with iPhone/Apple watch? Well, yes and no, kind of.

There's three bits involved: libre sensor, blucon transmitter, and the receiving app. All that the transmitter does is read the sensor every 5 mins and then bluetooths it to the app.

I'm running it on an android phone as the app I use to receive from the transmitter, xDrip+, is an android app and simply won't work on iPhone. I also send the results to a non-Apple smartwatch.

But, the blucon makers, Ambrosia Systems make an inhouse app called LinkBluCon. It has an ios version. I'm not familiar with ios, but if you have a look around wherever it is ios people get apps you'll probably find it.

There's some recent tweets from them showing it running on Apple watches:

https://mobile.twitter.com/ambrosia_sys?lang=en

The problem, though, is that although Ambrosia have built a damned good transmitter, their app is kinda basic and nowhere near as good as xDrip+. I haven't looked at linkblucon for a while so don't know what the current state of play with it is - they'd been promising to introduce alerts, don't know if they've done it yet.

So, you will be able to use it on ios and apple watch but will have to rely on an app which is miles behind xdrip.

There is another option, though. There's a guy, Johan DeGraeve, developing an ios version of xdrip. Not being an ios user, I've no idea how good or bad it is but here's the link:
https://github.com/JohanDegraeve

The android set up definitely works well. You might lose the glam of your iPhone, but look on the bright side - you'll be using an extremely sophisticated app which is so underground that it doesn't even have a wikipedia page - how hip is that!?!

It's also good for winding up fitness watch owners. There's a couple at work who go on and on about how theirs measure heart rate, sleeping patterns etc etc, so it's always fun just chucking in, "does it tell you what your bg is? No? Mines does."

Have fun with it - it takes libre into a different league!

Thanks so much Scott-C. I'm quite happy to ditch the iPhone and watch if I can get graphs that look like those on this thread! I'm so excited about this!

 

[Scott-C]

Thanks so much Scott-C. I'm quite happy to ditch the iPhone and watch if I can get graphs that look like those on this thread! I'm so excited about this!

Couple of books to help you with that.

Sugar Surfing by Stephen Ponder, and Beyond Fingersticks by William Lee Dubois. Both on kindle. Both are T1, Ponder's an endo, Dubois is a non-qualified diabetes educator. Both have used cgm from the early days. They know what they're talking about.

If you've done DAFNE, you're probably familiar with that idea of, "don't test between meals unless you feel hypo, and save corrections till meals."

With libre/cgm things are changing. Some hospitals are acknowledging that Ponder is right when he says if you can see on your cgm that you're going out of range, fix it now with 1 or 2u, instead of wandering into the next meal out of range and having to do a massive correction dose.

When you get xdrip set up, it's much easier to see inflections in the line and make a judgment call on whether a few g or u are needed. Doesn't always work out as planned, but that unpredictability is why we all love being T1.....

Dubois wrote his book in about 2009, which is like pre-history in cgm terms. There's a bit where he looks into the future and imagines people seeing bg on their phones. We got there!

 

[queenofit]

Couple of books to help you with that.

Sugar Surfing by Stephen Ponder, and Beyond Fingersticks by William Lee Dubois. Both on kindle. Both are T1, Ponder's an endo, Dubois is a non-qualified diabetes educator. Both have used cgm from the early days. They know what they're talking about.

If you've done DAFNE, you're probably familiar with that idea of, "don't test between meals unless you feel hypo, and save corrections till meals."

With libre/cgm things are changing. Some hospitals are acknowledging that Ponder is right when he says if you can see on your cgm that you're going out of range, fix it now with 1 or 2u, instead of wandering into the next meal out of range and having to do a massive correction dose.

When you get xdrip set up, it's much easier to see inflections in the line and make a judgment call on whether a few g or u are needed. Doesn't always work out as planned, but that unpredictability is why we all love being T1.....

Dubois wrote his book in about 2009, which is like pre-history in cgm terms. There's a bit where he looks into the future and imagines people seeing bg on their phones. We got there!

