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Lesson Learned

James123a

Member
Messages
10
Hi Folks,

I was diagnosed some months back with Type 2. I was given a grace period to try diet and exercise. I have cut sugar out of tea and coffee ect and tryed to adjust diet in other areas. However recent diabetes review has shown this not to be enough. So I've been given Metformin 500mg to be taken twice a day with meals and have been on these for 3 days now and have cut booze from the diet and gone completely healthy.

Before the meds, my blood sugar was mid teens...13.6 at review and some 15-16 on home tests.

However with meds and diet, my blood sugar has not really gone down much if at all.....even with the new diet. Last night I had wholegrain pasta with a roast chicken breast using a pesto sause and nothing the rest of the night....came down this morning to do a fasting blood test and it was 11.7 !!!!

Is this normal....does it take time for the pills and diet to take effect ?

I have a doctors appointment in Jan to review.
 
Re: Leason Learned

Hi James
You don't say what you eat, apart from last night's meal of pasta, chicken and pesto. Are you eating lots of carbohydrate? I'm T2, diet controlled and have found that I can't tolerate many carbs :( If I eat pasta with a meal my BS goes haywire. As you read round the forum you'll see that we can tolerate different things, so it's just a thought - if it was me, I'd be checking my carb intake and trying to reduce it, but others with more experience than me will be along later :D
Lynne
 
Re: Leason Learned

Hi James and welcome to the forum!
I was diagnosed type2 earlier this year. I bought a monitor and test strips even though the Doc said we don't need to test. How can you know what effect food has on your levels if you don't test? Ask your Doc for a meter and strips next time you go, some are lucky and get them, others have to buy their own.

I have found that I can't tolerate many carbs. If you post what you are eating for meals then we can give you some suggestions to bring your levels down.

This is the info given to people newly diagnosed.

BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEWLY DIAGNOSED DIABETICS

Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you’ll find well over 30,000 people who are demonstrating this.

On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

The role of carbohydrate

Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

The bad news

Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

The good news

People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

Controlling your carbs

The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.
There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

Reduce your carbohydrate intake
Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates

Reduce your carbohydrates
A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

Choosing better carbohydrates

Another option is to replace ‘white carbohydrates’ (such as white bread, white rice, white flour etc) with whole grain varieties. The idea behind having whole grain varieties is that the carbohydrates get broken down slower than the white varieties –and these are said to have a lower glycaemic index.
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/food/diabetes ... rains.html

The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes

Eating what works for you

Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes

Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)

Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l

Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)

Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l

However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

Access to blood glucose test strips
The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education


Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic

Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.

Hope I've managed to copy that okay!

Ann
 
Re: Leason Learned

captainlynne said:
Hi James
You don't say what you eat, apart from last night's meal of pasta, chicken and pesto. Are you eating lots of carbohydrate? I'm T2, diet controlled and have found that I can't tolerate many carbs :( If I eat pasta with a meal my BS goes haywire. As you read round the forum you'll see that we can tolerate different things, so it's just a thought - if it was me, I'd be checking my carb intake and trying to reduce it, but others with more experience than me will be along later :D
Lynne

Thanks Lynne, I have had mixed advice already. I guess I need to let my local GP and Sister advise me, because they are qualified and will have more experience on the condition than I.

I do strongly suspect you are right however, and it will be a case of finding a balance and even adjusting portion sizes. I would have expected the drug to take some effect however...but perhaps too early yet. I do eat a fair amount of red meat, and yes carbs. And up until recently, bad at late night eating with again wrong foods for someone overweight...cheese and crisps !

But this last visit is the wake up call...if I allow my blood sugar to remain high then I can only expect serious ramifications for my health...and with a first baby on the way, I want to be healthy. It was a big bowl of pasta, so next time will cut the portion size down and add some veg to the plate.
 
Re: Leason Learned

I've also started a diary of what I'm taking in...so this morning'

27g sachet of Quaker Original oats with 180ml of milk
2 x Hovis Seed Sensation toast with I can't believe it's not butter....I can !
Apple
Large mug of white coffee
My 500mg Metformin

Lunch will be mixed bean salad and probably some bread or heinz soup.

