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Morning Blood levels and when to eat.

pinkfoot

pinkfoot

Well-Known Member
Messages
69
Location
Aintree, Liverpool
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Hello All.

So far so good, but I’m seeing plenty of other members with lower fasting levels. I’d like to get mine sub 6 - they currently run at 6.5. Do you test as soon as you wake and before getting out of bed or soon after getting up?

Also, please, do you eat to your meter or when you feel hungry? Driving for a living my GP has told me that I need to be ‘Five to Drive’, so would you wait until a reading of say, 5.5-5.7 before eating? The reason I ask this is is purely down to trying to control my blood sugars under a 2.0 lift two hours after eating and keeping bloods under 7.7 post prandial.

Thanks as always.

Kev
 
I personally don’t think it really matters exactly when you test so long as you do it at the same time each day. Although blood glucose often continues to rise after waking, so most prefer to measure as soon as possible to get the lowest reading. Arguable quality of data, but in any case I think consistency of timing and routine is more important for the individual. Some prefer to eat something first thing because it can blunt the rise in morning glucose but, in my opinion, only eating when hungry is the better long term solution.

Five-to-drive I think is only a rule of thumb, and only applies if you’re coming up from a hypo and a certain amount of time has passed. I’m not 100% on that but I’m sure a few type 1 or other insulin users will be able to comment further.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Jim.

Thanks for a comprehensive reply. Unfortunately, the nature of my job and shift system means consistent timing is a problem. My shifts start from 0200-0800 and I work four on, four off. The only thing I can keep constant are meal times, the job gives me flexibility to do that.

Your advice is very welcome, thanks.

Kev
 
It's not that you are unsafe to drive at 5 , It's just better to be on the safe side as it could be dropping but you know that if you test at 4.8 and then have a meal it's going to be going up and after all a non diabetics blood sugar can drop to 3.7 .
 
pinkfoot said:
Jim.

Thanks for a comprehensive reply. Unfortunately, the nature of my job and shift system means consistent timing is a problem. My shifts start from 0200-0800 and I work four on, four off. The only thing I can keep constant are meal times, the job gives me flexibility to do that.

Your advice is very welcome, thanks.

Kev
Click to expand...
If you just want to test once a day to check on progress then just before your main meal is probably free of confounding factors.
 
pinkfoot said:
Hello All.

So far so good, but I’m seeing plenty of other members with lower fasting levels. I’d like to get mine sub 6 - they currently run at 6.5. Do you test as soon as you wake and before getting out of bed or soon after getting up?

Also, please, do you eat to your meter or when you feel hungry? Driving for a living my GP has told me that I need to be ‘Five to Drive’, so would you wait until a reading of say, 5.5-5.7 before eating? The reason I ask this is is purely down to trying to control my blood sugars under a 2.0 lift two hours after eating and keeping bloods under 7.7 post prandial.

Thanks as always.

Kev
Click to expand...
My view is that we should eat when we are hungry (but only meals that the BG meter says are safe for us, and that we should only eat when hungry - as much as possible. I still occasionally snack when bored and over-eat but now only do so on very low carb foods!

Fasting Blood Glucose is usually the last one to return to normal. So unless you have already been getting less than 2mmol rises from meals for at least 6 months I would ignore the fasting (and I did so when I was in that position).

If you have any (even small) Dawn Phenomenon, then you have absolutely no control over your Fasting BG. So don't compare it to that of others who may have been on this journey for years longer than your have. Even after my HbA1C was down into the pre-diabetic range, my Fasting BG could still be as high as 7.8 because of my Dawn Phenomenon

Personally I feel that you are being very strict in aiming for a max BG reading of 7.7. The usual figure people aim for is 8.0 although some relax that to 8.5. Note that even with such strong DP and FBG of 7.8 I was still able to achieve a max BG of 8.0 or less because by having an approx zero carb breakfast (plain boiled eggs) I found that stopped my DP in it's tracks and so my BG dropped a little after the meal.

