Type 2 Insulin and weight gain.

duckyhenny said:

Has anyone else put weight on since starting on insulin? I have put on nearly a stone in the last 6 months since starting insulin injections.

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Hi

I'm Type 2, been using insulin just over a year, and have also put on just over a stone in weight. My simplistic way of looking at it is that before insulin, glucose from carbs/sugar was floating round in my blood, doing untold damage. Now, the insulin does its job and removes the glucose from my blood, but stores it as fat.

My diabetes nurse said that almost all people who start using insulin will put on some weight.

I am eating healthier and exercising more than I was pre-insulin, so low carb is the next thing I'm trying!

Certainly have too - diagnosed 1/11/2016, Metformin Slow Release (in increasing doses) for 4 weeks with no effect - then insulin added (Novomix 30) on 28/11/16. At that time was 75kgs - now 81kgs - hate it!! - think this is about a stone.

Diabetic Nurse and Endo don't see it as a problem - fortunately dietician understands how I feel. I had already dramatically reduced carbs compared with pre-diagnosis as soon as I understood the benefits, but she has suggested reducing them further which I am now trying.

BG levels are way better than the early days and weight does at least seem to have stabilised now. Would love to be able to exercise more but unfortunately due for a double knee replacement early next month (been waiting over a year - long story) and walking any distance is agony - but I do swim and bike ride. Hopefully when I come out the other side and can start walking again things will improve.

All the best @duckyhenny in your efforts

Everyone's idea of low carb is different. How many carbs are you eating?

Other potential weight stalllers are ALL dairy including cream, cheese, milk, etc. Also all grains, sugars and starch. Processed foods. Too many nuts. Portion sizes. Gobbling fat. Saturated fat for some of us. Just things to evaluate

Think moderate amounts of protein, healthy fats and only above ground veggies. Even these add up fast. I can't go over 20 carbs. Maybe you still have room to reduce them?

Of course you're right @Kristin251 - when the DC first talked about "low" carb - they said aim for 10 - 12 x 15g serves a day (so 150 - 180g) but never below!!

Dietician now suggests 6 - 8 per day (90 -120g) but I am trying to keep below that as much as possible - but obviously way above what you eat. She is not a fan of the HF part of LCHF - so for now I'm not going completely over to that, but aiming to increase proteins and keep to reduced fat (that I have for years) if I have any dairy.

Virtually no grains, saturated fat, starch, processed foods (and always check the carb content if I do buy for convenience) or below ground vegies (though I'm told carrots are fine??) and very few nuts. Portions are reasonable - I think

Probably my two indulgences - a glass of dry white wine with dinner 2 -3 nights a week and a piece of high cocoa dark chocolate now and again could go - but hey a girl's got to have some pleasure!!!

duckyhenny said:

Thanks peeps I'm glad I'm not the only one to have put on weight and like both of you I want to get it off again so any help would be appreciated.

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Hi. I think some of us have already made the point that the solution almost certainly lies in reducing the carbs.

Chook said:

I was on insulin for five years (I'm type 2) and gained a stone for every year, mainly around my middle. I now eat a very low carb diet and don't use insulin any more - it hasn't been easy - and definitely not something that I'd recommend without discussing it with a doctor first - but I have nearly lost the weight I put on while on the insulin - just got the last few pounds to go (which I keep losing but they keep coming back to find me again).

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Must have been a real struggle for you. I'm
type 2. My doc keeps suggesting I go on insulin. So far, I pretend I don't hear him. I really don't want to gain any more weight! I'm already big.
Good for you for staying with the low carb way of eating and losing the weight you put on while on insulin.

SueNSW said:

Of course you're right @Kristin251 - when the DC first talked about "low" carb - they said aim for 10 - 12 x 15g serves a day (so 150 - 180g) but never below!!

Dietician now suggests 6 - 8 per day (90 -120g) but I am trying to keep below that as much as possible - but obviously way above what you eat. She is not a fan of the HF part of LCHF - so for now I'm not going completely over to that, but aiming to increase proteins and keep to reduced fat (that I have for years) if I have any dairy.

Virtually no grains, saturated fat, starch, processed foods (and always check the carb content if I do buy for convenience) or below ground vegies (though I'm told carrots are fine??) and very few nuts. Portions are reasonable - I think

Probably my two indulgences - a glass of dry white wine with dinner 2 -3 nights a week and a piece of high cocoa dark chocolate now and again could go - but hey a girl's got to have some pleasure!!!

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The problem with that is fat does not make you fat in the ABSENCE of carbs but fat + carbs = weight gain. Low fat is not the answer for weight loss nor is upping protein. Lchf is not high protein. You need to eat enough for maintenance and repair and no more. So .8 g per kg LEAN body mass is enough for most people.
So to me, if you're not losing weight on that many carbs and low fat something has to change. As @Daibell said reducing carbs. Mnaynof eat way less than 50 and some below 20. I would be ravenous eating the amount of carb sugar you do and low fat. But that could just be me. Loads of people are shocked when they reduce carbs how much better control bs is, weight drops off and a host of other wonderful benefits. Might be worth a try?

