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Help!!

J

Jillyfl

Well-Known Member
Messages
100
Type of diabetes
LADA
Treatment type
Insulin
Dislikes
Swimming
Hello, I am newly diagnosed and 4 weeks in on 500mg of Metformin twice a day. I can’t get my sugar levels down. I eat like a monk and have read what others eat and their levels are around 5.0. They eat pasta, chocolate etc !! I make all my meals from scratch and made the Irish stew with colcannon which is featured in the recipes on here. There were potatoes in it but I thought it must be ok as it is featured in Diabetes UK. It sent my sugar levels to 15.5. I was furious that a recipe from here should do this to me.

I start my day with a bowl of unsweetened porridge and a handful of berries and dollop of cultured milk . My lunch is a whole meal roll (my only carbs of the day). Filled with ham or egg or salad and a piece of fruit such as a pear or a peach (never bananas or grapes)Dinner is typically chicken or some meat and vegetables, no potatoes. I never eat desserts or sweet thing or any in between snacks . What am I doing wrong? My levels after dinner yesterday were 11.2.

How long does it take to get sugar levels under control?
 
Hi,

Welcome to the forum.

In laymans terms. Yer root veg are carbs. They turn to blood sugar.. Porridge? Carbs.. Pears peaches. Sucrose. Sugar.. Your wholemeal roll? Carbs. All can raise the BG. If you are unfortunate regarding metabolism..?

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Though great if you can handle them. As a diabetic.? They need consideration before digesting...

Tagging in @daisy1 for a fact sheet..

Also,tagging in @Rachox @Bluetit1802 @bulkbiker @

Hope this helps.
 
Welcome to the forum @Jillyfl - I'm sorry to hear how frustrated you are but can easily understand.

Firstly - the recipe you tried sounds like it was pretty high in carbs which would explain the high post prandial reading. It's important to note that not every user of this site chooses to eat low carb (many are insulin users or choose other methods of control) so I expect that they try to provide recipes for everyone.

The rest of your days meals also contain quite a few carbs as well - porridge, fruit, some types of veg - so unless you're eating very small portions you are bound to see higher numbers. Metformin will make a little difference but not as much as some of the other, more powerful drugs.

I see @Jaylee has tagged @daisy1 for a fact sheet & some other experienced members for their advice so I'll leave off here but feel free to ask questions.
 
Hi, welcome

Frustrating isnt it, you are doing great, keep researching.

You may need to be philosophical, patient, determined and brave for a while longer

Best wishes
 

Hi and welcome to the forum,

First of all this forum and website is diabetes.co.uk . There is another website called diabetes.org.uk. I think you may be mixing them up. The diabetes.org.uk does not advocate a low carb diet, and all their recipes are far too carb laden for those of us trying to control this condition on diet only or just Metformin. The website we are now talking on, diabetes.co.uk does advocate low carb.

One excellent website that will help you is dietdoctor.
This page is a starter page
https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/60-seconds
and this page gives a simple food list
https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/foods#foodlist
There are plenty of delicious recipes on there.

If I were you I would cut out the porridge, at least until you are confident in what you are doing and reduce your levels enough to experiment. Porridge, whether unsweetened or not, has far too many carbs in it. Perhaps change to anything eggy. Omelettes, scrambled, boiled, poached, however you like them. (no bread). Bacon and egg is good. You can add a tomato, or mushrooms, or cheese. Some people just have a coffee with double cream for breakfast. Some people have a full fat yogurt with 2 or 3 strawberries or a few raspberries or blackberries. Or just cold meats and cheese. There are plenty of options.

Instead of the roll for lunch, just have the fillings, ham, eggs, salad. Be very careful of fruit - it is high in sugar. Berries are by far the best choice, and should be eaten with FF yogurt or cream. If you must have bread, then shop around for some low carb loaves. Personally I have half a slice of Burgen Soya and Linseed (Sainsburys and Tesco). There are others available. I believe Live-Life is one.

Test before you eat then again 2 hours after first bite and keep a food diary. Look at the rise from before to after. Thuis should ideally be under 2 mmol/, preferably less. More than that and there were too many carbs for your body to cope with.
 
Hi jilly and welcome.
First I shall just clarify something for you, this Forum is part of the diabetes.co.uk website where loads of us control our diabetes with low carb eating, the recipe you found which I believe is this one: https://www.diabetes.org.uk/guide-to-diabetes/recipes/irish-stew-and-colcannon is on the Diabetes.org.uk which is Diabetes U.K. They follow the NHS Eatwell plate which is not low carb.
Here is some info about low carb diets to read:
https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb
Looking at the meals you’ve listed there are some high carb foods there, potatoes, porridge, bread (yes even wholemeal), peaches and pears. Metformin alone does very little. It would be good if you could calculate the grams of carbs you are actually eating. I started by keeping under 100g/day 17 months ago when I was diagnosed but now keep to under 50g/day.

Edit to add, sorry I got sidetracked mid typing and didn’t see Bluetit’s post so I’ve repeated a lot of the same!
 
