Limiting carb intake v "5 a day"

debs248

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I'm trying to strike a balance between limiting my carb intake while still eating at least 5 portions of veg per day. As I'm also generally only eating one full sized meal plus one or two snacks, this is proving to be a real headache!

I've noticed that nowhere in any of the low carb resources I've been following is there any mention of *how many* portions of veg to aim for in a day.

Does anyone here succeed in eating 5 or more veg a day while eating low carb? I'm trying for 35g carbs max per meal, up to about 100 per day. Is it even worth me trying, or should I just prioritise keeping the carbs down?
 

Antje77

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Does anyone here succeed in eating 5 or more veg a day while eating low carb? I'm trying for 35g carbs max per meal, up to about 100 per day.
Easy. For most veggies it takes a lot of them to come even close to 35 grams of carbs a meal, so if you just leave out the rice/spuds/bread/pasta you're not very likely to go over 35 grams a meal.

Where are you getting your nutritional information from?
If you use Google, the first result often says that sources include the USDA. In the US, fiber is included in the total carbs, in the UK and Europe the fibre is listed separately. If you use a US source, you'll need to subtract the fiber from the total carbs to calculate the 'net' carbs as we use them.
You don't want to count the fiber.
 

debs248

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Easy. For most veggies it takes a lot of them to come even close to 35 grams of carbs a meal, so if you just leave out the rice/spuds/bread/pasta you're not very likely to go over 35 grams a meal.
Trouble is I'm not eating those anyway (maybe once a week) so no wiggle room there. My carbs are coming mostly from dairy or veg that wouldn't be my first choice, such as carrots, pulses and leeks. As I'm not able to prepare my own food, I rely on other people's choices.

I think what I want to know is, is it better to eat eg peas and carrots, and go over on carbs, or reject them? I like most veg, so I'm hoping the answer is "eat them up, they're good for you overall despite the carbs"!
 

Antje77

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I think what I want to know is, is it better to eat eg peas and carrots, and go over on carbs, or reject them? I like most veg, so I'm hoping the answer is "eat them up, they're good for you overall despite the carbs"!
Do you use a glucose meter to see how you react to your meals by testing before and two hours after meals?
We're all different and a meter will show you how you deal with different veggies.
 

debs248

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I'm trying to test 4 times a day (first thing, before and after 1 meal and before bed) but still only getting a good blood drop about 2/3 of the time, so don't have a complete record.

Gliclazide seems to be masking any effects from food as 2 hours after a meal I'm generally 2mmol/l *below* the before meal reading.

My high readings are nearly always when I get up, after I've not eaten for over 9 hours, so surely can't be as a result of too many veg?

Just want to do the best I can diet wise, it's such a balancing act.
 
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AloeSvea

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Alas, the importance of '5 a day' is not a real nutritional piece of info backed up by science! It's actually a marketing slogan from, and I have read different countries for this, but the one I have read the most is - from the Canadian Fruit and Veg board. But folks love it I guess, as it has stuck around, to such an extent, we all, and me too once upon a time, believe it had been rigourously researched. But no. The five is arbitary, I take it.

I believe, if you are eating wholefoods, that you an pretty much let your body tell you how much veg you need! (If any?!) And even then, it probably boils down to personal taste. Ditto fruit.
 

KennyA

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I'm trying to test 4 times a day (first thing, before and after 1 meal and before bed) but still only getting a good blood drop about 2/3 of the time, so don't have a complete record.

Gliclazide seems to be masking any effects from food as 2 hours after a meal I'm generally 2mmol/l *below* the before meal reading.

My high readings are nearly always when I get up, after I've not eaten for over 9 hours, so surely can't be as a result of too many veg?

Just want to do the best I can diet wise, it's such a balancing act.
Your fasting morning readings are really testing what your liver is doing. Once your insulin response system has cleared additional glucose after food, variation is glucose levels is largely down to how your liver handles your levels. People's livers respond to all sorts of things - illness, stress, activity, etc. One of the things that often happens is that in the early morning, the liver will start making and adding glucose to the system. This is "fuel" to get you going as you wake up. It seems to happen to a lot of people, it's not a "diabetic" thing. It's just that diabetics tend to test blood sugars more often, so are more aware.

