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I've become a low carb binger..

Discussion in 'Type 2 Diabetes' started by Lovejoy00, Feb 25, 2018.

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  1. jcbman

    jcbman I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    That seems to suggest breaking down stored fat. So you are saying we somehow convert eaten fat to stored fat, then break it down, along with previously stored fat? I'm getting really confused. I need to know how that extra fat I eat, doesn't get processed, not stored, used, broken down, breathed out.
    Or are you saying you were wrong, and it's all stored regardless of what it came from?
     
  2. lucylocket61

    lucylocket61 Type 2 · Expert

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  3. lucylocket61

    lucylocket61 Type 2 · Expert

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  4. jcbman

    jcbman I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Still confused.
    Do we super heat, or flush it down?
     
  5. RFSMarch

    RFSMarch Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Wow what a discussion. On dx I had already lost a stone and a half and was told by the GP to stabilise my weight, with high cholesterol as well I opted for Low GI foods first of all... my A1C almost halved, cholesterol back to normal and weight stayed the same.

    Been trying out LCHF recipes and been away a few times so weight crept back up a little but nothing too major, but for me bloods seems a lot more stable than in the teens when I was first diagnosed and testing.

    Personally I am more happy with bloods being more stable and weight loss tends to come with more consistent exercise. I want those to be a lot lower when I have my next blood test but I know that many focus more on weight loss.

    Even though I dropped down to one Metformin SR because it tends to back me up solid, I have not noticed any more frequent umm,,, ‘excretion’ at all either with the adoption of more LCHF or less Metformin!

    Then again.... I tend to carb count more than calorie count... but try and keep en eye on the cals, eg resist the urge to go crazy it’s having nuts as snacks.
     
  6. VioletViolet

    VioletViolet Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    Hello, yes I did (do) this too. For me I think I'm eating and eating cheese etc waiting for the biscuit high sugar buzz which of course never comes

    No answers for you, just a "yes me too !"
     
  7. Dr Snoddy

    Dr Snoddy Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi Guzzler. Thanks for posting a link. Some of what is written in the article about the breakdown of body fat is correct but some of the steps in the explanation have been omitted. There has also been a fair amount of journalistic licence in order to create a readable article. Most A Level Biology students could describe what happens to stored fat molecules when weight loss is occurring. People lose weight when their energy intake from food, carb, protein and fat, is less than energy they use. (Or when something has gone wrong within the body. ) Stored fat will eventually be mobilized and the large, stable fat molecules which are made of carbon, hydrogen and oxygen will be broken down to triglycerides and other small lipids that can be taken to body cells. Here they will be further broken down to release carbon dioxide and water Some of the energy in the original stored fat molecules will end up as heat. The carbon dioxide is indeed excreted via the lungs.
    This very different to saying that body fat is excreted via the lungs, kidneys etc.
    Another area of confusion seems to be about dietary fat. If I ate a very high fat meal my digestive system might have difficulty in digesting so much fat in one go. The resulting gut upset might result in diarrhoea in which case fatty food might pass through the gut undigested and end up in the toilet! It has not actually been absorbed into the body.
    Time for a LCMF breakfast. I am managing to keep my bg in the 30s and my weight stable with this approach.
     
  8. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    When fat is used by the body, it creates ketones, and these in turn become acetyl molecules, and it is these that get into our breath, giving it the characteristic pear drop aroma of acetone. (keto beath)

    In addition, some of the excess fat gets converted into bile, and gets exctreted in the poop via the bile duct. This fat passing into the large intestine helps improve motility and helps overcome constipation, so I am led to believe. So yes, excretion is an apt word to use,

    However it is the burning of the fat stores by which process the complex fat molecules get broken down into the acetyl CoA components that our body's furnace uses as fuel. CoA is generated by both carbs via glucogen formation, or by converting the lipid fats in the abdomen into CoA. Same fuel in the end, but our bodies only convert fat to CoA while the glucose levels are low since this is the backup process, It takes more energy to convert fat to fuel, and our bodies only do this as a last resort.

    It needs certain enzymes to make the process work properly, and these are created during the fat adaption process. Once the enzymes have been created by our bodies, then switching between glucose and fat as a fuel source becomes automatic, and depends on bgl levels and adrenalin and insulin levels that combine to control the conversion, It is not a simple process, but is one which our bodies are designed to do naturally.

