Low Carb V Not Low Carb

[becca59]

Decided to start a new thread so I don’t hijack the Bernstein thread which has courted so much controversy.

The conundrum with this very subject, is I feel rooted in the difference between type 1 and type 2. As I’ve stated many times I am pretty low carb most of the time. However, if I wanted to eat them at various times, believe me I would, and indeed do so. Because I have the availability of insulin injections to enable me.
To live a carbless regime all the time takes discipline. This is why I take my hat off to those with type 2. For their health it is imperative that they take on board this different way of eating.

For type 1s life is very different. We take insulin artificially, which presents a whole new level of looking after ourselves. Each night when we climb into bed we need to know where we are on that glucose monitor and be aware of what insulin we may or may not have on board. This applies wether we eat low carb or not. I have seen plenty of low carbers on this forum who take insulin but still have problems with their basal needs because they are stressed, ill or for goodness sake the weather has changed. Low carbing doesn’t help with this. It requires a whole new level of monitoring that eating or not eating those above ground veg can solve.

The debate will go on, yes, but just to be provocative, all those people who demonise carbs.....If you hadn’t been diagnosed with diabetes I bet you would still be eating them quite happily, as indeed a large percentage of the population continue to do, without ever having any problems. Those who can inject insulin to counteract the effects can also manage their carb intake quite successfully. It takes dedication and lots of hard work and they should be given a clap and not made to feel like they are doing it wrong because they dare to eat a potato. We are all on this planet for such a short time. We each need to enjoy it in the best way possible.

Go forth and eat carbs, or indeed not, whatever is right for you and you alone.

Enjoy the fantastic weather everyone, and type 1s, keep an eye on those basal requirements!!!

 

[dbr10]

Decided to start a new thread so I don’t hijack the Bernstein thread which has courted so much controversy.

The conundrum with this very subject, is I feel rooted in the difference between type 1 and type 2. As I’ve stated many times I am pretty low carb most of the time. However, if I wanted to eat them at various times, believe me I would, and indeed do so. Because I have the availability of insulin injections to enable me.
To live a carbless regime all the time takes discipline. This is why I take my hat off to those with type 2. For their health it is imperative that they take on board this different way of eating.

 

[therower]

Hi @becca59. What a wonderful post. Everything you say is so correct.

 

[kev-w]

Seems I can't post in the Bernstein thread so I'm not ducking the thread

Carbs? I need them for fuel and to maintain my bodyweight, so I aim to eat the ones that best digest mimicking my injections uptake speed, brown rice, cooked rinsed cooled and reheated, I can eat a decent portion size home cooked without a spike, wholemeal pasta cooked the same but a slightly smaller portion as I find there's a point you can't inject enough to keep the spike down without hypoing, and that the rub with carbs for a t1, get them right and they work well, too many and they don't at all.

Do we ever discuss complex carbs and sugars? Do we ever look at the difference? Look at a few loaves of bread, carbs and 'of which sugars' white breads are higher, and you get to see patterns of what works with your insulin, I find lower fat works better too with meats, I find pork more likely to spike me than say chicken as the pork's the fattier meat, but then I eat pretty low fat as part of my training regime so mostly avoid pork.

I guess you don't find complex carbs in processed food, and that stuff can't be healthy, I rarely eat chips, never eat crisps (or scratchings, lovely as they are) and a pie would be a very rare treat, I'd only take carbs from chocolate if it was a mars bar @ 27g pre swim, I never eat sweets or cakes (tho I did do a cream cake mid hypo a few weeks back whilst shopping).

Anyway, 150g or so carbs a day is an ok amount for an 80kg T1 guy.

 

[becca59]

@kev-w I agree re complex carbs. I know everyone says that all carbs turn into sugar but it is also the speed that they do that is important. I make my own brown bread, which travels a lot lot slower than white.
Sounds like you are bang on with your management to me.

