New and confused

[Morethanidlike]

So after years of insulin resistance caused by polycystic ovarian syndrome, today I was told I am diabetic and I feel desolate. No real information from Dr but guessing it’s T2. My numbers weren’t even prediabetic last year and I’ve been on metformin for years due to the pcos, taking 850mg 3 times a day. I have high blood pressure (medicine controlled) high cholesterol (recently restarted statins) and all the Dr said was lose weight if you can and we’ll do a blood test in 6 months. I have tried every ‘healthy eating’ scheme and diet plan going with no success. I’ve been reading on here that no carb high fat is better for diabetes but worried that will be detrimental to my blood pressure/cholesterol. I am hoping to get me head round being ‘diabetic’ quickly but I feel almost dismissed by my GP and no clue what I’m doing. One thing she did say is no need to monitor my blood sugars at home so that’s one less worry I suppose. I’m not really sure if I’m asking questions or just off loading. My head is wrecked

 

[KennyA]

Hi Morethanidlike and welcome to the forums.

I have been eating low carb/high fat for over three and a half years now. BGs in normal levels after three or four months, BP down, cholesterol down, >60lbs lost. I'm not seeing any downside to this way of eating. I feel better than I have done for twelve years.

I would advise that you do monitor your blood glucose levels. Doctors will almost never tell T2s to monitor blood glucose because if they did, the monitor and test strips would have to be provided on prescription.

Monitoring your levels will allow you to discover what foods do to your immediate blood glucose levels and therefore give you the knowledge you need to cut out the food your system can't handle. Waiting six months to find out whether you're on the right road or not seems a bit pointless.

 

[Morethanidlike]

Hi Morethanidlike and welcome to the forums.

I have been eating low carb/high fat for over three and a half years now. BGs in normal levels after three or four months, BP down, cholesterol down, >60lbs lost. I'm not seeing any downside to this way of eating. I feel better than I have done for twelve years.

I would advise that you do monitor your blood glucose levels. Doctors will almost never tell T2s to monitor blood glucose because if they did, the monitor and test strips would have to be provided on prescription.

Monitoring your levels will allow you to discover what foods do to your immediate blood glucose levels and therefore give you the knowledge you need to cut out the food your system can't handle. Waiting six months to find out whether you're on the right road or not seems a bit pointless.

Thank you so much for your reply, it’s much appreciated. It definitely sounds like the way forward I just haven’t got a clue where to start and how to incorporate it in to family meals.

I said to her about monitoring and she said as Im on metformin it would be pointless??

I saw diabetes absolutely destroy my mum, literally attacked her eyes, feet, kidneys were failing until she died at 54 from diabetic complications and heart disease. I am absolutely petrified that history will repeat even though I know medicine has moved on since I lost her 26 years ago.

 

[KennyA]

Thank you so much for your reply, it’s much appreciated. It definitely sounds like the way forward I just haven’t got a clue where to start and how to incorporate it in to family meals.

I said to her about monitoring and she said as Im on metformin it would be pointless??

I saw diabetes absolutely destroy my mum, literally attacked her eyes, feet, kidneys were failing until she died at 54 from diabetic complications and heart disease. I am absolutely petrified that history will repeat even though I know medicine has moved on since I lost her 26 years ago.

If you look on this forum in the Members' Area you will find a number of helpful items: recipes, 30 day meal plans, food and glucose diaries, that sort of thing. That should get you started. The Food and Drink forums cover a wide range of things and I'd suggest having a look at them. And there are a number of other sites with useful stuff - eg dietdoctor.com.

My other half is not diabetic (or anywhere close) and eats a lower-carb diet (still way more than me) - so I add some carb to her meals - eg small amounts of potato, pasta, rice. It helps to have supportive family but willpower helps as well. If you have a problem here it's better to acknowledge it and deal with it, rather than pretending it's not happening.

I have zero personal experience with metformin, but plenty of people on this forum both monitor and use metformin. I have no idea what your doctor meant by that - maybe others will.

I'd also advise forgetting everything you thought you knew about "healthy eating". Best of luck. This forum is the best resource I know of for people with diabetes.

 

[ianf0ster]

Hi @Morethanidlike and welcome to the forum.
You are not going to like this at all! You will either reject it out of hand, or it will make you question what Doctors and society has been telling you for years/decades.

What has changed over the last year (since your previous (non-diabetic) HbA1C ? Have you been eating more 'healthy' whole grains or fruit, or swapped sugary drinks to fruit juice, eaten more low fat things? When did you start the statins? Have you started any other medicines in the last year?