Brilliant - will take a look. Have been educating myself with Dr Bernstein's Diabetes Solution, and am preparing myself for my annual review with the usual argument about me not eating enough carbohydrate, and not worrying that my sugars climb to 21 after eating porridge because I'm back in range by lunch time :/
Thanks for your recommendations and help.

 

[justadad]

Hi,

My son's blucon just arrived . Haven't opened it yet.

We currently use the libre reader and glimp.
I know the blucon uses Bluetooth technology, so it should only recognise bluetooth devices in its vicinity. Now, is there any way that the blucon can send its data to our android phones while we are at work. Or would there be an application to do that?

Thanks!

 

[normsew]

Hi
I have just managed to getXdrip plus and blucon/libre set up after a few hours of playing with the settings. The next step is to upload the readings from XDrip+ to my Nightscout site (Nightscout Sync is the term used in Xdrip+ settings).
However I cannot understand the required format/syntax of the REST-API which has to be entered in the "Base URL" option in settings.
I have tried "https//<mypassword>@<my herouk address.com>/api/V1/ as advised on github, but it doesnt upload results.
Grateful if anyone can advise.
Thanks

 

[Damon_]

If you've done DAFNE, you're probably familiar with that idea of, "don't test between meals unless you feel hypo, and save corrections till meals."

That is the most utter ******** medical advice I have ever heard. I really want to slap whoever says something like this.

I assume this was based on the characteristic of correcting too soon after a meal with IOB to still push you down, but still.

Just educate the people properly on insulincurves and don't let them wander around high indefinitely.

I have (luckily) never heard something like this from any educator when I was diagnosed.

Now, is there any way that the blucon can send its data to our android phones while we are at work. Or would there be an application to do that?

Yes, you can use Nightscout. You have to have a constant connection to the internet to send data to the server though.

Here is the github for Nightscout:

https://github.com/nightscout/cgm-remote-monitor

And the instructions for the setup

https://jamorham.gitbooks.io/xdrip-plus/content/xdrip-plus-nightscout-viewer.html


Cheers!

 

[normsew]

Hi
I have just managed to getXdrip plus and blucon/libre set up after a few hours of playing with the settings. The next step is to upload the readings from XDrip+ to my Nightscout site (Nightscout Sync is the term used in Xdrip+ settings).
However I cannot understand the required format/syntax of the REST-API which has to be entered in the "Base URL" option in settings.
I have tried "https//<mypassword>@<my herouk address.com>/api/V1/ as advised on github, but it doesnt upload results.
Grateful if anyone can advise.
Thanks

Panic over, it is working now, readings being sent to the cloud and visible by all followers. Next step is to set up a closed loop. Has anyone succeeded in doing that?

 

[abcd99]

I like libre a lot, but, as other users will know, the factory calibration can be a bit iffy at times, and there's no hypo/hyper alerts.

However, a few weeks ago, xDrip+ was modified so that it will collect data from Ambrosia System's Blucon Nightrider transmitter.

The Blucon gets placed on top of the libre sensor, then it bluetooths readings every 5 minutes to xDrip+.

That means you can use xDrip+'s various features to calibrate against bg tests, set up hypo/hyper alerts, get predicted low warnings and a whole stack of other things.

I've been using it for a week now, been bg testing a lot more than usual to get a sense of whether I trust it's readings against blood. Have to say I'm pretty impressed with it so far. Being able to calibrate removes a lot of the uncertainties of libre and the alerts are great.

Blucon is a one-off cost of just over £100, runs off a replaceable watch battery, isn't waterproof so needs to be tagged onto the sensor with a plaster to allow removal for showers. The makers say it's warranted for a year but I suspect it'll last longer - it's just a circuit board and nfc reader so I'm not sure there's anything there to wear out. There's a £20 import tax in UK but there's a post somewhere on their facebook page about a way to reclaim that.

xDrip+ is free open source software which is covered by disclaimers saying it's a "use at own risk" gig, but it's used regularly by dexcommers and seems to be widely acknowledged as reliable.

