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Type 1.5 Highs as soon as insulin wears off

Kieron10

Kieron10

Active Member
Messages
26
Type of diabetes
LADA
Treatment type
Insulin
Hi there I'd just like to ask is there anything I can try as my bloods go up as soon as my novorapid wears off. I do take lantus which helps my morning wake up bgl as I call them. I've been diagnosed type 1.5 for a year and a half now
 
Try a basal test, there are are few guides around and posts in the forum.
 
Your basal insulin, your lantus, should keep you flat when you aren't eating or taking bolus. So if you're rising when your novorapid wears out, that suggests you need to look at your lantus dosage.

Here's a guide on basal testing - https://mysugr.com/basal-rate-testing/
 
That's what I thought. The lantus should be keeping my levelish. I take 35 units at night and when I eat my novorapid is 2-3 units mostly. I wake at around 8-9s in the morning which is still a bit high but not worrying. After the novorapid when I've eaten I then go back up to 11-15s!
 
Kieron10 said:
That's what I thought. The lantus should be keeping my levelish. I take 35 units at night and when I eat my novorapid is 2-3 units mostly. I wake at around 8-9s in the morning which is still a bit high but not worrying. After the novorapid when I've eaten I then go back up to 11-15s!
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Definitely do a basal test then. It does sound like you're not getting sufficient basal insulin.

Get the basal right (with the help of your team) and then look at your meal time ratios to make sure they're still ok.
 
Got to ask what's a basal test? I get no support from my team they are awful. See a specialist every 6 months but NHS so gets cancelled all the time as no staff. Any help I'd be very grateful
 
Kieron10 said:
Got to ask what's a basal test? I get no support from my team they are awful. See a specialist every 6 months but NHS so gets cancelled all the time as no staff. Any help I'd be very grateful
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See post 3
 
See @catapillar 's reply for a link. It's a fasting test done segment by segment of the 24 hours to make sure your basal insulin keeps your blood sugar steady.

You might also want to get the book Think Like A Pancreas for general info and help. It's very popular with Type 1s (and 1.5s) for good reason.
 
Hi. That Lantus dose is quite high (and the Bolus quite low?). Do you have excess weight? If so, large levels of insulin may be needed due to insulin resistance which may explain why the Lantus isn't working too well. If you do have excess weight and not low-carbing then do get the carbs down.
 
Kieron10 said:
Got to ask what's a basal test? I get no support from my team they are awful. See a specialist every 6 months but NHS so gets cancelled all the time as no staff. Any help I'd be very grateful
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The following article is from the author of the book Think Like a Pancreas (an excellent book btw) which explains why it's important to get the basal dose right and gives a full explanation on how to do a basal test:

http://integrateddiabetes.com/basal-testing/
 
Daibell said:
Hi. That Lantus dose is quite high (and the Bolus quite low?). Do you have excess weight? If so, large levels of insulin may be needed due to insulin resistance which may explain why the Lantus isn't working too well. If you do have excess weight and not low-carbing then do get the carbs down.
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I'm at top of my bmi and docs aren't worried about my weight. If I use to much bolus I can tell I get low bgl. Exercise is limited due to having fibromyalgia and hip problems caused from an accident.
 
Your daytime basal needs may be more that that of your overnight needs......

basal testing, which has been linked above, in simple terms is testing your blood sugar with the absence of digesting food and active bolus.....

the easiest way to do this is in a small chunks of say 4-5 hours......

being on injections normally limits most folk to 2, sometimes 3, injections of basal...
 
Do you mostly rise in the morning until mid afternoon or is after each meal?

My basal dose is right but in the morning I have to take at least one more dose and most often even another or I keep rising.
I can't take the full dose at once or I hypo then pop up.
After loads of testing, I take my food dose ( 1/2 unit) 10 minutes before I eat at 8 then 1/2 unit one hour later to stop the rise and then I test around noon and if I'm going up I take 1/2 unit again. This keeps me steady until I eat at 3 and then I'm steady until dinner at 6:30 but it took lots of testing to see when my rise started and I am able to catch it before it goes up. That being said, I'm only taking 1/2 units so I don't fear hypos. I can't take more lantus or I hypo during the night. It's my version of a pump in the mornings. I, just not ready for a pump yet. This is where I could see it being very advantageous for some people. Many of us have trouble with dawn phenomenon and waking phenomenon in the mornings until mid day. If I didn't eat at 3 I would stay steady until dinner if I wanted to skip lunch ( but I don't) and not sure how long after as I always eat dinner.
 
Kristin251 said:
Do you mostly rise in the morning until mid afternoon or is after each meal?

My basal dose is right but in the morning I have to take at least one more dose and most often even another or I keep rising.
I can't take the full dose at once or I hypo then pop up.
After loads of testing, I take my food dose ( 1/2 unit) 10 minutes before I eat at 8 then 1/2 unit one hour later to stop the rise and then I test around noon and if I'm going up I take 1/2 unit again. This keeps me steady until I eat at 3 and then I'm steady until dinner at 6:30 but it took lots of testing to see when my rise started and I am able to catch it before it goes up. That being said, I'm only taking 1/2 units so I don't fear hypos. I can't take more lantus or I hypo during the night. It's my version of a pump in the mornings. I, just not ready for a pump yet. This is where I could see it being very advantageous for some people. Many of us have trouble with dawn phenomenon and waking phenomenon in the mornings until mid day. If I didn't eat at 3 I would stay steady until dinner if I wanted to skip lunch ( but I don't) and not sure how long after as I always eat dinner.
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Hey there, yeah mostly if not always after each meal. I eat then take novorapid at 2-3 units and that works for 2.5 hours and straightaway they start rising
 
It's like I need to take another 2 units soon as the other units wear off
 
Just so I understand, you're taking 2-3 units with meals and after 2.5 hours you start rising? Have you tested in between at say 1 hour to see if you start going up then? Or are you steady until 2.5 hours? So if you took more novolog you would probably head down before up again? I'm just trying to see if you're taking enough novolog? I know I can't bolus for the whole meal at once in the morning or I hypo. I think what you're explaining is why many people chose to go on a pump. I'd probably consider it more if it also alleviated all the finger sticks.
Have you talked to your team about splitting your lantus evening and morning? I can't do that as I hypo'd all day but I am very insulin sensitive. I take 2 lantus at 10:15 pm. That just moved up from 1 unit.
Also what time are you taking lantus? I started taking it with dinner and then moved it to 10:15 before bed and that helped.
 
Yeah exactly that, I'm steady till 2.5hours and then bang I test again and I'm at 12+ it's crazy. Yeah if I took more I'd drop to low as i tried this a few times. Never thought about the pump to be honest. What it is is that I was a heavy drinker for 10 plus years then decided to stop a couple years back and they noticed that I had high bgl so went straight on insulin.
 
If you've tested often enough and see a regular jump after 2.5 hours you might try doing what I do and take a small injection then to stop the rise. I'm the morning my first rise starts at one hour so I bolus then. Then about two hours later I have to do it again. But it keeps me rock steady. No spikes and no drops.
You should consult with your diabetic team. Fortunately my ends lets me do what I want as I have a great A1c and take small doses. When I've asked about things he just tells me to test haha. So that's what I do. It took awhile to pinpoint exactly when I started rising but it was very consistent. I still test and if I've gone lower, which never happens, I would wait another half hour. Generally it doesn't drop me at all but stops any further rise.
 
I sound very much the same as you so think I'll be trying that. Thanks for your advice
 
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