Hi!

Normally I have a little more time to type, but here goes the short version: As a T2 you can't process carbs anymore. You see, all carbs not just straight sugars but starches too, once ingested, turn to glucose. And when you have insulin resistance and/or depleted insulin production as us T2's do, that glucose doesn't leave the bloodstream again effectively. It just keeps floating around in there, doing damage. And what your eating may be a monk's diet, it's also carb-heavy and absolutely wrong for a T2. (I'm so sorry!) I'm not sure if you went to the diabetes.ORG.uk website for the recipies, but you're on diabetes.CO.uk right now: and most people here have reduced carbs or cancelled them out completely to get into remission. I have. My HbA1c is non-diabetic, and has been since three months into my diagnosis 2 years ago. So yes, it can indeed be done, just not when eating rolls, potatoes and porridge, I'm afraid. Bread, cereals, rice, corn, potatoes, pasta and fruit (save for berries and avocado) are all high in carbs and you really want to avoid those. Meat, fish, above ground veggies and leafy greens, extra dark chocolate, butter, full fat greek yoghurt, eggs, double cream etc are low in carbs and won't spike your bloodsugars. Try it: If you test before a meal and 2 hours after first bite, you shouldn't go up more than 2.0 Mmol/l. Otherwise it's a spike that's no good for you. Meals could look like this: Eggs and bacon with mushrooms and cheese (or cherry tomatoes, or sausages), lunch a green salad with tuna, capers, olives, mayo and avocado and dinner meat or fish with cauliflower rice (wich it insanely versatile), to which I tend to add more bacon and cheese. Snacks can be walnuts or pecans, cheese, olives, extra dark chocolate... That way I got my T2 into remission, i'm medication free, and even my cholesterol is fine now (Better than when i was using statins!). I've lost over 25 kilo's to boot. Something to look into. You obviously want to learn, so I'm hoping @daisy1's info pack will help as maybe the books by Dr. Jason Fung? But you really should look into quitting the eating like a monk thing. There's delicious food out there that is low carb, and it's waiting for you on sites like dietdoctor.com. This is a diet for a lifetime: if you don't find some genuine joy loaded onto your plate every day, you're not going to be able to stick with it. Find low carb foods you love, because they'll love you back.

It'll be okay. It's a bit of an adjustment, but you'll get there! Okay, gotta run now... But it'll be fine!
Good luck,
Jo

PS: Extra dark chocolate is fine, if you just don't eat the whole bar in one go. Try some Lindt 85%, it's low carb. Higher cacao content is even better, but it's bitter and might take some getting used to. A bar can last me a week or a month even though.
 

Almost identical posts!
 
Hi. As others have said, your meals are quite high carb. Can you let us know what your BMI is as sometimes those who are slim at diagnosis may be T1 and not T2. You were probably looking at the www.diabetes.org.uk site who, based on their recipes, don't really understand Diabetes and the need to keep the carbs down; amazing but true. Note that Metformin helps a bit but never has that much effect so carb reduction is the key and then further meds if that doesn't work.
 
I echo what the others have said. I went LCHF as soon as I was diagnosed, I tried to keep it under 20g per day. We all have to find our own level.

I recommend you download the mySugr app. You can record what you eat and what you readings are.

You will make mistakes along the way, fall of the wagon etc. Don't beat yourself up. Treat it as part of your education. You have a lot to learn. You gave found the right place for support.
 
I keep seeing people newly diagnosed who are trying their best and who don't have the information which could so easily come from their doctors - such as the foods which have carbohydrate, which as you now know is not just from the bread you ate.
The very dark chocolate is OK - over 80 percent cocoa usually has few enough carbs for it to be eaten safely - though in small amounts. There are pastas made from peas and beans which some people can cope with - though I know that I get more of a spike with legumes than the carb count would seem to imply - whilst others get scarcely a flicker.
At the moment I have a large pot of 'lurker stew' as it is affectionately known. I delved into the depths of the freezer and gathered up lamb breast and neck, the bags of beef bits and pork parts where the labels have become illegible or fallen off, thawed, fried and then simmered with bags of mixed frozen veges, plus anything lurking in the fridge that is still edible. As long as it is made from low carb ingredients the result should not cause spikes, and it is a great way to make room for the things for Christmas.
 
@Jillyf|

Hello Jilly and welcome to the Forum Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. Ask as many questions as you want and someone will be able to help.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 235,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:
  • Reduce your carbohydrate intake
  • Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates
Reduce your carbohydrates

A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)
  • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l
Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)
  • Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
  • 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l
However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips

The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:
  • structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
  • self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
Take part in Diabetes.co.uk digital education programs and improve your understanding. Most of these are free.

  • Low Carb Program - it's made front-page news of the New Scientist and The Times. Developed with 20,000 people with type 2 diabetes; 96% of people who take part recommend it... find out why

  • Hypo Program - improve your understanding of hypos. There's a version for people with diabetes, parents/guardians of children with type 1, children with type 1 diabetes, teachers and HCPs.
 