All in all, it's a cheap and cheerful way of getting alerts with libre, so thought I'd mention it for anyone interested in getting alerts without going full dexcom or haven't the technical skills to build limiTTer etc. Not dissing dexcom in any way, I'm sure it's a wonderful product, but for various reasons I decided I didn't want to use it.

Here's a few links for anyone interested in this route:

Blucon can be bought here:
https://www.ambrosiasys.com/

https://m.facebook.com/ambrosiasys/?locale2=en_GB

xDrip+ can be downloaded here:
https://github.com/NightscoutFoundation/xDrip/releases

Thank you very much. It is always useful to remain updated with latest improvised or new devices. Keep sending more posts whenever you will find something better and new. Thanks......Have a nice day.

 

[normsew]

Thank you very much. It is always useful to remain updated with latest improvised or new devices. Keep sending more posts whenever you will find something better and new. Thanks......Have a nice day.

Libre, xdrip+, blucon and smartwatch setup is my choice for a low cost cgm system. All working well so far! Blucon took an age to arrive from the USA. An additional £24 to pay at post office on pick up. £8 post office handling charge is included in that, but £16 VAT reclaim applied for using HMRC form BOR286.

 

[Engineer88]

Libre, xdrip+, blucon and smartwatch setup is my choice for a low cost cgm system. All working well so far! Blucon took an age to arrive from the USA. An additional £24 to pay at post office on pick up. £8 post office handling charge is included in that, but £16 VAT reclaim applied for using HMRC form BOR286.

are you on the facebook group Androidaps or Looped?

Closing ithe loop is possible if you have the right pump, I'm in process of doing so now.

 

[normsew]

are you on the facebook group Androidaps or Looped?

Closing ithe loop is possible if you have the right pump, I'm in process of doing so now.

No I was not aware of those FB groups,
I will look them up today, many thanks.
My next aim is to get "autotune" up and running!

 

[Wannabeflatliner]

Quick question for you nightriders! When entering the start date of the sensor in xdrip+, do you put the date when you've installed the sensor on your arm or the date when you activate it (usually 24h after). Which one gives you the most accurate results?

 

[normsew]

I think the date entered simply acts as a record so that xdrip can show how many days of the 14 are left. I don't think it has any effect on the accuracy. I always start sensor as soon as it is on my arm. I have never waited 24 hours to activate. Accuracy is generally good from the start.

 

[justadad]

I managed to secure the blucon on the libre sensor, install xdrip+, set the master and followers. Love it! Works great, with a couple of calibrations.

But, I can't figure out where do you enter bolus and basal. I guess the predictions xdrip gives me are not quite correct because I only enter values for the insulin given. The syringe icon on top right only asks you to enter the dose, it doesn't ask whether it is bolus or basal. Couldn't find anything in the settings section. Any suggestions?

Many thanks!

 

[normsew]

I managed to secure the blucon on the libre sensor, install xdrip+, set the master and followers. Love it! Works great, with a couple of calibrations.

But, I can't figure out where do you enter bolus and basal. I guess the predictions xdrip gives me are not quite correct because I only enter values for the insulin given. The syringe icon on top right only asks you to enter the dose, it doesn't ask whether it is bolus or basal. Couldn't find anything in the settings section. Any suggestions?

Many thanks!

I beleive that insulin data for display on XDrip+ has to be downloaded from a Nightscout account in the colud, if you have one set up. I think that the Nightscout insulin data has to be read from either a Dexcom or Medtronic sensor and then sent to Nightscout. You will see in the Nightscout "cloud upload" setting that there is an option to download information from Nightscout. The route for the data would therefore be....sensor > Nightscout > XDrip+
Data to nightscout from a pump can be backfilled by connecting your Medtronic 600 series pump using the Android app available here:
https://github.com/pazaan/600SeriesAndroidUploader/wiki
So many options!

 

[justadad]

I think that the Nightscout insulin data has to be read from either a Dexcom or Medtronic sensor and then sent to Nightscout

Thanks for that! We are on the libre, would the same procedure apply?

 

[Scott-C]

But, I can't figure out where do you enter bolus and basal.