Not judging but it's no late breaking news carbs cause weight gain. Some people need tomeat them to keep weight up. So if course the inverse makes sense. Low carb, weight loss. High carb weight up.

Kristin251 said:

I would be ravenous eating the amount of carb sugar you do and low fat. But that could just be me. Loads of people are shocked when they reduce carbs how much better control bs is, weight drops off and a host of other wonderful benefits. Might be worth a try?

Not judging but it's no late breaking news carbs cause weight gain. Some people need tomeat them to keep weight up. So if course the inverse makes sense. Low carb, weight loss. High carb weight up.

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Might be worth a try??? As I said, my carbs have decreased massively since diagnosis and I am doing what I can to decrease them further although I doubt I'll ever get as low as you choose to - and that's my choice. Also certainly never suggested LCHF = high protein.

My blood sugar control is now fine thanks and nothing wrong with my energy levels (62 and looking after 3 year old grandson 5 days a week!!) - but in response to the OP I was just confirming that they are not alone at having gained weight since starting insulin

I can also assure you that I'm certainly not ravenous on what I'm consuming - guess everyone IS different

I thought this thread was actually questioning weight gain on insulin rather than specifically how to lose it (there are plenty of threads about that) - much as I'd like to - I'm hoping that once my knees are fixed the increased opportunity for exercise in conjunction with low carb - rather than ultra low will make the difference I'm hoping for

SueNSW said:

Might be worth a try??? As I said, my carbs have decreased massively since diagnosis and I am doing what I can to decrease them further although I doubt I'll ever get as low as you choose to - and that's my choice. Also certainly never suggested LCHF = high protein.

My blood sugar control is now fine thanks and nothing wrong with my energy levels (62 and looking after 3 year old grandson 5 days a week!!) - but in response to the OP I was just confirming that they are not alone at having gained weight since starting insulin

I can also assure you that I'm certainly not ravenous on what I'm consuming - guess everyone IS different

I thought this thread was actually questioning weight gain on insulin rather than specifically how to lose it (there are plenty of threads about that) - much as I'd like to - I'm hoping that once my knees are fixed the increased opportunity for exercise in conjunction with low carb - rather than ultra low will make the difference I'm hoping for

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I'm so sorry. I didn't mean to insult you or tell you how to eat. My BIG mistake. I thought you were trying to lose weight.
I sometimes too much insert ' myself here '. Like ravenous. I spent 50 years ravenously hungry by not finding my right fuel and / or not maintaining my correct bs / insulin. Very hard years.
I realize MOST people can't, don't want to or don't feel well on as low carb as I am. It's the only thing that works for me and I know others as well but didn't mean to inflict that on you.
I do know that once I started insulin and upped my carbs I did gain substantial weight far too quickly for my liking. Then I went back to lower carb, lower insulin and it stabilized. Carbs have always been a huge weight gain factor for me. As well as causes loads of stomach issues.

So again, I'm very sorry if I offended you. I need to shut my mouth!!!!

Daibell said:

I have to strongly disagree with the DSN. Insulin itself does not make you gain weight - why should it? Insulin does not make you hungry either. It's all due to the carbs not the insulin. Injected insulin enables the body to metabolise the carbs you eat. If you eat too many then you may get a carb 'high' and then crave more carbs.

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Since losing the weight I put on with insulin, I eat just the same and I havent gained any more weight. I know if they make me go back on insulin I will gain the weight back again!

duckyhenny said:

Has anyone else put weight on since starting on insulin? I have put on nearly a stone in the last 6 months since starting insulin injections.

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Yes, I balloon when I take my injections regularly. Mobidly obse is the only way I can describe it, and all on my mid-section too.

Lovely lady said:

I am a type 2 on Insulin,and I have put on weight since being on it.you say it's carbs not Insulin that puts weight on,I have to disagree as I don't eat many carbs.some times my weight comes off the following week I have put on and it is very dishearting.
I have been on a diet for near three years and still have not lost the weight I want to loose. Even have a small plate,
Any suggestion will be helpful
Jean

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Hello Jean. If you don't eat food you don't put on weight - you starve to death. I am also Type 2 for the past 20 years and started Insulin about 4 years ago - my weight gradually increased from 12 and a half stone to 13 and a half stone even though I was very active. Now that I have recently retired at 75 years of age - and thus less active - I started the LCHF diet 4 weeks ago and have come down to 13 stone already.

My Insulin needs have also come down from 44 units am to 40 units and 34 units pm to 20 units pm and I do VERY LITTLE exercise (getting lazy).

I hope this information helps.

T2's on mixed insulin have to eat enough carbs to cover the fast acting insulin in their mix and therefore many find that they put weight on, it is a very difficult balancing act to reduce carbs when on a mixed insulin routine and many of those saying cut the carbs clearly dont understand insulin.

Those on mixed insulin will need a different mix prescription if they want to eat a lchf diet but it may be worth the effort if you are or have put on weight on mixed insulin.