The truth is that Type 2 diabetes is really an intolerance to the amount of carbohydrates you are eating - starches as well as sugars. Starches include all the major grains (wheat, barley, rice, corn, oats ) - and whole grains contain just a tiny bit of fibre but are otherwise just the same as the refined grains. Almost all fruit contains large amounts of sugars - most are bred for that since the beginning of agriculture. Most fruit juice contains more sugar than soft drinks like coke or fruit squashes do.

Several medicines (predominantly statins and steroids increase our blood glucose and so can help give us Type 2 diabetes. It even says so on some of the manufacturers' web sites, but many doctors still deny it.

All (digestible) carbohydrates turn into sugars when digested - this process can start with saliva in the mouth breaking them down. The Glycaemic Index of both refined wheat flour and mashed potato are quite a lot higher than that of Table Sugar.

PCOS doesn't cause Insulin resistance - it is the other way around! Insulin resistance causes both PCOS and T2D and insulin resistance is caused by high insulin levels over a very long period, which in turn is caused by eating large amounts of carbohydrates too frequently over a long period.

Thus for somebody like you (or me and other members of this forum) eating what most people think is healthy is, actually really bad for us. Eating carbohydrates as much as doctors advise is not good, eating 'little and often' is bad (the often part) since the longer we can go without eating carbs the better chance we have of reducing our body fat and thus our Insulin Resistance.

Carbohydrates are the only non-essential Macro Nutrient meaning that we need to eat Proteins and Fats, but not Carbs (though it's almost impossible to avoid them completely. So for somebody like us, eating Low Fat makes no sense, we need to eat Low Carb!

Eating Low Carb lowers Blood Glucose, which tends to reduce weight which tends to reduce Blood Pressure, as well as tending to put T2 Diabetes in to remission.

It isn't (usually) eating saturated fat which makes us fat, it's eating excess Carbs - because Insulin is the Fat Storage Hormone since it promotes the storage of Blood Glucose as body fat in our fat cells and obviously helps prevent the body fat actually being used as energy. Since, historically, in terms of food we can be in a period of plenty, or a period of starvation - but not both at the same time!

Your nurse obviously would drive around with a speedometer that works only once per 3 months -like having an HbA1C every 3 months and not testing in between.

A Blood Glucose meter is used for 3 things, but mainly for Type 2 Diabetics it is used to find oud what (and how much) we can eat without spiking our Blood Glucose too high. Souse it to test before each meal and 2hrs after first bite until you get comfortable in knowing what the after effect of your next meal will be on your BG before you eat it!

The majority of people who eat Low Carb find that their LDL Cholesterol either gets lower, or stays te same. For a few like ne, it goes up - but even the the Triglycerides go down (which is good) and the HDL goes up (which is good), so that the overall Lipid Profile is actually better than before despite the LDL being higher - even if we assume that LDL, which is needed for immune system and hormones is actually bad for us, which is very doubtful!

 

[Lakeslover]

Your GP thinks people only need to test if they are on a medication which can cause dangerously low blood sugar (hypos). Metformin does not cause this and therefore the NHS doesn’t fund meter’s for people on Metformin alone.

but if you want to know which foods cause high blood sugar then you need to use a meter to test before a meal, and two hours after. That way you can learn which foods are good for you and which bad, and understand how to keep your blood sugars low.

 

[Morethanidlike]

Thank you for the info, I will have a proper look around now that I have the diagnosis.

Willpower has never been a strength but no better reason to develop some!!!

 

[Morethanidlike]

Hi @Morethanidlike and welcome to the forum.
You are not going to like this at all! You will either reject it out of hand, or it will make you question what Doctors and society has been telling you for years/decades.

What has changed over the last year (since your previous (non-diabetic) HbA1C ? Have you been eating more 'healthy' whole grains or fruit, or swapped sugary drinks to fruit juice, eaten more low fat things? When did you start the statins? Have you started any other medicines in the last year?

The truth is that Type 2 diabetes is really an intolerance to the amount of carbohydrates you are eating - starches as well as sugars. Starches include all the major grains (wheat, barley, rice, corn, oats ) - and whole grains contain just a tiny bit of fibre but are otherwise just the same as the refined grains. Almost all fruit contains large amounts of sugars - most are bred for that since the beginning of agriculture. Most fruit juice contains more sugar than soft drinks like coke or fruit squashes do.

Several medicines (predominantly statins and steroids increase our blood glucose and so can help give us Type 2 diabetes. It even says so on some of the manufacturers' web sites, but many doctors still deny it.

