Latest HbA1c result

Prem51 said:

Last month I was getting aches and twinges in my upper arms and knees. I thought it was probably arthritis, only to be expected at my age. But I thought I should see GP. When I saw him he thought it could be diabetes related and referred me for a HbA1c test.
I wasn't expecting to be tested until October. I had been a bit lax over the previous weeks, eating pizzas 2 or 3 times a week.
My daily readings had been on the high side, but had thought I could be stricter in September prior to the 12 month retest at beginning of October.
So with the earlier HbA1c I did expect my figure to be higher, probably in the high 40s. I thought that I would be happy with anything under 50.

I have been looking at my online records for the last 12 days, but the results weren't shown. I rang the surgery today and asked why my results weren't online yet. I was told I could call in for a printout, which I did.
So my HbA1c result is 48, back in the diabetic range but still lower than the 49 when I was diagnosed 4 years ago.

That's ok, it is within what I had expected. One advantage is that I will be able to ask my GP for 6 monthly HbA1c tests when I see him to review results. I have only been getting annual tests as I was told I was well controlled.
I did cut out the pizzas and the aches and twinges have got better.

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I feel for you Prem, I bet we have all done really well by adopting a certain approach and then somehow convince ourselves that slipping into old ways now and again (somehow) won't affect us....and then bam, we get an unwelcome reminder. I had a slice of WHITE toast the other day (first time in 2 years), couldn't be bothered to take a unit for it and up to 11 it went, NEVER seen a reading that high since diagnosis.

So ..for 4 years you ate better and managed an insidious foe
that has your own body twisting around to try and accommodate its
path to victory, before coming up against your implacable will
and eventually learning YOU are the Master and doing as YOU bid it..

and 4 years later, you find your STILL one step in front of the Demon.

I say THAT is a WIN.



Ok, ok, so really your not too happy, cos ya caved on certain occasions.
because cyborgs NEVER cave...right

But your not a cyborg or robot or android.
your flesh and bones..and we all weaken.

You know your gonna dust yourself down, get back in the ring and bash this demon one more time.

and that's what we all do.

Limit the damage, as much as we can.
Because Nothing is written that it's forever.

we fight today, tomorrow, and beyond.
and most days WE win..but sometimes we lose.

and then we change our tactics.

Because that's WHO we are.
survivors, fighters & don't give uppers...

You GOT this Prem.
forum rules prevent me saying it,
but *K.I.A..covers it..GO Prem
(*kick it's..... )

Can I ask a question or two? Are you consuming dairy, chicken or red meat??

Are you using any form of oil in your cooking??

Do you consume sodium when cooking, or add it directly onto your food??

Obviously some foods are inflammatory and affect the insulin response, such as the dreaded processed carbohydrates.

Can I suggest you look at Dr Jason Fung's lectures on Youtube and try some intermittent fasting? I've instituted this myself and reduced my eating window to under 4 hour a day, couped with walking and the results are promising since my diagnosis in May this year. My A1C was a horrifying 101mmol/L in May, and I've reduced it to 59mmol/L for the next batch of blood cells.

Using the same techique I'm expecting new testing on the 18th of September and I'm expecting a drop to approximately 43.66mmol/L. With luck it will be lower, as I've crossed the hump as regards a pain issue so my cortisol should be dropping, sleep improved and other issues that contribute to a poor insulin sensitivity.

You can effectively drop your A1C by 8% down to 5% o a weekly basis without medication by cycling on and off ketosis and burning off excess weight, and improving the hormones and so on with autophagy. It's not hard and doesn't require any medication or supplements.

And if I can do it, with a third of my ankle ripped off anyone can! I'm documenting my results on an excel spreadsheet and will happily share the diet etc which is pretty easy as it's mostly non-starchy veggies, which should be in everyone's diet anyway.

My next task is addressing the higher triglycerides, but first things first, improved insulin response & A1C.

CatManRob said:

Can I ask a question or two? Are you consuming dairy, chicken or red meat??

