Vegan propaganda pure and simple.. and fairly ineffective for T2 unless you fancy no remission and worsening HbA1c over time.I understand the premise of their regime is that the cause of t2 diabetes and insulin resistance is fat and that it gets taken up by the cells and blocks glucose receptors in those cells and to eat the “goods” carbs.
What experience does anyone have, what are the “good or bad” points? Where is the argument strong and well evidenced? Where does it fall down?
For clarity I haven’t yet read or much about it, I’m just exploring the concept. Much as I did low carb before ploughing deeper into the science etc.
Which was my immediate reaction I’ll be honest. But I wanted to understand the theory a little better rather than make assumptions that simply confirm my own position.
I was reading on another forum about someone following this and achieving non diabetic bgl with barely any rise post prandial and normal hba1c eating 100+ carbs a meal.
For me the clue was in weight loss on adoption of this method and possibly the visceral fat loss allowing better function (back to professor Taylor of all people). There are definitely a group of type 2 that respond extremely well bgl wise to weight loss alone regardless of method. There are a number in this forum. Then there are others that do not respond to the weight loss in the same dramatic way (me for one).
Another explanatory the success could be in the previous diet being absolutely chock full of carbs and processed foods and any regime would be a vast improvement.
Now it’s easy for me to write the method and this individual’s experience off for one of these reasons but was interested if there were other legitimate explanations.
I personally believe there are many different ways the human body and diabetes type 2 interact. For some weight loss plays a significant part. I tend to think I am more in that camp purely because I can cope with more carbs than some. For others it does seem very linked to carb intake. others have good reaction to exercise. And many other combinations I am sureCheers for the link @Mbaker .
A congratulations to the gent, newly DX and tackling the issue.
Can't take that away from him.
(Could have been me, I was in such despair after DX)
Have to agree, the food limits, exercise & fasting do throw a little shade on the actual diet.
For my money, the age is the bigger confounder.
It's akin to tinkering with a F1 engine V a well used, poorly serviced 50 yr old family car, and thinking the same set of standards can be applied to both.
Assuming for many, T2D creeps up as we age ( in the main)
I'd say the chances of such a regime being as effective for the majority, seems slim.
Always happy to see there ARE alternative avenues to explore.
Personally not in need at the moment, but we all know it's not a one size fits sll.
I'd go out on a limb here, and agree fully with yourself, and particularly @Oldvatr opinion .
IF this diet was THAT effective, then THIS forum is where I'd expect it to explode first.
With the greatest respect to all
Being a tad more ' senior' to 30 myself, then I'd really wish, like many I suspect,
the exercise regime might be a little beyond me for every single day, laudable as it would be.
And having become comfortable eating an agreeable amount of food at any meal, the idea of such low calories wouldn't appeal to me either.
While I do hope it has a real possibility of working for others, for the reasons stated
As they say in the Dragons Den .I'm out.
@HSSS , I like that inquisitiveness.
I hope you manage to find some proof of it's efficacy for all age groups
It's always good to keep an eye open for other ways of meeting the same Goal.
In my many years on here I haven't seen many type 2 diabetics for whom low carbing does not improve blood sugar levels, except those who turn out to be lada or misdiagnosed.I personally believe there are many different ways the human body and diabetes type 2 interact. For some weight loss plays a significant part. I tend to think I am more in that camp purely because I can cope with more carbs than some. For others it does seem very linked to carb intake. others have good reaction to exercise. And many other combinations I am sure
but if it was as simple as saying lower carbs directly improves then everyone who goes onto that path would see the improvements but for some people, for reasons we cannot say, do not get the same and that’s a shame but not their fault.
but maybe for others still it is complex interactions of all of the above. Without very specific medical studies to control the interactions we cannot say in every instance
I am always ready to say that for me exercise, lower carb, and lower calories I used and so I cannot hand on heart say any particular worked for me, maybe one had a bigger impact but that would be a guess
but as long as debate stays healthy, and people are not putting themselves in danger then hopefully everyone can find a path through to an improvement
being aware we are drifting off topic, so need to take this elsewhere if we are not careful. There is a different approach to the original diet and the view seems to be lower carb is from observation a better approachIn my many years on here I haven't seen many type 2 diabetics for whom low carbing does not improve blood sugar levels, except those who turn out to be lada or misdiagnosed.
There are some, including me, who lose little or no weight, but that is not the same as no improvement in diabetes.
the specific advice and encouragement to count and restrict carbs is for blood sugar control. Any weight loss is incidental. Perhaps you didnt realise the focus of the low carb advice. Counting and restricting carbs works. It is the element of carb restriction found in any low calorie diet which is making the difference in blood sugar levels, irrespective of any affect on weight loss. The two issues - weight loss and blood sugar levels - are separate ones.Therefore it doesn’t always work.
It’s a good discussion and one I am more than happy to be questioned on and adapt my views where I am wrong…the specific advice and encouragement to count and restrict carbs is for blood sugar control. Any weight loss is incidental. Perhaps you didnt realise the focus of the low carb advice. Counting and restricting carbs works. It is the element of carb restriction found in any low calorie diet which is making the difference in blood sugar levels, irrespective of any affect on weight loss. The two issues - weight loss and blood sugar levels - are separate ones.
I am discussing the diet, its purpose, that it works by reducing calories, which has the effect of reducing carb intake, which then leads to lower blood glucose levels in some, making it appear that the diet itself works. The reality is that any low calorie diet will work, because they all reduce carb intake somewhat.however we are moving away from the topic at hand so need to keep it with respect to the discussion on the diet as mentioned in the original post
Hi,I am discussing the diet, its purpose, that it works by reducing calories, which has the effect of reducing carb intake, which then leads to lower blood glucose levels in some, making it appear that the diet itself works. The reality is that any low calorie diet will work, because they all reduce carb intake somewhat.
Its not the diet, this diet, any special diet, its the carb reduction inherent in that diet, particularly a diet such as this. @HSSS am I derailing? If so, I apologise.
I am fine with wider discussion but it is this low fat;high carb approach that I wanted to discuss specifically which also happens to be vegan from what I can gather rather than the process and cons of low carb which most of us broadly agree on already. (I’m kind of with you on that point that almost everyone who low carbs sees some bgl benefit. Mileage does vary though. So long as promises aren’t made and words like “most, many, often” qualify statements then I’m not seeing the issues @Andydragon initially mentioned.)I am discussing the diet, its purpose, that it works by reducing calories, which has the effect of reducing carb intake, which then leads to lower blood glucose levels in some, making it appear that the diet itself works. The reality is that any low calorie diet will work, because they all reduce carb intake somewhat.
Its not the diet, this diet, any special diet, its the carb reduction inherent in that diet, particularly a diet such as this. @HSSS am I derailing? If so, I apologise.
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