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Portion Control Vs Feeling Full

Patch

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,981
Location
Bristol
Type of diabetes
Treatment type
Insulin
Portion control gets mentioned a lot around here. It seems to be mentioned no matter what diet is being discussed.

But is it easier to maintain smaller portions on any specific diet? And how does insulin resistance effect your ability to maintain smaller portions?

In the past, I used to be a big fan of bread. Never really a white bread fan, but I loved my wholemeal/granary bread/rolls/baps.

I used to eat (we're talking 5+ years ago!) 4 ham salad baps (no butter/no mayo) for lunch every day at work, along with a few pieces of fruit (apples/satsumas/bananas). Sometimes, if I was hungry, I'd TRY to eat 1 bap at breakfast (9am - work started at 7am). More often than not, once I'd started, I'd eat the full 4 baps at breakfast, and STILL feel hungry afterwards. BY lunch-time I'd be ravenous again.

For me - maintaining that level of protein/fat/carbs was not enough to keep me full. Although I knew I should be more than full after eating it, I'd always still be hungry. This kept my morale down, as I felt that I was just greedy and that there was nothing I could do about it.

I can quite honestly say, that I had never felt full/satified/satiated until I started a lo-carb, unmoderated fat regime.

What I'm trying toget at here, is that Portion Control is much more difficult for some people than others. There is a factor at work (more than likely related directly to your level of insulin resistance) that makes EVERYBODY DIFFERENT.

If you find portion control difficult, it may be that the food you are eating is keeping you hungry. For example, I could eat a steak meal, with chips and peas, and still feel hungry after I'd eaten it. BUT - if I ate JUST the steak (dropping the chips n' peas) I'd be completely full (satiated) and not even think about food until close to (even after) the next meal time.

This was a revalation to me.

It confirmed what I had known for a long time - eating a small amount of a carbohydrate food is counter productive. It made me hungrier than if I'd ate nothing at all!

The point is - if you find it hard to moderate your portion size, don't feel bad. You are NOT a greedy person, and you are not a failure. You just need to experiment with the foods that keep you full/satiated for longer. If you have a high level of insulin resistance, it's unlikely that foods like porridge, wholemeal rice/pasta/bread, etc.. will keep you satiated. Fish, meat , eggs and cheese almost certainly will.
 
Hi Patch,

Your diet is not one I would wish to follow or even endorse to other diabetics, but if you have found a diet that works for you and it sustains you and keeps you healthy for life...... that is all that matters! Good luck on your chosen path.

Nigel
 
It has been proven that protein prevents hunger and carbs promote it. I can't remember the reference, but I definitely read it somewhere.
Getting away from needing the "full" feeling is a way of controlling portions. It's a slow process, but works if you persist.
Hana
 
Patch,
Hana's right that protein produces more satiey than carbs or fat. Carbs and fat have about equal effect but gram for gram you have to eat more calories from fat than from carb to achieve the same feelings of satiey (or so the studies say :wink: )
You might like to watch this old Horizon programme about the Akins diet
pt 4&5 try to emplain how the Atlkins diet works, Pt 5 has specifically the early research that suggested that protein is more filling than carbs so you are likey to eat less and hence lose weight.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkHD325e ... re=related

What it doesn't discuss is whether very high amounts of protein are a good thing. But we've done that before :wink:
 
I've found that combining fat and carbs produces a very low level of satiety. Protein and fat AND protein alone provides a very high level of satiety.

But I can't believe that fat and carbs have a similar effect in satiety. Even when eaten in similar qty's (based on carories) I'd have to say that a small amount of fat satisfies much more than an equivalent amount of carbs with a similar amount of calories.
 
I find that low levels of Fat AND reduced carbs makes me feel full ALL the time.

I never feel hungry between meals and mostly have to 'tell myself' to eat as even when meal times come around I NEVER feel hungry, but I do eat just to have the required nutrients and an energy source. Not into too much Protein. Moderation in all things.

I use portion control ALL the time. Shows how we are all different........
 
I said:
The point is - if you find it hard to moderate your portion size, don't feel bad. You are NOT a greedy person, and you are not a failure. You just need to experiment with the foods that keep you full/satiated for longer.
Click to expand...

Do you disagree with my above statement? Do you think that anyone that finds it difficult to moderate portion sizes (and I gaurantee you there are more of them here than you think) ARE just greedy and weak willed?

Let's not forget - you've ALREADY lost 5+ stone. I'd bet the metabolic changes that have came about as aresult of that impressive weight loss helps you feel fuller for longer. I bet your stomach is a fraction of the size that it was when you were 5st heavier.

A lot of people here are on that road right now - and I promise you, it's easier to look BACK down that road than it is to travel along it.
 
First of all I HAVE travelled along that road.......I have NEVER forgotten how I felt, how I was. I have been a Diabetic for near on 14 yrs. I write from my own experiences.

That is why I am here now trying to make sure people don't make the same mistakes I did.

Secondly where have I said that people are greedy and weak willed.......??

It's my opinion I gave of how it affects me, what I do.

Is there some point to your missive ?
 
Just trying to get the thread back on track as it turned into a "I do it like this, and I wouldn't do it like you do it" type of thread.
 
Oh I see.....is this your 'derailing a thread theory' then ? "If I want your opinion I will give it you" ??
If ANY thread is 'derailed' i.e. totally off topic. A Monitor will deal with it.

People are entitled to post what they want in a discussion Forum (within reason). They do not have to agree with you or even answer you. It is the opinions of Members or Monitor's.

Am I supposed to sit back and not put my opinions on this forum because you started this thread.
It isn't going to happen and you should know that. If I have an opinion or a comment I will post it.
Neither I or anyone else has to ask permission to post here.

Hope that makes things clear ?
 