Are you using any form of oil in your cooking??

Do you consume sodium when cooking, or add it directly onto your food??

Obviously some foods are inflammatory and affect the insulin response, such as the dreaded processed carbohydrates.

Can I suggest you look at Dr Jason Fung's lectures on Youtube and try some intermittent fasting? I've instituted this myself and reduced my eating window to under 4 hour a day, couped with walking and the results are promising since my diagnosis in May this year. My A1C was a horrifying 101mmol/L in May, and I've reduced it to 59mmol/L for the next batch of blood cells.

Using the same techique I'm expecting new testing on the 18th of September and I'm expecting a drop to approximately 43.66mmol/L. With luck it will be lower, as I've crossed the hump as regards a pain issue so my cortisol should be dropping, sleep improved and other issues that contribute to a poor insulin sensitivity.

You can effectively drop your A1C by 8% down to 5% o a weekly basis without medication by cycling on and off ketosis and burning off excess weight, and improving the hormones and so on with autophagy. It's not hard and doesn't require any medication or supplements.

And if I can do it, with a third of my ankle ripped off anyone can! I'm documenting my results on an excel spreadsheet and will happily share the diet etc which is pretty easy as it's mostly non-starchy veggies, which should be in everyone's diet anyway.

My next task is addressing the higher triglycerides, but first things first, improved insulin response & A1C.

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Hi @CatManRob

Nice informative post.

for the trigs, i found for me, over the course of oct 2018 to june 2019, LCHF did the trick.
(weird how the world of food we thought we KNEW gets turned upside down...huh )

my numbers if of interest.
2.46 aug..first dx
2.49 oct 6 weeks eatwell
2.21 jan 3 months LCHF
1.21 june 8 months LCHF

You are doing so well and you will soon bring down your readings again.

Hope the aches and pains will soon improve.

Prem51 said:

@CatManRob Yes I do eat dairy, chicken and red meat. I use olive oil and coconut oil for cooking, sometimes butter.
I do use probably too much salt, but that has never been a problem for me.
Before getting the aches and twinges I had been drinking more milk than usual. I was having protein milk shakes at midday instead of eating. I did think that the milk might have been something to do with the aches.

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Ah, there's your problem!

Start eating more beans (Pinto/Butter/Kidney/Black Beans) as they will blunt your insulin response. Cut out dairy entirely as it's entirely inflammatory to your endothelium cells (the delicate lining of your arteries). Then it's a case of chow down as much broccoli & cauliflower as is possible & your arteries will remove the plaque which leads to cardiac events.

If you look for a book or lectures by cardiologist Dr. Caudwell Esselstyn who works out of the Cleveland Clinic, his programme is straight forward & easy to follow. He's also to be found on Youtube & lectures on a regular basis.

Unfortunately chicken is as bad for you as is red meat. It's inflammatory & the sooner you cut it out of the diet you'll notice as improvement, though they seem to think the cheese, in particular, is the hardest food item to give up!

It's basically sort of a race between getting positive electrons on food to suck out the oxidised cholesterol behind the layer of plaque that sits behind the endothelium lining of the artery. The macrophages pull the oxidised muck out of the tissue, back through the lining wall, back into the bloodstream and the body then flushes the nasties away.

Unfortunately, due to industry lobbying, the good old meat industry sees to it that we're all told to consume meat like it's going out of style, with the dairy and it's damaging and clogging our arteries. That's lobbying for you!

Find a good recipe of vegetarian 'Chilli Con Carne' without using any oil and throw in plenty of beans!! Your arteries will thank you & what's apparent in the lectures/book you can see the arterial plaque removed in the arteries to and from the heart.