All (digestible) carbohydrates turn into sugars when digested - this process can start with saliva in the mouth breaking them down. The Glycaemic Index of both refined wheat flour and mashed potato are quite a lot higher than that of Table Sugar.

PCOS doesn't cause Insulin resistance - it is the other way around! Insulin resistance causes both PCOS and T2D and insulin resistance is caused by high insulin levels over a very long period, which in turn is caused by eating large amounts of carbohydrates too frequently over a long period.

Thus for somebody like you (or me and other members of this forum) eating what most people think is healthy is, actually really bad for us. Eating carbohydrates as much as doctors advise is not good, eating 'little and often' is bad (the often part) since the longer we can go without eating carbs the better chance we have of reducing our body fat and thus our Insulin Resistance.

Carbohydrates are the only non-essential Macro Nutrient meaning that we need to eat Proteins and Fats, but not Carbs (though it's almost impossible to avoid them completely. So for somebody like us, eating Low Fat makes no sense, we need to eat Low Carb!

Eating Low Carb lowers Blood Glucose, which tends to reduce weight which tends to reduce Blood Pressure, as well as tending to put T2 Diabetes in to remission.

It isn't (usually) eating saturated fat which makes us fat, it's eating excess Carbs - because Insulin is the Fat Storage Hormone since it promotes the storage of Blood Glucose as body fat in our fat cells and obviously helps prevent the body fat actually being used as energy. Since, historically, in terms of food we can be in a period of plenty, or a period of starvation - but not both at the same time!

Your nurse obviously would drive around with a speedometer that works only once per 3 months -like having an HbA1C every 3 months and not testing in between.

A Blood Glucose meter is used for 3 things, but mainly for Type 2 Diabetics it is used to find oud what (and how much) we can eat without spiking our Blood Glucose too high. Souse it to test before each meal and 2hrs after first bite until you get comfortable in knowing what the after effect of your next meal will be on your BG before you eat it!

The majority of people who eat Low Carb find that their LDL Cholesterol either gets lower, or stays te same. For a few like ne, it goes up - but even the the Triglycerides go down (which is good) and the HDL goes up (which is good), so that the overall Lipid Profile is actually better than before despite the LDL being higher - even if we assume that LDL, which is needed for immune system and hormones is actually bad for us, which is very doubtful!

Thank you for such a detailed response, it is much appreciated. It was my endocrinologist that said pcos had caused insulin resistance so what you have to say is very interesting.

I will look in to getting a monitor as it seems like a handy tool to have.

 

[ajbod]

I don't know if you have any weight to lose, i'd never be so presumptuous. But if you have as the weight starts to disappear it doesn't half boost your will power.

 

[Morethanidlike]

I don't know if you have any weight to lose, i'd never be so presumptuous. But if you have as the weight starts to disappear it doesn't half boost your will power.

I have a huge amount to lose!!!! I’ve tried all the usual weight loss gimmicks so hopefully this new way of eating will help

 

[ajbod]

All the weight loss gimmicks, involve eating the stuff that actually puts weight on, the only way to lose on those diets is via starvation. Eating low carb, as low as you are comfortable with, means eating healthy natural foods, without calorie counting, and without any hunger. You usually find yourself looking forward to climbing on the scales.

 

[Morethanidlike]

All the weight loss gimmicks, involve eating the stuff that actually puts weight on, the only way to lose on those diets is via starvation. Eating low carb, as low as you are comfortable with, means eating healthy natural foods, without calorie counting, and without any hunger. You usually find yourself looking forward to climbing on the scales.

I’m not sure I’ve ever looked forward to climbing on the scales but here’s hoping!!!

 

[ajbod]

As the low carb really starts working, you will!

 

[Mrs HJG]

Hi @Morethanidlike I honestly think I should be on commission, but please check out Jessie Inchauspé's instagram (@glucosegoddess) and books, she has a load of science for high glucose and PCOS as well as diabetes and she is really easy to read and it all makes sense-it will help get your head around much of this, and it is all aligned to the low carb ethos on this forum.

Another thing to consider, especially as you are on statins (which I understand may increase BG), that if you have been ill (especially covid) and/or any medication, it could temporarily raise your BG to (high) diabetic levels - if you have been ill/treated in the last 3 months or so, you could find you are back in the pre/non-diabetic zone again in a few more months with only tweaks to your diet, as you are already on Metformin. A big 'maybe' but worth considering.