That's very true Patch as we all know from experience! I find with diabetes that the road never ends, this is why we all come to places such as this forum. There's a Chinese proverb that says: ''In order to know the road ahead, ask those traveling back''.....which I feel is sensible advice! :wink:

Nigel
 
Patch said:
Just trying to get the thread back on track as it turned into a "I do it like this, and I wouldn't do it like you do it" type of thread.
Click to expand...

I suggest that if you want everyone to agree with what you have written in a post you should state this at the beginning of your thread ! :shock:

You should know by now that many members on the Forum, myself and Ken included do not eat a lot of fat and control our Diabetes very well. We both find we are not hungry after our meals, perfectly satisfied with both content and portion sizes without the need for more fat so our bodies must be quite happy with the lower fat in the meal.

Of course you will have members saying the opposite to you because we are all different ! Again...you have been here long enough to know that !
 
Patch said:
Portion control gets mentioned a lot around here. It seems to be mentioned no matter what diet is being discussed.
Click to expand...

Its that diet word again, you seem to assume that everyone diets. I don't diet I just eat a lot less than I used to, especially carbs but I don't diet as I have never ever been able to stick to a diet. I'm going to be diabetic for the rest of my life why would I want to condemn myself to a life of dieting and guilt?

As for feeling hungry between meals, yes I do sometimes feel like a snack, but only when I am sitting around doing nothing, all the time I keep myself busy I don't feel hungry. Lets face it few people today in this Country face starvation, I don't need to snack to survive so If I keep busy then I don't feel the urge.
 
Diet doesn't mean "on a diet". Diet just describes what a person eats from day to day. Not what this thread is about.

Well done for eating less than you used to. Sounds like you were eating too much to start with.
 
The little snippet about the Atkins diet, ignored the fact that even if differences are small, if they are consistent, they can be significant.
thus a regular extra loss of 22 calories over a period of time can make a significant difference to weight loss.
this world is FULL of BAD science.
Hana
 
Hana.
So if a person eats lots of fat (9 calories per gram of fat) which is high in calories then does that impede weight loss ?

Protein and carbs contain 4 calories per gram.
 
I would say that it ENCOURAGES weight loss. If you ate a steak sandwich, consisting of X grams of steak (fat trimmed) with 2 pieces of bread, I would say that THAT would IMPEDE weight loss.

If you ate the equivalent piece of steak (X grams of steak incl. fat, MINUS the equivalent weight of steak to bring it down to the SAME calorific value of the sandwich), I would say that would ENCOURAGE weight loss.

AND a great number of us would feel fuller for eating the reduced size piece of steak than if we ate the steak sandwich.

The whole point of this thread.

I'm just humouring you with this talk of calories. I don't believe that calories in = calories out. There are many more factors to think about. If the whole calorie arguement were true, then when:

Protein = 4
Carbs = 4

That means Protein = Carbs.

We all know that's not true.
 
A bit confused there Patch. You are talking about calories which we generally ignore in favour of counting carbs.

There are 4 calories per gram of carb and 4 calories per gram of protein, it does not mean that they equal one another just that they have the same calorific value.

We all know the affect of carbs on us and most also know that protein can also affect blood sugar levels especially when eaten to excess.
 
I think you have misunderstood.......

What I said was this :
Fat has 9 calories per gram.
Protein has 4 calories per gram.
Carbohydrates have 4 calories per gram.

That doesn't mean protein and carbs are equal in effects.......just calories.

I asked Hana does that mean that having more fat will impede weight loss. I never mentioned Bread and that is not relevant to my question. A fair question to her.

As for Calories, I don't count them much myself however they DO make a difference. It's a well known fact that calories have an effect if someone wishes to lose weight. To lose weight effectively there needs to be a 'shortfall' or less calories consumed if weight loss is required. Too many calories in will increase weight. Ignoring anything to do with BG control etc.

There were a few skinny low carbers who obviously do not wish to up the carbs because of good BG control. They sometimes have needed to increase their weight or maintain it. The solution for many was to increase the consumption of fat.......they started to put on weight or at least not lose it.

So, it is rather confusing when Hana says eating less calories will make a significant difference to weight loss........yet others say that eating more calories (more fat) makes them put on weight ?

I think that's a fair question.
 
A bit confused there Patch. You are talking about calories which we generally ignore in favour of counting carbs.
Click to expand...

Except when we're counting calories from fat, right?

Sue said:
We all know the affect of carbs on us and most also know that protein can also affect blood sugar levels especially when eaten to excess.
Click to expand...

So whats left? Fat. What effect does Fat have on BG (when taken alone or without carbs)? VERY LITTLE. And what effect does low-BG (and of coure, low insulin) have our appetite? It supresses it (for most people). How do you stop yourself from eating Protein to excess, even if you are ravenously hungry? Eat it with a food stuff that will satiate you. FAT.

Ken said:
So, it is rather confusing when Hana says eating less calories will make a significant difference to weight loss........yet others say that eating more calories (more fat) makes them put on weight ?
Click to expand...
[/quote]

Eating less calories is a sure-fire way to boot your body into starvation mode. You won't lose weight when you are in starvationmode. Eating more calories from fat, while maintaining a reduced carbohydrate intake, is gonna keep your body in a state of mild ketosis/lipolysis, where it is actaully DIFICULT to put weight ON.

Eating a suitable daily level of carboyhdrate (lets say >30grams) to keep you OUT of ketosis, and then supplimenting that with additional fat WILL encourage weight gain. It's the killer combination of FAT & CARBS that causes this weight gain - not the fat alone.

But we're all different. Some people need a much lower dail level of carbs to stay in ketosis. I imagine that these peopl would find it easy to put on weight by adding extra fat, while notbeing in a state of ketosis.
 
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