Type 2 Diabetes is a marathon - not a sprint, so aim for having good levels and a good life over the longer term. I don't believe that it's possible to 'shock' your body out of it, so in my opinion something short-term that is unsustainable really doesn't help achieve the longer goal.
 
pinkfoot said:
Hello All.

So far so good, but I’m seeing plenty of other members with lower fasting levels. I’d like to get mine sub 6 - they currently run at 6.5. Do you test as soon as you wake and before getting out of bed or soon after getting up?

Also, please, do you eat to your meter or when you feel hungry? Driving for a living my GP has told me that I need to be ‘Five to Drive’, so would you wait until a reading of say, 5.5-5.7 before eating? The reason I ask this is is purely down to trying to control my blood sugars under a 2.0 lift two hours after eating and keeping bloods under 7.7 post prandial.

Thanks as always.

Kev
Click to expand...

Hi there, well the actual rules re driving is that you do not need to be '5 to drive' albeit in many scenarios that might make good sense and I wouldn't advocate not listening to your GP as there may be other factors they are including. I suspect the reason they haven't raised it to '5' for diabetics is that many of us are often in the 4s like a non diabetic, so wouldn't be able to drive at all without eating food we don't want. Officially you cannot drive under 4. If you are between 4 & 5, then you need to take a snack. That's for 'normal' driving when you set off and every 2 hours after that. As Jim says, if whilst driving you have a hypo, then you cannot drive until your level has reached above 5. May I ask why you particularly would prefer a 6 instead of a 6.5? My understanding is that those 2 figures are pretty much the same. x
 
pinkfoot said:
Hello All.

So far so good, but I’m seeing plenty of other members with lower fasting levels. I’d like to get mine sub 6 - they currently run at 6.5. Do you test as soon as you wake and before getting out of bed or soon after getting up?

Also, please, do you eat to your meter or when you feel hungry? Driving for a living my GP has told me that I need to be ‘Five to Drive’, so would you wait until a reading of say, 5.5-5.7 before eating? The reason I ask this is is purely down to trying to control my blood sugars under a 2.0 lift two hours after eating and keeping bloods under 7.7 post prandial.

Thanks as always.

Kev
Click to expand...
Everyone is different (meter is your friend), but if I had those goals and was seeing dp I’d eat when I get up - assuming with your shifts that’s the same time? For me, it stops the rise, and it would just go up and up till lunch otherwise.

I think it depends on how good your primary and secondary insulin response is, as well as how insulin resistant you are, so no predicting other people really!

Good luck, I hope you see the results you want.
 
I have learned over time to wait at least a half hour after waking, before you test for a fasting finger prick test. Or if you can do intermittent fasting, then depending on your shifts, eat when you want to eat, you don't have to eat four, five times a day, if you're not hungry, then miss a meal. This will also help with lowering blood glucose levels.
 
jaywak said:
It's not that you are unsafe to drive at 5 , It's just better to be on the safe side as it could be dropping but you know that if you test at 4.8 and then have a meal it's going to be going up and after all a non diabetics blood sugar can drop to 3.7 .
Click to expand...

Hi @jaywak ,

I believe @pinkfoot is a group 2 driver regarding profession. The profile suggests "Trulicity?" (If this is correct.)
His doctor has quite rightly advised the OP under DVLA terms & conditions using such a treatment.
I feel it would be inapropriate as insulin users ourselves regarding other types of managment to call out what is a safe practice with driving.. Managing insulin to carb ratios as we do & being prescribed a drug that possibly increases indigenous insulin production with our friend Pinkfoot, are not the same experience..