 

[Fairygodmother]

Hi @becca59, how refreshing to find a place to talk about carb away from the influence of Bernstein.
I agree that for some people, especially T2s, and some T1s who find it helps with control, going low carb can be beneficial, but I fear that the whole media-hype, vlog epidemic and diet plan roller coaster has taken it to fad levels.
I’ve attached an article from Harvard Uni that shows the benefits of eating whole grains. It includes studies that have suggested that whole grains confer health benefits that are lost when grains are refined.
I’m saddened that carbs have become evil in many people’s minds.
They’ve all been corralled, without distinction, which I suppose is unsurprising given the public’s desire for simple solutions.
How long will it be, do you think, before carbs are forgotten and another simple solution becomes king? Or Queen?
https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/whole-grains/

 

[smc4761]

I have been low carbing for about 10 weeks now as a type 1 for over 35 years. This is not so much for getting better BG control, more to help me lose a bit of weigh, which it has done. For 4/5 days of week I will low carb mainly Monday to Thursday where I am eating around 100 g of carbs compared to my usual 180/200 g

I am not too strict though as it is bacon rolls on Saturday and Chinese/ Indian Saturday night with the relevant increase in insulin

Where I am struggling now is my overnights. previously I was pretty good going to bed with a BG of 7 and staying pretty stable until 7am

For past 2 weeks however, going to bed with BG of 7 which stays OK until around 4 am then spikes to around 10/11at 7 am. Yup dawn phenomenen and cant think what may be causing this, low carb diet ???

 

[Knikki]

HMMM! Have only recently found out about Low Carb diets and not sure how good it is. Anyway I had 120grams of Carb for breakfast yesterday so guess I am not in that camp

 

[Diakat]

Surely the best dietary solution for any diabetic is something that:
Works for them
Is sustainable for them
And affordable for them?

 

[Circuspony]

Great post @becca59. Even pre diagnosis I didn't have a carb heavy diet but I need to gain rather than lose weight right now so taking carbs out of my diet wouldn't be healthy - even though it does level out my BG profile.

I think for me I would have liked a bit more on our carb counting course as to how some carbs are quickly absorbed and others take their time. Not all carbs have an equal relationship with insulin dosage and it's been trial and error working out how my body reacts.

They make it sound so easy. A ratio of 1:15 they told me - except if it's hot, cold, I'm ill, I'm exercising, I'm sitting still, I've got hayfever, I slept well / badly, eaten pasta, ice cream, planets not aligned correctly..... *sigh*

 

[LooperCat]

Beautifully written! I like low carb, as most of you know. It works for me, and I'm really enjoying the food I eat. My sugars are stable and in range for the first time in two decades.

I believe we all metabolise carbs and the insulin in our own way - some of us react to it all in such a way that the insulin action mimics the carb action perfectly, and it's relatively easy to match the two. While I say easy, I don't mean EASY per se, obviously! Nothing about being your own pancreas is simple. But if the medication we take works at the same speed as the food we eat, fantastic!

I seem to break down carbohydrate and insulin at different rates to each other, and that varies throughout the day, over a month, and is very dependent on how much sleep I've had. It's very inconsistent. I've tried fiddling with doses and timings for years and never been able to match it up. I'm not scared of experimenting, I used to be a scientist so numbers don't faze me either. Prebolusing for a carby meal has got me into trouble before, it doesn't often fit into eating as a family for me. Waiting until the insulin has started to kick in has often meant me eating before or after everyone else and it's important for us to eat together. We only have chance to have one meal a day together, and it's important to us that we do.

So I've found it easier to just minimise the main cause of my diabetes issues. I can't process carbs without medication, and the medication I use doesn't work well enough or consistently in my body to achieve healthy blood glucose levels.

I'm lazy, basically, and will usually default to the simplest option that gets me the results I want!

 

[Fairygodmother]

And why not, @Mel dCP! There’s no point stressing when having a life is about so much more than having T1.