You are in the right place, and great to hear the nurse sent you this way rather to the dark side (diabetes.org.uk). #maythefourthbewithyou

 

[Morethanidlike]

Thank you so much I will have a look. Any information will be gratefully received!!

GP didn’t recommend anything, just wanted to finish up as quickly as possible. I came across you lovely lot by chance and I’m so glad I did!!!

 

[MrsA2]

I saw diabetes absolutely destroy my mum, literally attacked her eyes, feet, kidneys were failing until she died at 54 from diabetic complications and heart disease

26 years ago treatment and management of diabetes was very different. I assume Mum was type 1 and injecting insulin?

 

[Morethanidlike]

I always believed her to be type two but she never really spoke about it. She was originally on metformin but then went on to injecting insulin. I realise medicine has moved on as I said but I almost have PTSD at the thought of having it. Keep giving myself a real talking to so hopefully it will sink in soon x

 

[VashtiB]

hello and welcome @Morethanidlike

I have a very similar story to you- but I was a lot less positive when I was first diagnosed- you're way ahead of where I was.

I was diagnosed about 3 years ago or was it 4- I've completely lost count.

Anyway I completely agree with the previous posters advice. First get a meter- yes most doctors either see no point in one or actively advise against it. The thing is that you have no other way of working out how different foods affect your levels without one. It is really key. Some people find they can handle some types of carbs better than others- many find they can handle more carbs later in the day. The only way to know is to test.

Second I too had tried every type of diet. If calorie counting was an olympic sport I could compete for Australia. I was so sick of counting so I went to a very low carb diet. Most of my food had no carbs or almost no carbs. Well I say that but recently having been having a carb creep in my diet with the result of putting back on some of the weight I had lost-sigh. I haven't put it all back on so that's okay.

Anyway you will find a lot of help and support here.

Good luck and welcome.

 

[rekotek]

Thank you so much I will have a look. Any information will be gratefully received!!

GP didn’t recommend anything, just wanted to finish up as quickly as possible. I came across you lovely lot by chance and I’m so glad I did!!!

It really take time to adjust and took me weeks to overcome when I was diagnosed T2 last December. I was also confused and worried when gp told me my random blood result was bad and my blood suger was 13.9. from that day I am having two metformin tablets a day, low carb diet and regular exercises. I now always eat salad/vegetables first, eggs/meats second and carb last.

My gp did spend sometime to explain what to eat (mainly more meats but no meat fat) and advice to do more exercises. But it was the appointment with the nurse a month later explained more about my case. I was given a meter by the nurse to check my blood sugar level as gp wasn't sure if I have T1 or T2 at that time, like others mentioned the meter really help to see how you handle different types of food.

My last fasting test was done early March. My hba1c was 41mmol and hopefully will be lower if I can lose more weight.

 

[Lobsang Tsultim]

As was said above, your doctor sees a monitor as a device to prevent low blood sugar(hypo) for people on insulin or other blood sugar lowering medication. We instead use it to assess our response to a meal: we test immediately before, and then 2 hours after. If our blood sugar level has returned to no more than 2 mmol above the pre-meal reading, then our bodies probably handled that meal okay (sometimes the blood sugar spike can come later than 2 hours è.g. A pizza with lots of cheese).

Don’t think about losing weight, just concentrate on controlling your blood sugar levels by controlling your carbohydrate intake. If you can do some light exercise then doing some is good, for our mental health as much as anything. Hard, long workouts will cause your blood sugars to surge (your primitive response systems presume you’re running for your life from a bear or something and try to help by releasing glucose for instant use) so keep it light and gentle.

If you’re drastically reducing your carbohydrates, you need to compensate by increasing the other macro nutrients: protein and fat. Protein can also raise your blood sugar levels a bit, so keep to moderate amounts. Fat has almost no effect on blood sugar levels, so you can eat as much as you need to avoid feeling hungry. Don’t avoid fatty meat, fat is not your enemy, it is your friend. A fatty cut of meat will satiate you more than a lean cut, cause a smaller blood sugar rise and help you lose weight.

I’ve been eating low carb and high fat for just over a year since my diagnosis. In that time, I’ve lost 20kg, my blood pressure has dropped to normal levels and so have my lipid levels. My HbA1c has gone from 74 mmol/l to 37 mmol/l.

You’ve experienced what just relying on metformin does personally, and you’ve seen what comes next with your mum. Time to try a different approach I suggest. Check Jo’s Nutritional Thingy blog post; it‘s a great crib sheet with all the information you to get started.