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Need some advice/opinions please

semiphonic

semiphonic

Well-Known Member
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905
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Torquay
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
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Ignorant people, diabetes!
I posted around a week ago about my seeming inability to eat a hot meal. I mentioned that a burger and chips (this was in a restaurant, not a fast food chain) spiked me from 6.2 to 19mmol.

On Monday of last week I had knee surgery, I didn't sleep on Sunday night (at all) and tested my BG before I went to the hospital, it was 6.2. After my operation, the medical team tested my BG and it was 6.7. I was told that I HAD to eat before i was discharged and all that was on offer was (white) toast with jam or marmalade(!), so I just had toast with butter, got home and tested and was 5.9.

I have not exercised at all this week (difficult when you can't use one of your legs!), I've had 2 slices of white toast every day for breakfast, I've had a sandwich for lunch and a salad for an evening meal. The highest my BG has been is 6.5. My fasting levels have been between 4.3 and 4.8, the lowest they've been since diagnosis. I thought maybe that my extremely high doses of painkillers may have had some beneficial effect, but I stopped these on Friday, today I had a roast (lamb) dinner, complete with roast potatoes, Yorkshire puds, peas carrots and gravy. 2 hours later my BG was 5.8.

I don't understand how I can go from huge spikes with bread etc, to relatively normal levels, can anyone shed some light??
 
Nope, it sounds like your bg is back to normal. One way to test is drink 75 g of sugar and see if its under 8 at 2hr, over 11 you/re still diabetic
 
I'm not suggesting that I'm no longer diabetic, and I'd be really concerned about drinking that much sugar! I don't really understand how my BG could go back to normal when a week before I was having huge spikes?
 
jack412 said:
It might have been pancrastitis or something else, you may have been misdiagnosed ..see you Dr to work it out
Click to expand...

Like many people here my doctor is next to useless, and I don't think I was misdiagnosed 5 months ago, if it had been a few weeks, maybe......

Indy51 said:
Sounds like Andrew's theory on training your pancreas may have worked for you.
Click to expand...

That's just it, I haven't trained my pancreas to do anything, I'm honestly confused.
 
If you've been eating 2 slices of toast for days, then that will have trained your pancreas to produce more insulin - at least if I'm understanding the theory correctly. Assuming it is healthy, the pancreas produces first phase insulin based on the amount of carbs eaten at the previous meal.
 
But the week before ANY bread sent my BG sky high
 
Well, it would because your body wasn't expecting that huge influx of glucose if you'd been strictly low carb for any length of time. You ambushed it, so to speak.
 
Sorry to appear awkward or argumentative (I'm really not trying to be!), but before diagnosis I ate bread every day and was diagnosed as diabetic, I've only been LCHFing for around 3 months. Surely my pancreas either works or it doesn't?
 
It may have been insulin resistance and the low carb reset it.
You might be high again next week or you could go 10 years
 
The whole Newcastle Diet and Professor Taylor's theory of diabetes is that we each have a personal threshold for how much visceral fat our pancreases can tolerate before normal function is affected. If you've lost enough weight to bring you below your personal threshold - and if pancreatic function hasn't been compromised for too long - you may be able to restore normal function. Hence the "reversal of diabetes" claim.

However, if you go back to eating the way you were eating beforehand and regain the visceral fat above your personal threshold, you can return to diabetes.

If you haven't seen Prof Taylor's lecture, then it's definitely worth watching: http://www.fend-lectures.org/index.php?menu=view&id=94
 
jack412 said:
It may have been insulin resistance and the low carb reset it.
You might be high again next week or you could go 10 years
Click to expand...

I've just ordered a ton of test strips, I need to keep an eye on this.....

Indy51 said:
The whole Newcastle Diet and Professor Taylor's theory of diabetes is that we each have a personal threshold for how much visceral fat our pancreases can tolerate before normal function is affected. If you've lost enough weight to bring you below your personal threshold - and if pancreatic function hasn't been compromised for too long - you may be able to restore normal function. Hence the "reversal of diabetes" claim.

However, if you go back to eating the way you were eating beforehand and regain the visceral fat above your personal threshold, you can return to diabetes.

If you haven't seen Prof Taylor's lecture, then it's definitely worth watching: http://www.fend-lectures.org/index.php?menu=view&id=94
Click to expand...

I haven't seen the lecture, but I'll take a look at a more sociable hour, thank you :)

Over the last 12 months I have lost 6 inches off my waist (this includes several months as an undiagnosed diabetic!), so this could be a valid point, I have no intention in going back to how I ate 'pre diagnosis'.
 