I've found with mine that this slow and steady increase will go on for hours - I eventually got bored at 2pm, but it will constantly inch up since 6.30 am when I first tested. I can turn it off by eating something - three almonds will do it. This seems to reassure my liver that I've found food and don't need further assistance.

As you're on glicazide, that will also affect what you see in test results.

I'm not too concerned about morning levels (which are usually the highest I'll see most days) and rarely eat anything until after noon, so I don't usually test in the mornings any more.
 

Greymalkin

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Interesting stuff.

After 18 months with the Libre 2 continuous glucose monitor, I believe I've thoroughly tested what I can get away with in terms of conventional carb-consumption.

I'm now persuaded that all foods which are based on processed starches are effectively laden with nearly-instant sugars once swallowed. They encompass virtually anything containing grains or potatoes, including the countless products based on them...so anything sold at a bakery, plus a shocking proportion of foods rarely identified as carb-heavy (like soups thickened with flour) are now off my menu.

It's dreadful how reliant we have become upon stable long shelf-life processed starches. They're everywhere, and it takes determination to avoid items we may have grown up mistakenly assuming were essentially healthy.

I say 'mistakenly' because while non-diabetics enjoy them without immediate problems (and the whole western world's agriculture and food-distribution economy is dominated by sustained over-consumption of them), the insulin spikes which even an entirely healthy person experiences, show that processed carbs aren't what anybody ought to be eating. They're bad news, but only diabetes patients are obliged to hear the message.

However, the incredible efficiency of supermarket supply has made it surprisingly easy for me to adjust to things that don't cause me much blood-glucose imbalance. These are mostly fresh vegetables.

Some helpful advice on a recent TV show: the doctor said eat vegetables before other items on the plate or other parts of the meal.

I don't know why, but that really helped me. My diet (which may seem radical until it is tried) involves starting the day with a bowl of small-chopped raw celery and carrot mixed with a handful of peanuts and chunks of good vintage Cheddar...plus a bowl of diced cucumber and cherry tomatoes with a can of mackerel in olive oil...hopefully the photo opens, here...

54544095539_77b87d32cd_c.jpg


...those are large bowls, so it's quite a lot of satisfying physical bulk, and having crunched it up and savoured the flavours, I'm really not hungry.

Later in the day, an omelette with broccoli, onion, red pepper and sliced courgette...plus large bowls of Romaine salad with radishes and olives, feta and nuts; carrot slices for scooping up home-made guacamole (I never ate avocado till I was over fifty...now I am happily addicted) and occasional slabs of 85% cocoa chocolate with walnuts and coffee, with the occasional orange or strawberry.

I am amazed how much I enjoy a diet that has largely ditched all the factory-foods I used to put away with insatiable gusto.

Last weekend my girlfriend and I spent three nights in a tent. Low-budget camping deserves a thread to itself, as a time which encourages catastrophically unhealthy eating. As a result of our profound discomfort at night, we allowed ourselves to eat anything at all in the daytimes. My blood-glucose (which is usually over 95% in range, and mainly within the much tighter 4.6 to 7.6mmols/L at which I set my alarms) went completely out of control. I hadn't been very greedy or unhealthy - I'd just eaten all the things I used to, every day of my life.

I reckon most of us grew up with a lot of terrible dietary habits that not even our doctors understand or work hard enough to dispel...

...but it can be done, and it's a delicious option. :)
 
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Sarah69

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I’d struggle to eat 5 portions of a veg a week let alone in a day!
 
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lovinglife

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Although I’m very much a meat eater I love my veg and I’m the same as @becca59, I need my veg with my meal. I love cold veggies as snacks too and would rather use my 20g allowance that I allow myself per day on my veg than anything else including chocolate or keto “sweet treats”

The food I miss most of all are fruits, I also loved my fruit before T2, I do eat berries now and then and use small portions of apple etc in my cooking but I do lament the days when I could have melon, pineapple etc - only thing I don’t miss is banana