If you want more info just ask. I'd post links for the videos for you to watch, but as I joined the site yesterday I cannot yet.

jjraak said:

Hi @CatManRob

Nice informative post.

for the trigs, i found for me, over the course of oct 2018 to june 2019, LCHF did the trick.
(weird how the world of food we thought we KNEW gets turned upside down...huh )

my numbers if of interest.
2.46 aug..first dx
2.49 oct 6 weeks eatwell
2.21 jan 3 months LCHF
1.21 june 8 months LCHF

Click to expand...

Hiya,

I'm trying to combine a veggie diet with higher fat, with intermittent fasting, but nobody has yet done a large scale study to see what medical effects this approach will yeald.

So I'm sort of my own experiment, using something like ketosis, but with carbohydrates still present. It's complicated because I'm allowing for extra cortisol due to a pain issue, and then it's a case of readdressing the triglycerides.

Nobody has done it, because I suppose nobody gives a hoot about a healthy diet which would eliminate type 2 diabetes and cut down on cardiovascular events because there too much money dangling out there from pharma companies.

I don't think there's a broccoli lobby? So my best friends are Walnuts/Macadamia/Brazil nuts along with the avocado.

I'm doing more blood tests on the 18th September, so I'll keep you all posted to see what the fasting glucose has dropped to and the A1C i'm expecting to be hopefully down below 44mmol/L. I've already noticed feeling a lot better, so I suspect I might be already under the 48mmol/L point of official diagnosis.

CatManRob said:

Hiya,

I'm trying to combine a veggie diet with higher fat, with intermittent fasting, but nobody has yet done a large scale study to see what medical effects this approach will yeald.

So I'm sort of my own experiment, using something like ketosis, but with carbohydrates still present. It's complicated because I'm allowing for extra cortisol due to a pain issue, and then it's a case of readdressing the triglycerides.

Nobody has done it, because I suppose nobody gives a hoot about a healthy diet which would eliminate type 2 diabetes and cut down on cardiovascular events because there too much money dangling out there from pharma companies.

I don't think there's a broccoli lobby? So my best friends are Walnuts/Macadamia/Brazil nuts along with the avocado.

I'm doing more blood tests on the 18th September, so I'll keep you all posted to see what the fasting glucose has dropped to and the A1C i'm expecting to be hopefully down below 44mmol/L. I've already noticed feeling a lot better, so I suspect I might be already under the 48mmol/L point of official diagnosis.

Click to expand...

Hi CatManRob,
Sorry to disappoint you on your uniqueness. A Veggie version of LCHF is still as much LCHF as a Carnivore version. So I think you are wrong when you say you are the first to do it. Many people from India/Pakistan are vegetarians, and I know several have been doing LCHF - so I am 99% sure that you aren't even in the first 100 to do so. But since Vegetarians and Vegans are still in the minority in the UK (though in the majority in LaMolina, USA - one of the so-called Blue Zones where people live longer), nobody has yet found enough to do an exclusive study on them.

Veggie LCHF is quite do-able, however Vegan LCHF is very tough because substituting beans for protein instead of Egg and Cheese, raises the total Carb intake!

Or are you talking about a Moderate Carb High Fat version - again that has been done before since some T2's can tolerate much more Carbs than others.

I personally had a 3x Coronary Artery Bypass in December 2016 and I'm very thankful that I can do ( and actually do) LCHF without giving up fatty meat. Because all the recent evidence shows that LCHF lowers Triglycerides which together with damaged LDL (not usually picked up on Lipid Test) and 'Remnant Cholesterol' are the really bad particles in your Blood. Several researchers (reputable Medical professionals) have claimed that blaming LDL for CVD is like blaming Policemen for crime - because they are almost always seen at the scene.

What do you mean about there being no broccoli lobby? Most (non-carnivore) LCHF adherents use both broccoli and cauliflower as rice substitutes (known as cauliflower rice and broccoli rice). You can even buy 'cauliflower rice' in supermarkets.

Are you testing before and after meals with a Blood Glucose Meter? - If not, since you are attempting to control T2D with diet alone, I strongly suggest that you do so. It is crazy that the NHS expect people to manage their T2D by diet when only having their Glucose checked with months between Hba1c tests.