 

[Wilber123]

Decided to start a new thread so I don’t hijack the Bernstein thread which has courted so much controversy.

The conundrum with this very subject, is I feel rooted in the difference between type 1 and type 2. As I’ve stated many times I am pretty low carb most of the time. However, if I wanted to eat them at various times, believe me I would, and indeed do so. Because I have the availability of insulin injections to enable me.
To live a carbless regime all the time takes discipline. This is why I take my hat off to those with type 2. For their health it is imperative that they take on board this different way of eating.

For type 1s life is very different. We take insulin artificially, which presents a whole new level of looking after ourselves. Each night when we climb into bed we need to know where we are on that glucose monitor and be aware of what insulin we may or may not have on board. This applies wether we eat low carb or not. I have seen plenty of low carbers on this forum who take insulin but still have problems with their basal needs because they are stressed, ill or for goodness sake the weather has changed. Low carbing doesn’t help with this. It requires a whole new level of monitoring that eating or not eating those above ground veg can solve.

The debate will go on, yes, but just to be provocative, all those people who demonise carbs.....If you hadn’t been diagnosed with diabetes I bet you would still be eating them quite happily, as indeed a large percentage of the population continue to do, without ever having any problems. Those who can inject insulin to counteract the effects can also manage their carb intake quite successfully. It takes dedication and lots of hard work and they should be given a clap and not made to feel like they are doing it wrong because they dare to eat a potato. We are all on this planet for such a short time. We each need to enjoy it in the best way possible.

Go forth and eat carbs, or indeed not, whatever is right for you and you alone.

Enjoy the fantastic weather everyone, and type 1s, keep an eye on those basal requirements!!!

Decided to start a new thread so I don’t hijack the Bernstein thread which has courted so much controversy.

The conundrum with this very subject, is I feel rooted in the difference between type 1 and type 2. As I’ve stated many times I am pretty low carb most of the time. However, if I wanted to eat them at various times, believe me I would, and indeed do so. Because I have the availability of insulin injections to enable me.
To live a carbless regime all the time takes discipline. This is why I take my hat off to those with type 2. For their health it is imperative that they take on board this different way of eating.

For type 1s life is very different. We take insulin artificially, which presents a whole new level of looking after ourselves. Each night when we climb into bed we need to know where we are on that glucose monitor and be aware of what insulin we may or may not have on board. This applies wether we eat low carb or not. I have seen plenty of low carbers on this forum who take insulin but still have problems with their basal needs because they are stressed, ill or for goodness sake the weather has changed. Low carbing doesn’t help with this. It requires a whole new level of monitoring that eating or not eating those above ground veg can solve.

The debate will go on, yes, but just to be provocative, all those people who demonise carbs.....If you hadn’t been diagnosed with diabetes I bet you would still be eating them quite happily, as indeed a large percentage of the population continue to do, without ever having any problems. Those who can inject insulin to counteract the effects can also manage their carb intake quite successfully. It takes dedication and lots of hard work and they should be given a clap and not made to feel like they are doing it wrong because they dare to eat a potato. We are all on this planet for such a short time. We each need to enjoy it in the best way possible.

Go forth and eat carbs, or indeed not, whatever is right for you and you alone.

Enjoy the fantastic weather everyone, and type 1s, keep an eye on those basal requirements!!!

Well this has made me think. I was dignosed a few weeks back but only prediabetic
The Diabetic nurse advocates carbs but to many in my opinion. But are they really so bad. Perhaps now and agin won’t hurt or will they. I’m so new I don’t know.
Great post.

 

[dbr10]

Well this has made me think. I was dignosed a few weeks back but only prediabetic
The Diabetic nurse advocates carbs but to many in my opinion. But are they really so bad. Perhaps now and agin won’t hurt or will they. I’m so new I don’t know.
Great post.

Test. Eat. Test again. How else would you know? What would you feed someone who was carbohydrate intolerant?