Thank you so much everyone for all your advice. I read that porridge was good because it was oats and was a slow release energy. I also read to swap white bread for whole meal and whole grain and to cut the amount down. Use brown rice and pasta (but I don’t eat any rice or pasta). I have been eating totally the wrong things. This is so hard. I can’t eat anything. I can’t eat out in restaurants . This really sucks. I am a size 8 and have been all my life and I weight 48 kilos. Losing weight won’t help me because I simply can’t lose any more.

I am willing to try though because I want to get my sugar levels down. I have heart failure, maybe this was caused by diabetes. I don’t have heart disease and the doctors don’t know what caused my heart failure (I wasn’t diagnosed with diabetes then).

Thank you again, I’m not alone
 

There is no need to lose weight if you go low carb. You just make up the lost calories by increasing your good fats and protein. There is also no need to go hungry, starve yourself, or stop eating out in restaurants. There are plenty of thinnies on this forum.

You can eat lots of things. Meat, fish, shell fish, tinned fish, eggs, bacon, tomatoes, mushrooms, cheese, butter, cream, berries, most but not all vegetables, salads, peppers, avocado, olives, olive oil, mayonnaise, very dark chocolate, red wine and spirits. Have a look at dietdoctor
https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/60-seconds There are loads of ideas on there.
 
Hi Jilly.

There's a lot of contradicting information out there. That's really why you want to eat to your meter. When one place tells you to eat carbs with a relatively low glycemic index, you can see for yourself what it does for you, then try the next advice you were given. It's a trial and error thing. Does it spike you, yes or no? Porridge would wreak havoc on my sugars, so would any type of bread, even the artisnal brown wholemeal kind. Pasta, rice... Any kind will make me ill. (I get the same symptoms when I'm high as when I'm low. Dizzy, confused, icky). I did try the low glycemic stuff too, when I started out, but it really wasn't working for me. It might for you, but your meter will tell you.

There's still plenty to eat. I mean, next friday my husband has a party at work and I got a sneak peek at the list of foods. I have actual choices! (Loads of meat, and an egg- based indonesian dish). It may take some adjustments, but oooh... Foods! (Enjoyable, delicious foods!!!) In restaurants is it REALLY easy to order low carb. They don't give you a hard time if you ask for extra salad or veggies instead of potatoes. They don't want to throw out perfectly good food where they put an effort in, so if you say it beforehand, its all good. Doesn't phase them at all. They migth ask if you want gluten-free, or what the diet's about, but that's interest and customer-service. People absolutely terrify me, so it was really hard to be a special snowflake, but as it turns out... Even McDonalds can and does cater to us! (They actually serve hamburgers without the buns. Low carb! Same with Burger King, Five Guys, whatever!). You can order a whole lot of dishes that are based around meat or fish, and just swap out the carby stuff. Everyone's been accomodating so far, I never ever ate at a place that didn't help me when I asked. (And I just realised I eat out, at least for lunch, once or twice on the weekends, most often at places I've never been before. And have for the past 2 years. That's a lot of lunches.). You know what helps? At first I'd completely panic when I went to a restaurant. But if you know where you're going, what area, what restaurants are there, you can most likely find their menu's online. Then you can decide at home what works for you and what doesn't, without a waiter/waitress breathing down your neck. There's this lovely place the next town over, and they have japanese/mongolian tapas. They have this list of over 100 items, and you get tiny little portions, 3 per round, for 5 rounds... I loved it there, but I didn't know what to eat, so I panicked and had the exact same tapas 3 times in 5 rounds. (Still was good though! ) And now, I have a list I can take with me where I can just cross off which ones I feel like having, because I have all the ones that won't spike me stored in my wallet! And have plenty of choices left over while my husband rolls me home. When I still had hypo's due to a wonky thyroid I actually came home from that place so insanely full and VERY low, so I had to cram an Oreo in there somehow. I know you don't want to lose weight, but if you load up on the good fats and protein, you'll do fine, AND keep your bloodsugars in check. I don't know how long you've been diabetic so I have no idea what caused the heart problems... Mine are hereditary, so that's all I know about; I can't say anything about that. But you really can eat. There's a world of foods out there for you to enjoy.

This is a lifelong diet. Find food you enjoy. Nothing wrong with a steak or salmon, a bunless burger, eggs and bacon, salads (without croutons)... I don't know what the staples are in UK restaurants, but you do have options. When eating out, and at home.

If you have trouble with a menu, share it here and ask for advice. Another member did, and I think three of us told him what he could order for dinner and brekkie (without spikes) at his hotel within an hour of posing the question. Your option naturally, to deviate from any advice given, as it is always for YOU to decide what you want to eat. It's your life, and it needs to be enjoyable for you. And preferably keep you healthy, but that too is your call. But if you want practical, real life pointers, we're right here.
 

Hey dear try to not eat more than 150 grams of carbs in total in a day . And preferably almost no carbs in breakfast
 
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