I hope this helps..:)
 
KK123 said:
Hi there, well the actual rules re driving is that you do not need to be '5 to drive' albeit in many scenarios that might make good sense and I wouldn't advocate not listening to your GP as there may be other factors they are including. I suspect the reason they haven't raised it to '5' for diabetics is that many of us are often in the 4s like a non diabetic, so wouldn't be able to drive at all without eating food we don't want. Officially you cannot drive under 4. If you are between 4 & 5, then you need to take a snack. That's for 'normal' driving when you set off and every 2 hours after that. As Jim says, if whilst driving you have a hypo, then you cannot drive until your level has reached above 5. May I ask why you particularly would prefer a 6 instead of a 6.5? My understanding is that those 2 figures are pretty much the same. x
Click to expand...

Thanks for a great reply.

I’ve now reached the point where I’d like to be ‘normal’ again and to be well within tolerances.

It sticks in my mind that being around 6 is where I my HbA1c will be sub 39 - my goal. Time to get off all meds and go with a diet-lead life.

Driving HGV1 ( the bendy articulated ones) I test my bloods more than most - maybe that’s what is raising my averages?
 
Jaylee said:
Hi @jaywak ,

I believe @pinkfoot is a group 2 driver regarding profession. The profile suggests "Trulicity?" (If this is correct.)
His doctor has quite rightly advised the OP under DVLA terms & conditions using such a treatment.
I feel it would be inapropriate as insulin users ourselves regarding other types of managment to call out what is a safe practice with driving.. Managing insulin to carb ratios as we do & being prescribed a drug that possibly increases indigenous insulin production with our friend Pinkfoot, are not the same experience..

I hope this helps..:)
Click to expand...

Thanks @Jaylee! Class 1, the bendy ones. Appreciate your input very much.

ianf0ster said:
My view is that we should eat when we are hungry (but only meals that the BG meter says are safe for us, and that we should only eat when hungry - as much as possible. I still occasionally snack when bored and over-eat but now only do so on very low carb foods!

Fasting Blood Glucose is usually the last one to return to normal. So unless you have already been getting less than 2mmol rises from meals for at least 6 months I would ignore the fasting (and I did so when I was in that position).

If you have any (even small) Dawn Phenomenon, then you have absolutely no control over your Fasting BG. So don't compare it to that of others who may have been on this journey for years longer than your have. Even after my HbA1C was down into the pre-diabetic range, my Fasting BG could still be as high as 7.8 because of my Dawn Phenomenon

Personally I feel that you are being very strict in aiming for a max BG reading of 7.7. The usual figure people aim for is 8.0 although some relax that to 8.5. Note that even with such strong DP and FBG of 7.8 I was still able to achieve a max BG of 8.0 or less because by having an approx zero carb breakfast (plain boiled eggs) I found that stopped my DP in it's tracks and so my BG dropped a little after the meal.

Type 2 Diabetes is a marathon - not a sprint, so aim for having good levels and a good life over the longer term. I don't believe that it's possible to 'shock' your body out of it, so in my opinion something short-term that is unsustainable really doesn't help achieve the longer goal.
Click to expand...

@ianf0ster once again you have helped - thank you so much for your advice and tips. Very informative and easy to read.

Cheers, that has helped me no end
 
When people say “eat to your meter” they mean test before eating and two hours after and adjust meals (i.e. cut carbs) accordingly, not that you have to reach a certain number to eat. My morning number often comes down after food anyway. The best advice IMO is still to eat when hungry!
 
I agree with @danziger above. My Dawn Phenomenon used to be turned off by me eating a basically zero carb breakfast.
My digestive system recognised I 'd eaten and so told my liver to stop releasing glucose. Thus my Blood Glucose level stopped rising and often fell after breakfast so my pre-lunch level was lower than my pre-breakfast level.

When eating Low carb it is pointless to try to wait for Blood Glucose to drop before allowing yourself to eat. To make it sustainable it needs to be as pleasurable and as simple as possible (not no simpler). So always when actually hungry, but if your BG is higher than you 'd like it to be, eat something with practically no carbs but eat until feeling full.
The main advantage of Low Carb is that it's not a 'diet' as such - you don't need to cut or even count calories. So you avoid the problem of relying on will power and not eating even though you feel starving.
 
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