Have you cured or reversed type 2

donquinn,

I will not use the words "reversed" or "cured" insofar as my type 2 diabetes is concerned. I will always be a diabetic. What I have been saying is that "I have been enjoying life like I have no diabetes."

When I was diagnosed as a type 2 in July 1991, my diagnosis fasting blood sugar reading was 468 mg/dl. I was required to be on several anti-diabetes pills. I refused to take them. Our family physician then required me to take a stress test. As soon as I passed it, he said something like this: "Now you can try to kill yourself by exercising."

Exercise I did every day by running the stairs 4x/day (before each meal and before bedtime). After 16.5 years, I gave up stair-running because I started to feel pain in both knees. I did not like to have knee replacements. So I switched to power-walking indoor, jogging in place, and modified push-ups.

The foods I have been eating are real ones: heart-healthy, natural, fresh (raw or cooked), unprocessed, and whole (most of them being carbohydrates).

Strictly speaking, I have not been treating my diabetes. What I have actually been doing for 22 years is to exercise as much and as hard as I can and to eat the right foods to be healthy, strong, happy, and have a long life.

So far so good. I have no diabetes complications yet, never had any hypoglycemic problems, and have been enjoying life like I have no diabetes.

Bonny Damocles
Male, 77 1/2 years old, 139 lbs., 5'7"
Daily exercise is my only anti-diabetes (4x/day)
Carbohydrates have caused my blood sugar levels go high 4x/day (fasting and 2 hours after each meal)
Past A1c's: 5.2% to 6.3%

YES!

In 2004 I had ballooned to 24 stone, ate too much & drank too much beer, could not be physically active,was depressed and thought I would soon be dead. An article in the Daily Mail informed me of the operation and its benefits.
The NHS offered me bariatric surgery but NICE guidlines said I was too old at just 61.
I took my redundancy money and, after careful research on the web, had a lap Duodenal Switch operation in Belgium by a world-renowned surgeon (Dr Jacques Himpens).
He removed my appendix, gallbladder c/w stones, 75% of my stomach, switch the bowel connections and shortened my common channel to 1 metre. 4 days in hospital, then home. I went from 24 stone down to 11 stone in a few months. I had been injecting 300 units of human insulin daily and had a restricted driving licence. Only needed 2 injections after the op - then no medication ever for diabetes type 2. The medical consultants and GP in England confirmed that I no longer had diabetes and the DVLA reinstated my full driving licence. My glucose levels remain consistant @ 5.7 mmol, whether before a meal or soon after. I can have sugar in my coffee again, eat sweets etc.
The downside is that I still have ED, neuropathy in my feet, diarrhea if I ingest too much fats - but I can now live almost normally and am very active. My wife could not cope with the new me and divorced me within 3 years.
Since then I have suffered Angina, a Heart Attack and amputation of 2 toes which had ulcerated and developed Osteomyelitis - a result of my Diabetic Neuropathy the surgeon said.
I ONLY WISH I HAD KNOWN OF THIS OPERATION 20 YEARS EARLIER!!!!!!

hi just joined the forum i was diagnosed in December 2011 and was put on medication [glicazide] and told i would be on it for the rest of my life so i got my finger out and changed my life, i was taken off the tablets after 4 weeks and lost nearly 5 stone in a year 6 months on i've just completed a 10k trail run in grasmere cumbria and raised £300 for diabetes uk while i was busy lol :clap: i'm not cured but live my life in a good way and my last two tests have been 35 and 36 i won't let this disease beat me or get me down and neither should anyone else just live a good healthy life style and you can keep it at bay, dunk x

alandbailey said:

The NHS offered me bariatric surgery but NICE guidlines said I was too old at just 61.
I took my redundancy money and, after careful research on the web, had a lap Duodenal Switch operation in Belgium by a world-renowned surgeon (Dr Jacques Himpens).
.....
I ONLY WISH I HAD KNOWN OF THIS OPERATION 20 YEARS EARLIER!!!!!!

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The observation that patients with diabetes who underwent baryatric surgery had the diabetes reversed was unexpected. It was as a result of that, that Lim et al tried to replicate calorie restriction with a fasting diet.