I just run it on my phone, have no need for remote viewing, so don't know what Nighscout offers for basal entries. As far as I can see, if it's just run on the phone and not remotely, I think it's just set up for bolus shots as those are tied into the predictions, but, as you've recognised, you'd need to enter carbs as well for those to be worthwhile.

The predictions are quite useful! I've never used bolus wizards, but sometimes it's useful to enter bolus/carbs, see how that might pan out, and cancel if it's not looking right - like a visual bolus wizard. I just always bear in mind that the predictions are only that - educated guesses and might play out differently as more sensor info is added in every 5 mins.

I don't think you can enter basal shots via the syringe icon. But there's a treatment note icon just below it which I suppose could be used for that purpose, along with food notes, general comments.

 

[justadad]

I don't think you can enter basal shots via the syringe icon. But there's a treatment note icon just below it which I suppose could be used for that purpose, along with food notes, general comments.

Thanks for that, @Scott-C.
Note icon better than nothing My son is on novomix, so there is always carbs and insulin to enter. Thanks again!

 

[gardener612]

I like libre a lot, but, as other users will know, the factory calibration can be a bit iffy at times, and there's no hypo/hyper alerts.

However, a few weeks ago, xDrip+ was modified so that it will collect data from Ambrosia System's Blucon Nightrider transmitter.

The Blucon gets placed on top of the libre sensor, then it bluetooths readings every 5 minutes to xDrip+.

That means you can use xDrip+'s various features to calibrate against bg tests, set up hypo/hyper alerts, get predicted low warnings and a whole stack of other things.

I've been using it for a week now, been bg testing a lot more than usual to get a sense of whether I trust it's readings against blood. Have to say I'm pretty impressed with it so far. Being able to calibrate removes a lot of the uncertainties of libre and the alerts are great.

Blucon is a one-off cost of just over £100, runs off a replaceable watch battery, isn't waterproof so needs to be tagged onto the sensor with a plaster to allow removal for showers. The makers say it's warranted for a year but I suspect it'll last longer - it's just a circuit board and nfc reader so I'm not sure there's anything there to wear out. There's a £20 import tax in UK but there's a post somewhere on their facebook page about a way to reclaim that.

xDrip+ is free open source software which is covered by disclaimers saying it's a "use at own risk" gig, but it's used regularly by dexcommers and seems to be widely acknowledged as reliable.

All in all, it's a cheap and cheerful way of getting alerts with libre, so thought I'd mention it for anyone interested in getting alerts without going full dexcom or haven't the technical skills to build limiTTer etc. Not dissing dexcom in any way, I'm sure it's a wonderful product, but for various reasons I decided I didn't want to use it.

Here's a few links for anyone interested in this route:

Blucon can be bought here:
https://www.ambrosiasys.com/

https://m.facebook.com/ambrosiasys/?locale2=en_GB

xDrip+ can be downloaded here:
https://github.com/NightscoutFoundation/xDrip/releases

That must be really convenient. Since adopting low carb, I find meals take a lot more preparation and it gets in the way of living! Also, eating out of the house is much harder. Not sure I could follow your system though, as I am coming to the conclusion that fasting raises my bg.

fasting raises your bg because when u fast and have t2d you not only have to take into account the carbs your body has not used and has stored as glycogen but all the excess lean protein you have ingested (which is high levels of protein to low levels of saturated fat) that your body has not used to repair itself and goes through a process called gluconeogenesis where the body makes glucose out of amino acids, mainly leucine, isoleucine, glutamine and turns them into glucose and stored.This is not a problem if you are not t2d or for your postprandial meal. It only comes into effect for a type 2 diabetic when your bg becomes low and your pancreas releases a hormone called glucagon which activates the sugar stored in your liver (glycogen) to be released. This keeps you from going hypo during sleep. The only problem is that your body does not know that your t2d and releases a copious amount of sugar at one time that a t2d can not readily handle.This is why,probably your bg is spiking. Watch carbs more than sugar because sugar is burned quickly and not stored. Becareful of high intakes of protein especially lean protein such as octopus and shellfish, most seafood.