Running

[Fern Hopper]

I actually don't like cake. For some peculiar reasons my food tastes have changed since cancer diagnosis and treatment. I'm really pleased you put epinephrine and not adrenaline.

 

[Jasmin2000]

We're all different, what works or doesn't work for you doesn't have to be the same for everyone.

I can and do inject for both exercise and stress (dentist, endo visit) without issue, and mostly manage to keep a straightish line.

I've only provided references to explain counter-regulatory hormone effects. These are the facts, but in terms of treatments and lifestyle, they must be interpreted for each individual.

 

[Fern Hopper]

Anyone running Cambridge half marathon? How is the training going? I don't I am as ready this year as last.

 

[JD101]

Hi,

I am T1 and have done more about 315 Parkruns over 15 years so can understand some of the challenges. A couple of things to point out / consider;

1) Most places have events starting at 9am, but in Scotland they start at 9.30am. Depending where you live, it might be interesting to try doing one or two there - on a purely practical level I much prefer the 9am start but my BMs have generally been more conducive to doing a bit better when having the later run time.

2) If you are properly into your running and don't want your results to be impacted (I understand this is the case for most regular parkrunners) I would massively recommend trying to do the usual course / route at 9am on a different day - you can log it as a 'notparkrun' should you wish, but take a BM kit, check just before starting, half-way through and straight after finishing. You can pause your watch / tracking app when you stop part-way through. If you do this a few times, it will give you a good data set to have a better idea what is happening between 9.00 and 9.24am on Saturdays.

I did this over the course of 2-3 weeks several years ago when I was running parkruns every week, several 10ks and a number of half-marathons, and would tend to use my short, medium and long-distance training runs as diabetes training too - taking my BM kit and stopping every 5k to do a quick BM and make a note of the result on my phone, before continuing on. Sure, this was a pain at the time, but the trends I could spot and data I interpreted from it has helped me pre-empt what my BM will likely do, depending on the length of the run and my pace.

As I say, I get the reluctance to impact your recorded time, so go again at 9am on a Sunday for 4-5 weeks, do your usual Saturday thing but test before, during and after when doing that.

I find that my blood sugar has / does generally rise for the first 3-4km then will plateau and then start to drop - what I noticed (in my longer runs - ie. 10km - 22km) was it would then tend to drop by about 4 for every additional 5k I did. This then helped me to pre-emptively take jelly babies / gels at appropriate times for diabetes when I was doing organised HMs. It will be a chew to do, but I expect you will get a benefit from the data it offers.

I've had recent (and ongoing) health issues which have meant I have had to reduce the distances I do (6.5km has been my longest in the last 9 months), but despite this undiagnosed / current 'mystery' health issue, the data and knowledge I got 7/8 years ago still holds some relevance.

Hope this helps, but let me know if you have any questions.

 

[Fern Hopper]

That was very comprehensive and informative.
I have been Type 1 for 57 years and have always exercised a lot. I am 66. HbA1c 37. BMI 22.
It does depend a bit on how far/how fast.
Things have changed as well since cancer diagnosis and treatment.
I am running a half marathon in 10 days. My last slightly longer run was on Wednesday. Just over 10 miles at 9 minute pace. No problems with this. No spikes (unlike Parkrun) and no hypo. I started with BG at about 7 and finished with a BG of about 7. No food on the way round. I have always found it far more difficult to eat whilst running compared to riding the bike.
I like to start Parkrun at less than 5. I have my usual long acting insulin and usually about 1 unit of short acting. I have nothing to eat. My spike, I suppose is not that high at about 12. A slow warm down helps sometimes.
I managed to run a half marathon on just one Weetabix and half a banana. Nothing else to eat until for 6 hours after finishing.
It's a strange condition!
I will try some of your suggestions.

 

[JD101]

I would recommend giving it a go doing your local / regular parkrun courses a go at 9am on other days and testing before, during and after a few times in that case. I used to follow HM training plans but would use the runs on that as 'diabetes training plans' too - even running on the spot while doing BMs to at least keep me from standing still and then struggling to restart!

I have found that it tends to spike initially (and that is often the least consistent and has a bigger range of different things it can do) but after 5km it tends to get more predictable with what happens. The issue with a 5km and a parkrun always is that (unless you use it as a starting point for a longer run straight after) it can knock everything out of sync and you are finished before you get the chance to have the benefit of 'more predictability' afterwards.

For me, anything between 5-9 to start is ok - if it is 10+ before, I have had times when it has been 15+ by the time I am done, and my sugars being higher definitely impacts my times. If it is less than 6 before, depending how tough the course is, I will have anywhere between 2-5 jelly babies and I find my BM tends to then be pretty much what it was when I checked it 15 minutes before 9/9.30. So I have that down pretty well.

As I cannot safely run beyond about 6km just now, I am finding that I am naturally slower and this has less of an adverse impact on my BMs - I can often check my BM before, have nothing at all, do 5-6km, come back and everything still be spot on. I do know (and not sure if this happens for you too) that my pace tends to be better / faster at parkruns than all the other runs I do, running by myself. So (as you say) that is also worth factoring in to your considerations. Again (sorry for being dull and saying), just taking the time to test 5-10 times across different types / speeds of run you do is the best way to make sense of how it impacts differently depending on your pace. Good luck next weekend!

