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Keto trying

Discussion in 'Ketogenic diet forum' started by megan, Jan 6, 2018.

  1. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    I’ve done low carb before and no carb.... in the traditional sense. Never lost weight. Iast time I tried I got to 5 weeks and had got weaker then got the flu so had to stop. I gained another stone after that!
    Trying again. Reading up to make sure I don’t make any mistakes that could stop the weight loss. On day 4. Sugars are coming down. Avoided hypo once by detaching my pump for a short while. All good.
    The first two days my basal has to go right up high but that seems to be slowing a bit.
    I had read on someone’s post about the keto dip sticks. I don’t fully understand.
    I read that ketones will show up on stick but will ease off eventually? Is this correct? How do you know you are safe?
    Good bloods and ketones in urine is a grey area to me
    I’m also still told my insulin balance should be roughly 50:50 between basal and bolus.... but.... I know over the last couple of decades I’ve done something new or different because it felt right, and the standard things weren’t working.
    I’ve seen another person on here mention they’d hoped to be in basal alone... does anyone do this?
    I’ve always needed insulin for low to no carb meals.... even a plate of lettuce and a few other greens.... a past dr used to say I shouldn’t bolus for those meals.... but that was wrong... I had to or my sugars rose a lot. I often felt I’d be better having the actually carb and bolusing for that than going with out and bolusing similar anyway!
    I’m trying to drink plenty of water too.
    Any thoughts and info I’d be really pleased to hear. Thanks
     
  2. catapillar

    catapillar Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Nutritional ketosis is different to diabetic ketones.

    Nutritional ketosis happens when your body is using fat for fuel.

    Diabetic ketones happen when you don't have enough insulin.

    You tell the difference by your blood sugar levels. If blood sugar levels are normal then ketones aren't anything to worry about.

    Your body wants you to have glucose in your blood, you know, to keep you alive. The easiest way for your body to get glucose into your blood is via carbohydrates. That's why the medical advice is to calculate bolus doses by carb counting. But, when you aren't eating carbs your body has to find glucose from somewhere else. It does this by turning protein eaten into glucose in a process called gluconogenesis. If you are eating low carb, you may find you need to bolus for protein. The gluconogenesis process takes time, so you may need to consider delayed or extended bolus. The standard advice on bolusing for protein is to: a)discount the first 30g then; b) divide the remaining grams of protein in half and that is the number of grams of carbs you tell your pump you are eating. But, gluconogenesis is a process, it doesn't always happen reliably, so bolusing for protein should be approached with caution.
     
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  3. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Thank you. I am not bolusing by any weight at the moment I’m doing it with very low doses. Eg. 10g guesstimate for breakfast and lunch and 15g for dinner. Last 2 days is showing good improvement, but of course on majority basal. Either way it’s novorapid as it’s the pump. Just want to be sure I’m doing the right thing
     
  4. Kristin251

    Kristin251 LADA · Expert

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    I am keto. Under 20 total carbs, not net. I keep my protein moderate as I gluconeogenisis like a rock star. I divide 45 g into 5 small snacky meals. Then I eat fat to satisfy.

    My carbs mostly come from avocado, macadamia and pecans. I tend to keep saturated fats on the low end as they take much longer to digest and keep me higher much longer. If I have a hamburger I have to bolus twice. I also prebolus 30 min before as protein turns to bg very fast for me.

    Now I eat pretty much the same macros at each meal and know my bolus for each time of day. I stay very flat basing my meals on a little protein and some avocado.

    The think is, in the UK 5 oz of avo is 3 NET carbs. Here in the US it’s 12 total and it acts like 12 for me.

    My insulin needs reduced. LOT and I had a few hypos along the way. Error on the side of caution with insulin. Better to be a tad high than a low
     
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  5. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    I’ve been on 2 eggs and 1 bacon breakfast
    Small salad with cheese at lunch
    Fish or chicken with broccoli or green beans for dinner
    Blood sugars improving
    On a lot more basal than bolus and giving for approx 10-15g guesstimate at meals for non existent carbs
    On about 50 units total insulin a day... not dissimilar to what I was on 10 - 20 years ago and still grimes weight !
     
  6. Kristin251

    Kristin251 LADA · Expert

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    Are you adding enough fat? Far slows the bg down. Like some nuts or avocado? Coooking in some butter?
     