Dinner will be stir fry with prawns and some noodles.

And I've been drinking carbonated water with meals lately.

Just taken another blood test...14.6 :shifty:
 
Re: Leason Learned

James. Don't expect miracles with Metformin good though it is. A typical dose will only move your BS down by around 1% point. Diet and exercise are very important and perhaps, like me, you may have to take further meds, each helping a bit. Now call me a cynic but many on this forum have found some poor diet advice from the NHS professionals. Often they will offer advice and prescribe medication and not listen to what the patient feeds back hence may not learn as much as they could about the effects of diet versus the meds. Many of us find we have to seriously reduce our carb intake and choose the right carbs i.e. low-GI. Your recent diet diary looks quite good but watch out for sugar added to almost everything. I suspect that soup had sugar added. Read all the labels. Cheese and meat are fine and so is alcohol in sensible quantities so life could be worse!
 
Re: Leason Learned

James123a said:
I've also started a diary of what I'm taking in...so this morning'

27g sachet of Quaker Original oats with 180ml of milk
2 x Hovis Seed Sensation toast with I can't believe it's not butter....I can !
Apple
Large mug of white coffee
My 500mg Metformin

Lunch will be mixed bean salad and probably some bread or heinz soup.

Dinner will be stir fry with prawns and some noodles.

And I've been drinking carbonated water with meals lately.

Just taken another blood test...14.6 :shifty:

Hi,
I am a type 2 on Metformin twice a day and I would suggest that you try just one of those things at a time for breakfast.

If I eat a sachet of quaker oats alone I would be in double figures.
Many of us cannot tolerate 2 slices of bread in one sitting, let alone with porridge!!
As for the apple they are a definate no go for me.

Lunch beans + bread + soup all contain carbs so all will have an effect.

Noodles and pasta are also pretty problematic for me too in any quantity.

Study how many carbs you are eating in one go and maybe think about spacing them out a little throughout the day rather than having a lot all at once.

Hope this helps.
Angie
 
Re: Leason Learned

James123a said:
27g sachet of Quaker Original oats with 180ml of milk
2 x Hovis Seed Sensation toast with I can't believe it's not butter....I can !
Apple
Large mug of white coffee
My 500mg Metformin

Lunch will be mixed bean salad and probably some bread or heinz soup.

Dinner will be stir fry with prawns and some noodles.

Good work on starting a good diary James. As well as just recording what you eat, it will also help you to write down the number of grams of carbohydrate that you are eating.

I've marked the obvious carbohydrate in the list above. Personally I'd steer well clear of bread, oatmeal, noodles and Heinz soup. You might eventually be able to eat some of these things in moderation, but until you get your BG under control, I'd cut them out altogether.

Diabetes sucks, doesn't it?
 
Re: Leason Learned

Thanks all...yup...having Diabetes does suck....major.....if I need to cut back heavy on the carbs then I guess I'd better get used to being hungry....

I had the stir fry with prawns, veg and noddles....then about 30 mins ago I had to eat something...so raiding the kitchen the best option I could was 5 wholegrain Krisprolls with Extra Light Laughing cow....and a tiny bit of chicken.....
 
Re: Leason Learned

James123a said:
I would have expected the drug to take some effect however...but perhaps too early yet. I do eat a fair amount of red meat, and yes carbs.

A maximum dose of Metformin is 1000mg twice a day and that will only drop your blood glucose levels by between 1 and 2 mmol/L so diet is even more important than Metformin.

The advice about cutting carbs is what works even if your doctor gives you conflicting information, 100% of the carbs we eat are turned into glucose a non diabetic simply releases more insulin to cover the carbs they eat we unfortunately do not have that luxury working for us, the only alternative is to cut them back to levels that do not raise our blood glucose levels above the NICE recommendations and if at all possible it is best to keep them below those as well.