CatManRob said:

Cut out dairy entirely as it's entirely inflammatory to your endothelium cells (the delicate lining of your arteries).

Click to expand...

CatManRob said:

Unfortunately chicken is as bad for you as is red meat. It's inflammatory & the sooner you cut it out of the diet you'll notice as improvement

Click to expand...

You’re making some pretty bold, blanket claims there @CatManRob

Are you able to provide some evidence to back up those claims? They certainly don’t fit with my personal experience so I’d be interested to understand the basis on which you’re making them.

Goonergal said:

You’re making some pretty bold, blanket claims there @CatManRob

Are you able to provide some evidence to back up those claims? They certainly don’t fit with my personal experience so I’d be interested to understand the basis on which you’re making them.

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Contact the President of the Association of Cardiologists in the USA, a Dr. Kim Williams. I'll take his clinical experience over anyone posting on any forum any day of the week.

He's at the top of his profession, obviously. If you want to revue the clinical data feel free, at it's out there in the public domain.

ianf0ster said:

Hi CatManRob,
Sorry to disappoint you on your uniqueness. A Veggie version of LCHF is still as much LCHF as a Carnivore version. So I think you are wrong when you say you are the first to do it. Many people from India/Pakistan are vegetarians, and I know several have been doing LCHF - so I am 99% sure that you aren't even in the first 100 to do so. But since Vegetarians and Vegans are still in the minority in the UK (though in the majority in LaMolina, USA - one of the so-called Blue Zones where people live longer), nobody has yet found enough to do an exclusive study on them.

Veggie LCHF is quite do-able, however Vegan LCHF is very tough because substituting beans for protein instead of Egg and Cheese, raises the total Carb intake!

Or are you talking about a Moderate Carb High Fat version - again that has been done before since some T2's can tolerate much more Carbs than others.

I personally had a 3x Coronary Artery Bypass in December 2016 and I'm very thankful that I can do ( and actually do) LCHF without giving up fatty meat. Because all the recent evidence shows that LCHF lowers Triglycerides which together with damaged LDL (not usually picked up on Lipid Test) and 'Remnant Cholesterol' are the really bad particles in your Blood. Several researchers (reputable Medical professionals) have claimed that blaming LDL for CVD is like blaming Policemen for crime - because they are almost always seen at the scene.

What do you mean about there being no broccoli lobby? Most (non-carnivore) LCHF adherents use both broccoli and cauliflower as rice substitutes (known as cauliflower rice and broccoli rice). You can even buy 'cauliflower rice' in supermarkets.

Are you testing before and after meals with a Blood Glucose Meter? - If not, since you are attempting to control T2D with diet alone, I strongly suggest that you do so. It is crazy that the NHS expect people to manage their T2D by diet when only having their Glucose checked with months between Hba1c tests.

Click to expand...

There are no medical clinical trials recorded studying a higher fat diet that is purely based on non-animal based products. Maybe you misunderstood. And yes, I do know other people in the past have been vegetarians. Nobody has studied a medical trial is the point I am making, and I've searched the medical literature. That was the point I was making, not that I'm the first person who discovered what an avocado is, obviously.

You know the liver makes the cholesterol I assume?

I think you also misunderstood my comment regarding a 'Brocolli lobby'. I meant that in that there's no lobby up on the hill that is lobbying for broccoli consumption, unlike the meat and dairy industries. I'm not advocating eating one way or another, it's everyone's choice how they want to eat, but if you look up how autophagy works, and how antioxidants work by providing a receptor for pulling out the muck from arterial plaque, if you want to listen to a cardiologist then contact Dr. Caudwell Esselstyn at the Cleveland clinic and look how he's reversed peoples heart disease. It's impressive data and you can read all about it for yourself in his book "How to Prevent & Cure Heart Disease".

I'm not interested in a debate on the pro's and cons of peoples dietary choices. I'll simply direct you to the data ad if you want to argue with the man who conducted the study at the Cleveland Clinic be my guest!