The easiest way to low carb is to switch to a MDI routine which means Multiple Daily Injections and this basically means that instead of a mixed insulin you take a slow or medium acting insulin once or twice a day to keep your bg levels steady when not eating and a fast acting insulin taken before each meal to cover the carbs in that meal, it sounds complicated but in daily use it is not hard once you get the hang of counting carbs to calculate your fast acting insulin.

Now doctors and practice nurses may not be competent enough to advice on MDI treatment so to switch to MDI you might need a referral to a hospital diabetic clinic where they know a lot more about diabetes and insulins.

I was on MDI insulin for about 12 months after diagnosis and managed to lose 4 stone in that time and a further stone the year after, at no time did I eat less than 60g of carbs and I never added more fat to my diet, it was enough just to cut the carbs back and generally eat less of everything.

If you want to switch to MDI or have your mixed insulin changed to a different mix the first thing you need to do is see your GP or specialist diabetic nurse and let them know what you want to do.

Hope this helps.

duckyhenny said:

I'm the same Sue NSW. I have very limited mobility due to hip and disc operations plus a lot of other health issues. I Amon novamix 30 twice a day before food. 15 units each time. All the best to you too.

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Thanks for your good wishes too @duckyhenny - actually your insulin level is less than mine - I'm taking 22 units morning and 16 evening - increased gradually from its introduction at the end of November until levels were consistently what the endo was aiming for.

I'm going to stick to this for now until my surgery (hopefully good levels will keep everyone happy) then start playing around with a little less once I'm out the other side. Will see how it goes

Sid Bonkers said:

T2's on mixed insulin have to eat enough carbs to cover the fast acting insulin in their mix and therefore many find that they put weight on, it is a very difficult balancing act to reduce carbs when on a mixed insulin routine and many of those saying cut the carbs clearly dont understand insulin.

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THANKS @Sid Bonkers (great name BTW!) for mentioning this very important aspect that I realised but didn't include in my comments here.

On the Novomix 30 I have the vast majority of my carbs with the morning and evening meals - very little if any at lunch and very rarely snack between meals

MDI was mentioned very briefly when I started on insulin - only a month after initial diagnosis - but endo didn't seem keen and to be honest, I'm already pretty over the hassle of 6 times a day (minimum) testing I've been told to do and injecting twice a day - so much as I'd like to get back to the weight I was when I started I'm not sure I'm ready to try that yet.

Hopefully once I'm out the other side of my double knee replacement and can exercise more, things will improve - until then I'm at least happy that the weight seems to have stabilised. After that it might be time for a Plan B

@SueNSW good luck with your Knees, hope it all goes well and your back in the club scene quickly

MDI isnt that hard to pick up it just sounds daunting, I really liked it once I got the hang of it and counting the carbs I was eating it gave me a feeling of being in control, and counting carbs is easier for a T2 as if you have some of your own insulin you dont have to be as precise as a T1 has to be, you seem to have more leeway, or at least thats what I found.

It may also be worth investigating a change to your mixed insulin as your weight gain could be down to the long/medium insulin in your mix being slightly too high so you always have a little too much background insulin in your system, Ive never used mixed insulin but I imagine it is not an exact science and the mix that you start out with may need tweaking several times to get the right mix for you as an individual, just as I was told to inject 10 units of fact acting insulin before meals and found that I needed to up that figure to around 12 to start with but then as I started reduced the carbs I was eating it was soon reducing week by week/month by month.

Either way if you are not happy with your weight gain do speak to your doc/nurse and ask about your options as if you can lose weight you should find a big difference in how much insulin you need as it is the visceral fat around our bodies organs that causes insulin resistance and weight loss is the best way to reduce visceral fat along with general fat you can see that you lose with a diet. It took me about a year to wean myself off insulin altogether and after another 4 or 5 years I was able to reduce and finally drop my metformin as well and am now med free as far as my diabetes is concerned.

Once again good luck with your operations and for the future too.

Thanks for the good wishes @Sid Bonkers - um see you at that Club then!!

Thanks also for the info - at the moment the Diabetic Nurse and the Endo feel the weight gain is nothing to be concerned about - huh!! - I'm "reasonably lean" to quote the endo to my GP. Certainly the majority of others I've seen at the the clinic are on the seriously large size - so I guess it's all relative!

Fortunately the dietician understands where I'm coming from

I feel though, with the surgery only just over 4 weeks away I'm going for the quiet life at the moment and sticking where I am for now - good numbers and at least stabilised weight . Once I'm up and running again - as well as dancing - I'll certainly look at it all again and try to consider the options including titrating the dose of Novomix down.

Hi. I agree with Sid that MDI is always the best insulin regime apart from needing 4 to 5 injections per day. It gives you total control of the match between the carbs you eat and the Bolus (meal-time) insulin. The medical profession are still a bit hung-up on using insulin mixes for T2s as a sort of compromise (even for some T1s still)but I don't think it's always for the best. Note that T2s who have insulin resistance thru too much weight or whatever often have too much natural insulin and adding to that is not always the best approach. In this case getting the weight down is usually the best approach and then the best way forward can be reviewed. Note that there are different mixed insulin mixes which might help a bit?