The only way for you to know what amount of carbs is safe for you to eat is to test your blood glucose levels before and after each meal until you know exactly what you can eat and more importantly the quantities of carbs that you can eat. It seems hard at first but after a while it does get easier and once your bg levels are under control you will not have to test so often.

Ask your GP fort a test meter and if he says 'no' which is entirerly possible now the NHS is so strapped for cash then you must buy your own as it is the only way to control your blood sugars.
 
Re: Leason Learned

Thanks Daisy, I didn't realise that the links didn't work.

James, lots of us have found that we can control our diabetes by cutting carbs. I have found that once I had cut them I wasn't hungry like I expected to be, it's the carbs that make us hungry!

My typical breakfast is 30g Lizi's Granola, 1/2 of a 0% fat Total Yoghurt, a handfull of Raspberries and a couple of spoonfuls of seeds-pumpkin,sunflower and linseed. I fins it tastes yummy, has little effect on my glucose levels and keeps me going till lunch with no hunger pangs.

My Doctors say we should eat carbs with every meal and suggest wholemeal bread, brown rice etc. I can't manage these, but I can manage 2 slices of Burgen Soya and Linseed, meat or cheese and a bit of salad. Wholemeal bread, wholemeal pasta and brown rice all affect me the same as the white versions. Cutting carbs has also had the bonus of weight loss for me, 2st since I was diagnosed.

Ann
 
Re: Leason Learned

Thanks again all, and Ann, thanks for the suggested breakfast, I am going to try it myself....

Went to M&S today for lunch and got a tuna salad and some prawns...it did have some pasta mixed through it, but left most of it....so there is a start....I just need to accept the condition and get on with it like the rest of us.

A work mate has a family member who ignored his diabetes and continued as normal....he is in a bad way now and needs several injections daily....really really don't want to go there !
 
Re: Leason Learned

Well since last post I've been out and got 2 bags of Lizi's Granola....come in a fancy bag too ! Only thing I could not get in my local Tesco was the raspberries....

And got a nice tub of savoury seed blend from the food doctor brand....very tasty they are too !
 
Re: Leason Learned

Well done James it is hard at first but there are lots of things you can eat it is just a case of thinking out of the box :!: Try lots of meat and fish ,cheese veg I eat very dark choc with almonds melted in it for a snack also lots of nuts I have walnuts in double cream .Enjo :)
CAROL
 
Re: Leason Learned

Hi James,
We may not be doctors LOL, but sometimes we should be as we know our own bodies LOL, but we have experienced some of the things you are going through. It may take time for the Metformin to get into your system, so do give it time, as you say you have a review in Jan 2012. Just keep a record of sugars before and after meals and a record of what your eating.
I had a quick read of your intake for breakfast i have two weetabix with milk and thats all till lunch.
I have been a type 1 for 36yrs and am on 4 injections a day and 2 metformin tabs at breakfast and before bed.
Hope all goes well for you.
Take care.
Tracey
 
Re: Leason Learned

Tracey69 said:
I had a quick read of your intake for breakfast i have two weetabix with milk and thats all till lunch.
I have been a type 1 for 36yrs and am on 4 injections a day and 2 metformin tabs at breakfast and before bed.

Weetabix is probably OK for someone taking insulin, but probably not OK for a Metformin controlled T2. As Sid said, you need to get a meter and see for yourself how much various foods effect your blood glucose.
 
Don't dispare yet!! Ive only recently learnt all about carbs n diabetes through this forum as my hubby Is diabetic and was having high readings too so for a week I just cut back on his carbs having wholewheat bread pasta and not much of it. He loves a beer so brought holsten pills and coors light and made cakes using whole-wheat flour. He didn't find this too hard and honestly after one week he lost 4 lb and his sugars went down from 15 to 7.7 this week as it's Christmas he hasn't been cutting back and they are back up to 15!!
Cutting back on carbs works but don't cut them all out try and lower them gradually while testing each day and you will soon find what works for you. Diabetes doesn't have to rule you. Just a week ago my hubby was so depressed at his sugars and now with help from people on here we are so much more positive. Good luck mate and listen to people on here they know more than the drs do!!!!! X
 
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