    There is another set of enzymes that control the conversion of fat into useful stuff while being digested. These enzymes work to limit how much fat is converted, and so not all fat is passed into the cholesterol and lipid pathway. It just gets excreted like other waste products. So our body naturally limits how much of the fat is actually absorbed. The problem with diabetes, especially T2 diabetes is that elevated insulin levels actually create a false condition that overrides this control system by apparently increasing demand for lipid storage in the adipose tissues (for future use). and it is this mechanism that is responsiible for the Metabolic Syndrome and beer belly characteristic of T2D. If you reduce the insulin in the blood stream either by meds, exercise, or lowering carb intake levels, then it seems that weight gain can be turned into weight loss. Research has shown that it is not simply calories in / calories out which is why most calorie restricted diets fail unless very severe, and why we are seeing that low carb diets are more effective at weight loss.

    If you want the science behind this, then you need to research the Endocrine system, since it is not part of the metabolism or digestion process. but the research is quite mind blowing and beyond the comprehension level normally used on this site. I have given up posting links since it is a different language, and quite complex a subject to follow. But the answers are there, not here.

    Edit to add: digestion of fat is made by the enzyme Lipase
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hormone-sensitive_lipase
     
    • Winner Winner x 3
    • Informative Informative x 3
    #108 Oldvatr, Feb 26, 2018 at 12:40 PM
    Last edited: Feb 26, 2018
  9. BB8.HG

    BB8.HG Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    This happened to me in my first week of low carb. I went to a Brazilian BBQ place and protein binged like crazy (in my defence, it was my birthday...). I was very unhappy because I had no idea how I was going to get both blood sugar and weight under control. After nearly a month of low-carb my appetite has subsided to a massive degree.

    My goal is 1200 calories a day, but to be honest I struggle to reach that. I'm almost doing an accidental Newcastle Diet, sometimes i'll get to 8pm and i'll have eaten 800 calories that day and couldn't stomach another bite.

    I would ride it out, my appetite has only changed in the last week or so. Maybe yours will adjust in time.

    As other posters have said, I wouldn't prioritise blood sugar or weight loss over the other.
     
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  10. Dark Horse

    Dark Horse · Well-Known Member

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    There seems to have been some confusion about the meaning of the word 'excreted'. Dietary fat is not excreted. If it is surplus to the daily calorie requirement, it will be stored in the body. If not, it will be metabolised (i.e. undergo chemical reactions) to produce energy. The products of fat metabolism are carbon dioxide and water. Carbon dioxide is excreted by the lungs, water is mostly excreted in urine. Thus it is the products of metabolism that are excreted, not the fat. If someone takes in more dietary fat than their body needs, the excess will be stored in adipose tissue.
     
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  11. Dr Snoddy

    Dr Snoddy Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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  12. Dr Snoddy

    Dr Snoddy Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi Oldvatr. I couldn't agree more! I have been trying to reduce the biochemistry and physiology down to something more simplistic so that some of the questions on this site are answered.
     
  13. tayelola

    tayelola Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    jcbman said something about being underweight. What's the yardstick to determine if one is underweight?
     
  14. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    When you sit in the bath and your glutimus maximus is insufficient to cover the essentials. In other words - Ouch!
     
  15. DJC3

    DJC3 Type 2 · Expert

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    And me! Think you’ve hit it there @VioletViolet must be waiting for the lovely crispy cracker high.

    However, today I was amazed when 1/2 way through my lunch of roast beef (a whole 85g pack) and salad, I realised I was full and simply didn’t want any more so I put the plate in the fridge. Will probably have it for tomorrow lunch if its not too limp.

    I also have a problem with eating too many nuts - every time I’d go into the kitchen I’d grab a handfull. Ive started to portion them out now though into 30g amounts so I cant kid myself it was only a couple.

    Good luck with it, keep going and don’t give up.
     
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  16. archersuz

    archersuz Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Well I never! For all these years, I thought fat turned to energy/heat. Just goes to show that we're never too old to learn! Thanks @Guzzler
     
  17. LooperCat

    LooperCat Type 1 · Expert

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    Thanks from me too. I’m trying to find the actual hard science behind this as I used to be a biologist/biochemist!
     
  18. jcbman

    jcbman I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I'm kinda lost.

    Fat?
    Does it stick to your belly, or does it pass out and you flush it away. Literally.
    (And obviously I'm talking about the excess here)
     
  19. VioletViolet

    VioletViolet Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    Nuts! Nuts are my nemesis but I do try to have salted nuts if I really just want to stuff my face. I figure better them than something high carb:)
     
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  20. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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