I absolutely agree regarding LDL by the way, and mine is double what I should be, but I'm inured, in pain and the function of the cholesterol is to obviously be the building blocks of hormones & the repair mechanism of the body. I'm not interested in particle size either, but what I'm most concerned with is getting the arterial plaque out, so I'll eat broccoli till the cows come home if I have to.

I found a video by an anesthesiologist a Dr. Micheal Klapper on the LDL/Endotheliam subject yesterday on Youtube yesterday by coincidence, but I cannot post links yet as I haven't posted enough. If you want to learn more about protecting the endothelium & removing the plaque from the arteries, this would be a good place to start and it will save me explaining the biochemistry as his presentation was pretty good. He would also agree regarding the elevated levels of cholesterol, LDL level and particle size etc as if you watch the video yourself you'll be aware and see some surgical clips of fat being pulled out by tweezers during an operation, while a patient has his chest cavity cracked open.

I don't know how people do the operations carving up humans themselves, but I take my hat off to them that they are able to do it. And if I have the choice of having my chest cracked open, or start eating broccoli and cauliflower as a preventative measure, I'm definitely going that to do that!

It's an interesting presentation, & highly informative, from a qualified professional. Therefore, i'll listen to what he has to say! If anyone wants to debate about inflammation or ask me to post links for you, please instead of asking me to provide medical data, which your not paying me to do, please go over to good old Youtube, and look for practically any video with Dr. Micheal Klapper and if you disagree from there, please direct your comments towards him.

He may enjoy the arguments. He may enjoy educating the public. But I'm only interested in preferably large scale, well funded clinical research that's in the public domain, from reliable sources such as the BMJ, The Lancet, PubMed, and the various nutritional journals, which are peer-reviewed & can be replicated.

And if you want to shortcut a huge learning curve, feel free to ask me a question, but if you want me to search 'Pubmed' for a clinical study to provide a quote so people can argue on an internet forum I'm really not interested! This isn't directed to you specifically, but in general, as it's my experience people will argue about the weather on the internet, never mind medical research!

Quite simply, you have to take some responsibility and you'll learn more by studying the medical literature without some poor sod like me being asked to find you a link on 'Elsevier.com' that's behind a paywall that you won't be able to read unless you pay $6 for a copy of the document or whatever it is for the relevant medical research papers.

I'll do it for the purpose of publishing, where there's a point, but not where people want to debate pointlessly on the internet.

That would be a waste of my time, wouldn't it? I'm quite surprised so far by some of the things that are asked, such as the side effects of Metformin, which are available by a simple 'google' search.

My diet modality is based on medical evidence, and best advice, but I might still get hit by a bus crossing the road in the morning. But that's life.




It must have been quite unnerving having the bypasses.

Read the above posts for the doctors names, go to their websites and search their databases, and I believe NutritionFacts.Org does a have a searchable video subject database on any subject, and that is a 501C registered organisation run by a qualified doctor, a Dr.Micheal Gregor.

Don't take my word for it. Instead of asking me for data you can see many of the studies that may interest you that are educational and are free and you'll be able to see the study numbers, of which many are on Elsevier for example.



Use the aforementioned doctor's websites or at least use google, or read the medical literature if you have access to it.

Edited by a moderator.

This thread has now diverted a long way from the original poster’s comments on his latest HbA1c result. Please can we now revert to topic.

Sounds as if you had a pretty positive meeting with your GP which is great for you and the bonus is another HbA1c in 6 months. I am pretty sure you will be able to get your levels back down to the range you are comfortable with by then. Guess its Pizza on the back burner for a time.

Hi @Prem51,

Sorry, must have missed the thread earlier. You've done really great to keep blood sugars under control for such a long time. This is definitely something to emulate. I am confident your next HbA1c will be lower again. Also well done on convincing your GP to schedule the next HbA1c in six months' time.