 

[Alison Campbell]

Well this has made me think. I was dignosed a few weeks back but only prediabetic
The Diabetic nurse advocates carbs but to many in my opinion. But are they really so bad. Perhaps now and agin won’t hurt or will they. I’m so new I don’t know.
Great post.

I agree that @becca59 's post is interesting to read as it is a type 1's perpective balancing carb intake with (lifesaving) insulin.

This is not applicable to me as someone with pre-d because I cannot manage my higher than normal blood sugar levels with insulin or any other medications.

My tools for managing blood glucose are carb restriction, managing stress, sleep and exercise. My motivation levels vary day to day, sometimes minute by minute but I understand what works for me at the moment thanks to finding this forum over 6 years ago.

 

[LooperCat]

I agree that @becca59 's post is interesting to read as it is a type 1's perpective balancing carb intake with (lifesaving) insulin.

This is not applicable to me as someone with pre-d because I cannot manage my higher than normal blood sugar levels with insulin or any other medications.

My tools for managing blood glucose are carb restriction, managing stress, sleep and exercise. My motivation levels vary day to day, sometimes minute by minute but I understand what works for me at the moment thanks to finding this forum over 6 years ago.

As a T1, obviously insulin is a miracle drug. However, as good as modern insulins are, they’re not a patch on a pancreas with its complex feedback systems - it’s a very blunt instrument, especially on MDI as opposed to a pump. The smallest dose I can inject is half a unit, which drops me by 1-1.5mmol depending on the time of day. It’s like trying to mend a watch with a hammer sometimes. Pumpers can use smaller doses and get much finer control. Fewer carbs means less insulin, and less chance of getting it wrong, overcompensating and adding up hypo. I do feel a lot safer for it, I have to say.

 

[Alison Campbell]

As a T1, obviously insulin is a miracle drug. However, as good as modern insulins are, they’re not a patch on a pancreas with its complex feedback systems - it’s a very blunt instrument, especially on MDI as opposed to a pump. The smallest dose I can inject is half a unit, which drops me by 1-1.5mmol depending on the time of day. It’s like trying to mend a watch with a hammer sometimes. Pumpers can use smaller doses and get much finer control. Fewer carbs means less insulin, and less chance of getting it wrong, overcompensating and adding up hypo. I do feel a lot safer for it, I have to say.

There are over 400 medication options for type 2 and nothing even close to a miracle either. I think we need to respect and support each other as adults managing or preventing diabetes and it's complications. I also think we need to stop polarising the debate and share common ground. It's not 0 carbs or 300g plus a day for most members of this forum and even if it is, if it works for you great.

 

[Resurgam]

I have never been able to eat carbs without putting on weight so I began to eat low carb decades ago - it was never much of a problem except when my doctors found out and went ballistic about the danger of it - yet the diets they put me on caused me to put on weight, feel terrible and lose the ability to function normally.
I think that I was only diagnosed as I was on a cholesterol lowering diet - which I suspect raised rather than lowered my results as I was always being interrogated about my compliance, and accused of cheating.
For me the only way of eating which seems to be a panacea is low carb with modest amounts of fat and I never felt absolutely well on any other scheme.

 

[kev-w]

I've found a 300g pot of potato salad @ around 30g carbs to be a nice make weight when having a 700g supermarket best fish pie for 2 @ 70g carbs requiring 4.5u Humalog, no spike but if I was to eat a portion of Tilda brown rice @ 60g carbs with it instead I spike high even with a couple of extra units and anymore gives me a drop at the tail end.

Then again the Tilda pre cooked rice is nearly 10g/100g higher than the brown basmati I cook myself.

 

[Alexandra100]

I like low carb, as most of you know. It works for me,

@Mel dCP You are an inspiration and a comfort to me. I reckon I am pre-LADA, so I may very well end up on insulin myself sooner or later. Your success with low carb makes me think I may be able to manage like that too. And I love your glorious photos of food!