Mireille said:If I rely on my body to convert dietary fat into energy, will this satisfy my body's requirement in a fight/flight situation? In other words, will sufficient energy be available in time in such a situation?
paul-1976 said:Personally I have not noticed any difference,I'm in ketosis through my own choice and the nature of my life and personality means I experience fight or flight very often.
diamondnostril said:Mireille said:If I rely on my body to convert dietary fat into energy, will this satisfy my body's requirement in a fight/flight situation? In other words, will sufficient energy be available in time in such a situation?
Hi Mireille,
Interesting question
My understanding is that a fight or flight response in the human body will be stimulated by the release of hormones. At the very lowest level (inside the body's cells) all inputs will end up being converted to ATP (Adenosine triphosphate) before the body can utilize them as energy. My feeling is that if the raw materials have been provided (CHO/PRO/FAT in whatever combination you have chosen) then the hormone release will stimulate the prioritized use of those materials for fight or flight.
I think (though I'm sure many others disagree) that Ketosis would have been a natural state for many humans during our evolutionary history, if/when our diet was based mainly on animal fats, supplemented by fruits if/when they were available. I assume that fight or flight situations would have occurred just as frequently when fruits were, and were not, available. Therefore I assume that the fight or flight response is just as effective if you are in or out of Ketosis.
This is just speculation on my part. The closest I have come to a fight or flight situation since I have been on a Ketogenic diet is running to catch my train. Hardly comparable, but I do not seem to have any problems with a panicked short sharp dash.
Really interested to read the thoughts of others on that question . . .
Regards,
Antony
paul-1976 said:It's your choice whether you believe it or not,many of us do very well on ketogenic diets and in fact I know someone who does regular long distance running whilst being continually in ketosis.
I have to ask though,why all the interest in ketosis? It's quite obvious that it's not something you approve of..I do and it's my choice and I don't have to justify it to anybody.
Edit to add..Looking at your back posts and profile you're not diabetic and only appear to be here to question the validity of low carb and ketosis....Hmmm..I wonder what your real angle is for being here.
Remember this post? quite clearly states you have no interest in low carbing
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=46119&start=10
Mireille said:I believe that the hormones you speak of trigger the release of glucose (I assume in the form of glycogen from the liver) if there is no glucose in the blood. I do not believe that the conversion of fat into energy meets the requirements of fight/flight in terms of speed of response.
Mireille said:paul-1976 said:It's your choice whether you believe it or not,many of us do very well on ketogenic diets and in fact I know someone who does regular long distance running whilst being continually in ketosis.
I have to ask though,why all the interest in ketosis? It's quite obvious that it's not something you approve of..I do and it's my choice and I don't have to justify it to anybody.
Edit to add..Looking at your back posts and profile you're not diabetic and only appear to be here to question the validity of low carb and ketosis....Hmmm..I wonder what your real angle is for being here.
Remember this post? quite clearly states you have no interest in low carbing
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=46119&start=10
I find your response extremely offensive. I have just been confirmed as being prediabetic. You are clearly very paranoid about your choice of lifestyle as illustrated by your public comments to the extent that you think you know what others are thinking and don't like being challenged. That tells me that you are not convinced yourself. If that's what low-carbing does to someone then you are a good example of avoiding it. If this site is only for diabetics and that subjects like low-carbing and ketosis are for the chosen few. the 'front page' should state quite clearly that Non-diabetics & Prediabetics 'KEEP OUT'.
diamondnostril said:Mireille said:I believe that the hormones you speak of trigger the release of glucose (I assume in the form of glycogen from the liver) if there is no glucose in the blood. I do not believe that the conversion of fat into energy meets the requirements of fight/flight in terms of speed of response.
The body has a myriad of Hormones, which it has perfected the use of through hundreds of thousands of years of evolution. I know from my own experience that the body knows perfectly well whether it is in Ketosis or not, and this will inform the exact hormonal response that it gives in any given situation. I don't expect that the body's exact fight or flight response in Ketosis will be the same as the body's exact fight or flight response out of Ketosis. I only say that the results will be the same. (Otherwise, we could expect that the survival strategy called "Ketosis" would have died a death long ago, with the death of those poor humans that were not able to run or fight).
Andy12345 said:ok i have no idea about most of this stuff you are discussing but that never stopped me poking my nose in before so.... i have hopefully been in ketosis for quite a few months now and i cram in as much fat as i can and ive never had so much energy. i run 5 k at least 3 times a week now where as before i couldnt run to the toilet so i have to say from personal experience that my body is perfectly happy with this, i wouldnt need fight or flight hormone, i just need the flight one
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paul-1976 said:Mireille said:paul-1976 said:It's your choice whether you believe it or not,many of us do very well on ketogenic diets and in fact I know someone who does regular long distance running whilst being continually in ketosis.
I have to ask though,why all the interest in ketosis? It's quite obvious that it's not something you approve of..I do and it's my choice and I don't have to justify it to anybody.
Edit to add..Looking at your back posts and profile you're not diabetic and only appear to be here to question the validity of low carb and ketosis....Hmmm..I wonder what your real angle is for being here.
Remember this post? quite clearly states you have no interest in low carbing
viewtopic.php?f=15&t=46119&start=10
I find your response extremely offensive. I have just been confirmed as being prediabetic. You are clearly very paranoid about your choice of lifestyle as illustrated by your public comments to the extent that you think you know what others are thinking and don't like being challenged. That tells me that you are not convinced yourself. If that's what low-carbing does to someone then you are a good example of avoiding it. If this site is only for diabetics and that subjects like low-carbing and ketosis are for the chosen few. the 'front page' should state quite clearly that Non-diabetics & Prediabetics 'KEEP OUT'.
Not true,I'm perfectly convinced by my choice and I have always said that it's only MY choice and I don't expect others to do as I do.
Also,EVERYONE is welcome here but the majority of your posts are not about diabetes BUT questioning the validity of Low carbing which is something you state you are not interested in so I still don't get what the big interest is...If you want help with your diabetes then there are many people here who will always try and help and offer their opinion,not medical advice but opinion only
Mireille said:I think you are quite right. But the body would need to recover from a situation and be ready for the next one, which could happen at any time. I also think that the 'survival strategy' called 'ketosis' by you refers to situations of starvation. Anyone who in in a famine situation, e.g. certain parts of Africa, would find it very hard to run. Give them an apple and they probably could run a bit. That is part of the reason they are so vulnerable. And before you try to patronise me about using this as an example, I have first-had experience.
Here's a scenario ... a young child who hasn't eaten for days has the opportunity to escape from Syria to Turkey on foot. Do you
1. Give them a bowl of fruit
2. Give them a tub of lard
Therapeutic use of ketogenic diets should not require constraint of most forms of physical labor or recreational activity, with the one caveat that anaerobic (ie, weight lifting or sprint) performance is limited by the low muscle glycogen levels induced by a ketogenic diet, and this would strongly discourage its use under most conditions of competitive athletics.
Mireille said:If I rely on my body to convert dietary fat into energy, will this satisfy my body's requirement in a fight/flight situation? In other words, will sufficient energy be available in time in such a situation?
Mireille said:paul-1976 said:Personally I have not noticed any difference,I'm in ketosis through my own choice and the nature of my life and personality means I experience fight or flight very often.
So the body can convert fat to energy as quickly as it can utilise stored glycogen and the chemical process is just as fast. Interesting.