But, glad to hear that, despite the difficulties from the complication you're still operational and in relatively good cheer by the sounds of it. Good on you. A good positive attitude is always of help too.

bigdunk said:

i've just completed a 10k trail run in grasmere cumbria

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I'd rather do some trout fishing on Esthwaite Water and then go to the Red Lion in Hawkshead. The trouble with Grasmere is its hard to resist Gingerbread:



It's as spikey as Kendal Mintcake.

Ooh mental kint cake

Yorksman said:

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I've half a mind to report this post ! decidedly pornographic... :shock:

stuffedolive said:

Idecidedly pornographic... :shock:

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psst, want some live action hardcore?



Must dash, need to score some smarties down the bus station

And I thought it was glue sniffing that was bad for you

I have heard of Diacare which is Nutritional Supplement cures the pancreas, did anybody try? [commercial link removed]

vivek412 said:

I have heard of Diacare which is Nutritional Supplement cures the pancreas, did anybody try? [commercial link removed]

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That's rather expensive. Cheaper to take Fenugree or for a similar and cheaper alternative Vitabiotics Diabetone , I take both and buy the latter from the vitabiotics website, one a day and you get 3 for 2 . I take omega 3, so don't need their plus version:

[commercial link removed]

I really hope so.

I was told in december i had type 2. Bloods up at 12.9.

3 months later with 2 and a half stone off my bloods were at 5.7.

Was intrested to see how my medication and bloods would change if i stopped taking metformin. Done this about a month ago and started eating normally. Carbs chocolate etc.

Got my blood results yesterday. Thinking they were going to be very high and it was at 5.0.

Surely proof that it is possible.

Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

Hi,Jmorell1989

That is really good news and well done.

You must have worked hard to loose that amount of weight in 3 months.

Do you feel that your weight might start to rise now that your eating what you call normal. (In moderation is probably best).

I am on a weird diet (kind of vegan) which has kept me in good control, now I would be worried to start on normal food in case I loose control.

Roy.

No i weigh my self every other day.
Just to keep track. Extra pound put on an ill do somemore exercise th following day. Yeah. Since january the 7th to now i have lost 3 and a half stone. Buying a treadmill an some weights has defienetly been a great buy. In from work and on it. Lot better than going to a sweaty gym haha.
Sent from the Diabetes Forum App

I have not myself, but my son who is in his 40's appears to have, or at the very least has drastically changed his treatment and outlook.
He was type 2 and grossly overweight requiring both tablets and insulin.
He joined a GP led gym fitness scheme and lost a considerable amount of weight. His food intake decreased substantially, and he stopped drinking alcohol completely. He now exercises regularly, in the gym, cycling and dog walking.
I do not know whether or not he has been 'cured', but he has not required tablets or insulin for many months, even when he has let his regime lapse.

Cure or reverse type II diabetes? It's all down to semantics, if you define Type II diabetes as meaning elevated blood sugar readings then the answer is yes.
However, if you define Type II diabetes as meaning impaired production of insulin by the pancreas and the resistance of the body to use the insulin, thereby leading to elevated blood sugar readings, then the answer is no.
What we can do is bring our blood sugar readings down by amending our diet and increasing our exercise levels so that we require less insulin and remove any superfluous adipose, especially from the waistline, because this seems to be related to the body's ability to use insulin.

Many here state reversal cannot occur as beta cells are destroyed to a certain level before diagnosis. They may be interested that one of the foremost authorities in diabetes Prof Gerald H Tomkin of the Diabetes Institute of Ireland disagrees and here with selected quotes is why:

"Prof Gerald H Tomkins can now tell many of his patients that weight reduction and exercise may lead to the reversal of their diabetes through recovery of their beta cells.
A recent study has shown a significant β-cell loss in large islets of type 2 diabetes with changes in the architecture. Thus, unlike type 1 diabetes, it is possible that changes are repairable long after the diabetes has started
Reversing diabetes
The final result that made me and many others sit up and take notice was the demonstration that the beta cell recovered not partially, but completely and even the first-phase insulin release returned to normal, so the patients really did reverse their diabetes. This article was of such interest that it made headlines in daily newspapers around the world.
Alas, I am no longer able to reassure my obese patients with diabetes that their main problem is a defect in the beta cell. I am, however, able to assure the obese patient that in many cases, weight reduction and exercise will lead to reversal of their diabetes through recovery of their beta cells."
http://www.imt.ie/clinical/2012/07/type-2-diabetes-%E2%80%94-is-it-a-disease-of-the-fat-cell.html
Professor Tomkin is a graduate of Trinity College Dublin. He trained as physician in General Medicine, Diabetes and Endocrinology. His special research interests are in the field of lipidology (cholesterol and triglycerides), atherosclerosis and diabetes.
He has written more than 100 papers in international peer-reviewed journals and has been invited to speak at many international meetings.
He has been president of the Association of Physicians of Great Britain and Ireland, vice president of the European Association for the Study of Diabetes and president of the Irish Endocrine Society and Irish Hyperlipidaemia associations.
He is past Chairman, and now President of the Diabetes Federation of Ireland. He is Director of the Diabetes Institute of Ireland at Beacon.

Also:
"Keith Frayn, professor of human metabolism at Oxford University, said: "For many years, doctors have believed that type-2 diabetes is a lifelong condition: It can be treated, but not cured.

"In the last few years, that idea has been disproved"


Moral of the story - don't accept as fact the opinion of people on here with varying levels of education and motivations. Research for yourself, email experts in their field and you will find out much more of this changing picture and maybe you will listen and cure yourself. Unfortunately you will still have to read all the condescending comments on here telling you "well done but you have not reversed it" It is the equivalent of telling someone who has lost 10 stone that they are still obese as they will probably put it on again. I was diagnosed 6 mths ago and have lost 4stone, I passed an OGTT with a 2hr reading of 4.3 nobody will tell me I still have diabetes as I don't. What I do have is a propensity to get diabetes at a certain level of visceral fat. I will never get that fat again therefore I am cured. Others may lose it and get it back again it is all a question of willpower/exercise and healthy eating. It always was.

This might be true for those T2 diabetics who are overweight but what about those like me who were not overweight at diagnosis but who have still lost a significant amount of weight anyway through a change in diet (in my case almost 2 stone) and I now weigh only 6st 10lb but I still struggle to keep my BG between 7 and 8. I think it may depend on whether you are insulin resistant or insulin deficient.

Roy Taylor, Professor of Medicine and Metabolism at Newcastle also states that the supposed inevitable progressive loss of beta cell function can be halted and the remaining cells restored to normality but, what has been totally lost is lost and so the tipping point, from non diabetic to diabetic has changed for the specific individual. Researchers are always dealing with unknowns with type 2 diabetes. What is the tipping point and why is it different for different individuals and the second unknown, what is the extent of beta cell loss and how can it be accurately estimated? From his 2008 paper:


Pathogenesis of type 2 diabetes: tracing the reverse route from cure to cause.
"Fatty liver causes resistance to insulin suppression of hepatic glucose output as well as raised plasma triacylglycerol. Exposure of beta cells to increased levels of fatty acids, derived from circulating and locally deposited triacylglycerol, suppresses glucose-mediated insulin secretion. This is reversible initially, but eventually becomes permanent. The essential time sequence of the pathogenesis of type 2 diabetes is now evident. Muscle insulin resistance determines the rate at which fatty liver progresses, and ectopic fat deposition in liver and islet underlies the related dynamic defects of hepatic insulin resistance and beta cell dysfunction. These defects are capable of dramatic reversal under hypoenergetic feeding conditions, completely in early diabetes and to a worthwhile extent in more established disease."

As individuals however, we just get told we have diabetes. No attempt is made to quantify the loss of beta cell function at the time of diagnosis.

Cinderella said:

This might be true for those T2 diabetics who are overweight but what about those like me who were not overweight at diagnosis but who have still lost a significant amount of weight anyway through a change in diet (in my case almost 2 stone) and I now weigh only 6st 10lb but I still struggle to keep my BG between 7 and 8. I think it may depend on whether you are insulin resistant or insulin deficient.

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This is one of the major problems in working out what causes diabetes. The correlation between body mass index and susceptibility to diabetes is not a good one and other factors, probably genetic, are likely involved. It's one reason why some researchers don't claim a cure because, without an understanding of the cause, there cannot be an assessment. Most work with diabetes is work on the symptoms and effects of the disease