  7. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    I’m following a Fat keto book and so have used a little rapeseed oil and mayonnaise and sometimes cheese. Since stopping the carbs I’ve stopped the extended boluses and had standard immediate doses and it seems to be ok at the moment.
    Tonight bloods come down to 4.2 before bed so I reduced my basal dose on my pump and after a few minutes I had a sweet and now I’m at 5. Sugars improved.... time will tell if I get to lose any weight too.... don’t normally but I’m really really hoping this time it will work. Test strips showing up small to medium ketones
     
  8. Kristin251

    Kristin251 LADA · Expert

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    I’m on a fb keto forum called common sense keto. Protein and carbs seem right but fat seems too bigh. Might try otnbut my stomach hates food. Could be just a matter of the right fats.
    For me the remmendations are 20 or less carbs per day and 1400 fats holy man that’s a lot of fat!!
     
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  9. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    2am and bloods still at 5 but awake and feeling like my sugars are starting to drop... or just feeling weaker.....not staying awake so dialled basal down again and see what morning brings ... expect to dial it up at breakfast
     
  10. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Holding its own at 5 this morning! No need to increase basal! Pretty good all day! Didn’t expect that....now basal in the -10% and -20% instead of the + 10% and + 20% it has been for a long time. Pleased. One small step at a time. How great if it lasted and if I get to lose weight too!
     
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  11. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Bloods were great until about 3 days ago. My insulin had dropped. My basal dropped from my own +20% to -20%.....I was so pleased.
    But then sugars started going up and so has the basal and need for correcting whilst adjusting my basal. Today I did a ‘ set temp basal’ of 110% on top of my +20%.... got the sugars balanced until the temp setting ended. Bloods up in the 9- 12’s
    I’ve not changed my food or what I’m doing
    No weight loss either
    Disappointed and don’t know why sugars rising
     
  12. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Nearly a month in a no weight loss. Still needing a lot of insulin after initial drop. Disappointed
     
  13. novorapidboi26

    novorapidboi26 Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    So it sounds like the majority of your insulin is your basal dose....

    How much is that out of curiosity.....?

    I am on anything up to 40 units in day.....and I am carrying extra weight....

    Have you tried increasing your activity levels.....?
     
  14. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Basal around 44.....
    I have ME and fibro so exercise is restricted, difficult and exhausting
    I do what I can
    Over weight and insulin resistant
     
  15. Kristin251

    Kristin251 LADA · Expert

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    What are your keto macros? You might be off there like not low enough carbs, too much protein
     
  16. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Sorry I don’t understand what a keto macro is?
    In a day I have bacon, egg, mushrooms, small toms, salmon, green beans, broccoli, sometimes chicken and sometimes avacado. Sometimes cauliflower and courgette.

    I bolus for approx 23 g carbs at breakfast lunch and dinner. On 44 basal but now needing to put that up too.
    Tried setting pump to 110% of my + 20 which is 44 for 5-8 hours in day for morning.
    Bloods between 7 - 12 now.
    I’ve tried setting bolus to drop feed me up to 2 hours for the bolus
     
  17. Kristin251

    Kristin251 LADA · Expert

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    Have you ever tracked your grams of protein carbs and fat?
    For true keto, it’s usally 20 carbs or less, 40-60 G protein for women and the rest is made up with fats to meet your calorie goal.
    Sounds like you might be over in carbs with all the veggies and avocado and too low in fat. Extra protein can raise bs.
    For me, if I don’t have enough fat in my meal I will spike. Also if I over eat protein or carbs.
    Here in the US many keto sites use total carbs, not net, so here, five oz of avo would be 13 carbs vs 3 there. I stay under 20 total as that’s what works for me. I keep my protein around 45g as I’m not that active. Just routine daily activity. Then I eat fat to satisfaction.
    In the beginning of keto it does pay to measure and weigh and track food until you have a better idea of macros.
    It’s usually alwasy 20 carbs or less. Some use net, some use total. 5%
    Protein ranges from 15-25%
    And fat 75-80%
    Those are the general ratios but it varies widely.
     
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  18. megan

    megan Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    I’m completely confused. I e been doing this again for over a month now. There was improvement over all in bloods but that’s stopped being great now. I take for approx 20 g of carbs in a bolus for each meal but there’s no ‘regular ‘ carbs in my meals.
    I stopped the bacon at breakfast so it’s just mushrooms, tomatoes and scrambled egg.
    Lunch is a bit of meat be it chicken or ham etc. With maybe some small amount of greens.
    Dinner similar to lunch.
    Some nuts then.
    No weight loss.
    My eyes get so tired trying to read all the info, I’m just not taking in any more.
    What am I doing wrong? Please any help and explain it to me like I’m a 5 year old please
     
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