I wish all this knowledge had been readily available the first time I was diagnosed as pre-diabetic in the early 90's. And again in 2003. Even when I was diagnosed Type 2 in 2012, though I suspect I'd already used up my allotted chances by then.

All 3 times I had quit smoking and put on around 20kgs. I'd always been normal weight when smoking, which was one of the reasons I continued with it. Each time, except the last, I went back to smoking and the weight came off and my BG returned to normal levels. I lost the weight without restarting smoking and am back to my standard weight, but the diabetes hasn't reversed this time, so looks like I'm stuck with it.

So my message to anyone is, if you manage to get your BG normalised, don't allow yourself to regain the weight because you are definitely asking for trouble and who knows how many chances your pancreas will give you?
 
semiphonic said:
I posted around a week ago about my seeming inability to eat a hot meal. I mentioned that a burger and chips (this was in a restaurant, not a fast food chain) spiked me from 6.2 to 19mmol.

On Monday of last week I had knee surgery, I didn't sleep on Sunday night (at all) and tested my BG before I went to the hospital, it was 6.2. After my operation, the medical team tested my BG and it was 6.7. I was told that I HAD to eat before i was discharged and all that was on offer was (white) toast with jam or marmalade(!), so I just had toast with butter, got home and tested and was 5.9.

I have not exercised at all this week (difficult when you can't use one of your legs!), I've had 2 slices of white toast every day for breakfast, I've had a sandwich for lunch and a salad for an evening meal. The highest my BG has been is 6.5. My fasting levels have been between 4.3 and 4.8, the lowest they've been since diagnosis. I thought maybe that my extremely high doses of painkillers may have had some beneficial effect, but I stopped these on Friday, today I had a roast (lamb) dinner, complete with roast potatoes, Yorkshire puds, peas carrots and gravy. 2 hours later my BG was 5.8.

I don't understand how I can go from huge spikes with bread etc, to relatively normal levels, can anyone shed some light??
Click to expand...

Hi semiphonic,
Your observations can't really be explained. A reduction in insulin resistance will obviously have beneficial effects, but I'm not convinced it would be noticed in an overnight improvement.
The link to diabetes 'cure' and hospitalisation is usually with regard to gastric bypass surgery, and the mystery around that appears to have been solved.
Did you lose a great deal of weight between going in to surgery and coming back out? Is there anything else unusual that you have done with regards to behaviour or diet?
I would be very interested to hear of progress - if bloods begin to creep back up, or if they remain at a 'normal' level over the next few weeks.
 
As you say semiphonic, the coming days will be interesting, watching your scores. But, I do think there may be mileage in the rested pancreas having a nudge from a small number of modest carb sessions (your toast on successive days). I'd strenuously avoid a big hit, like burger and chips, for now, but see how the continued scores go.

I'm reintroducing modest carbs at present, having got skinny and a couple of decent HbA1cs under my belt. I've also reduced testing a bit, but am making it more focused on when I consume increased carbs, plus always my fasting score. I have largely stopped testing when I have, say, a chicken salad or omelette and salad; the latter of which routinely gives me a lower post than preprandial score anyway. The results are interesting, but insufficient to make any real judgement.

Keep us in the loop.

@Andrew Colvin started a thread about increasing carbs recently, which has some interesting debate you might find interesting.

It's all a puzzle, and it seems we don't all have the same pieces or the same finished picture.
 
Indy51 said:
I wish all this knowledge had been readily available the first time I was diagnosed as pre-diabetic in the early 90's. And again in 2003. Even when I was diagnosed Type 2 in 2012, though I suspect I'd already used up my allotted chances by then.

All 3 times I had quit smoking and put on around 20kgs. I'd always been normal weight when smoking, which was one of the reasons I continued with it. Each time, except the last, I went back to smoking and the weight came off and my BG returned to normal levels. I lost the weight without restarting smoking and am back to my standard weight, but the diabetes hasn't reversed this time, so looks like I'm stuck with it.

So my message to anyone is, if you manage to get your BG normalised, don't allow yourself to regain the weight because you are definitely asking for trouble and who knows how many chances your pancreas will give you?
Click to expand...
That is sad that losing the weight hasn't reset you levels this time. You were caught between a rock and a hard place. If it hadn't been for all the discussions I have read on here and the research papers (many referenced by you) then I wouldn't be experimenting as I am. As they say we all stand on the shoulders of giants. Your experience is invaluable to all of us that follow in your footsteps.

I am sorry that our discussion upset you a little on the other thread - it wasn't intended but I do understand why it did!
 
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