 

[Fern Hopper]

Thanks for that.

 

[alisonhe]

Does anyone know how I can avoid BG spikes during Parkrun?
I have had Type 1 diabetes for 57 years. I am 66 years old. My last HbA1c was 37 and the one 6 months previously was 34. My BMI is 22.I am tightly controlled.
I have my usual long amount of long acting and at least 1 unit of short acting and no food.
I like to start Parkrun with a BG of less than 5. But I know by the finish (about 24 minutes as an average) I will have spiked at about 12. A slow warm down of at least another mile and a half helps a bit but usually I require more insulin to bring BG down.
I appreciate that stress hormones play their part but is there a better way?
Unfortunately, I can feel nauseous above 10.

 

[alisonhe]

I wonder if eating something low carb will help such as a handful of nuts. I take a unit rapid on rising and eat perhaps a piece of homemade raw chocolate (low carb, super healthy and I love it), prior to any workout as my body will flood me with glucose too, it wants to provide energy for a workout after fasting which is a Shame. Works for me, I may also have one soft apricot or a few sip beetroot juice, something healthy that benefits me and is light

 

[Fern Hopper]

I think a spike after Parkrun is almost inevitable. After all I'm trying hard! Longer, slower runs don't spike BG. And I sometimes think I have been Type 1 for 57 years, I have recently recovered from cancer and I am 66 years old. Many of my contemporaries can't do what I can!

 

[Fern Hopper]

I ran Cambridge half marathon in 1.59.11. No hypos and nothing to eat or drink.

 

[SimonP78]

I ran Cambridge half marathon in 1.59.11. No hypos and nothing to eat or drink.

Great, well done

I like to start Parkrun at less than 5. I have my usual long acting insulin and usually about 1 unit of short acting. I have nothing to eat.

Did you do anything different with basal and did you bolus at all compared with what you do for a Parkrun?

 

[Fern Hopper]

Great, well done



Did you do anything different with basal and did you bolus at all compared with what you do for a Parkrun?

Cut basal from 6 to 4. Usual, slightly later in the day, running breakfast of one Weetabix and half a banana. 2.5 units of insulin. Nothing to eat until 6 hours after finishing.

 

[Fern Hopper]

Started with a BG of 7.9. Mile 7 - 10.9. Finish - 5.9.

 

[Fern Hopper]

Early morning 5 mile run this morning. Usual basal insulin. Starting BG of 7.3. Finished with BG of 9.7. 3.5 units of Novorapid. 30g carb breakfast. Hour later BG of 12.3. Why?

 

[Juicyj]

Early morning 5 mile run this morning. Usual basal insulin. Starting BG of 7.3. Finished with BG of 9.7. 3.5 units of Novorapid. 30g carb breakfast. Hour later BG of 12.3. Why?

Hello Fern, am assuming you didn't eat before your run ? It sounds like a liver dump to me, I cannot run first thing unless I have something not matter how small on board, I usually have a few spoons of plain yoghurt and no insulin if in range to trick the liver, means I can run in range without the spike.

The other thing that spikes me is going hard on a run, if it's an easy one I can stay in range, if I push myself then the extra hormones can cause a spike too. On another note, a little trick I use if going low on a run is to do a 5 min sprint which can cause a rise.

 

[Fern Hopper]

But this was a slow, little bimble. Easy 9 minute miles. If I try hard (from previous experience) it usually spikes me. I do this slow one most weeks and it doesn't do this to me. So, I had more insulin than usual, exactly the same food as usual, at the same time as usual. I actually had 3.5 units extra. Considering my usual amount of insulin is about 20 units daily (8 basal and 12 bolus), this is quite an increase. It's a strange condition! And after 57 years it can still surprise me.

 

[In Response]

@Fern Hopper sounds like you are expecting diabetes to be entirely predictable and only affected by what you eat and what exercise you do.

For example, I do not know what the weather is like where you run but today it has been pouring with rain, cold and windy. I know my BG will rocket if I go out on my bike in this weather even if I "bimble" (good word - I usually say "pootle") because I will be so uncomfortable.

 

[Juicyj]

Sadly as you can see it is unpredictable, I can go for a run and can sky rocket some days, it's quite deflating particularly when you have done all you can prior to going out, what we can't see going in internally is if we have an infection or are fighting a bug, if our hormones are out of synch or if our liver simply puts out extra glucose, I simply go by the BG reading and correct when necessary and remind myself of the benefits of exercise vs being sedentary and write runs off when that happens.

 

[Lainie71]

I'll state first that I'm a T2, so what I say may not be entirely relevant to T1.

However, my experience based on fingerprick tests is that my BG readings increase due to stress, be that the physical stress of exercise, or psychological stress. It causes your liver to dump glucose into your system, which is a physiological response to give you the additional energy needed to handle the situation.

The liver's response is unavoidable for all of us. Some T2s are on medications that can reduce the liver's output of glucose, but it still happens. For a T1, I would assume you'd need to somehow dose with insulin, but I have no idea how you'd go about that, or how to calculate based on an unknown carb load from a liver glucose dump.

@Antje77 has done some testing and experimentation with exercise, how it affects BG levels, and has experience dosing insulin for it, so will be able to offer better insight than T2s on the matter.

I am type 2 and I find that what I have eaten the day before and what kind of stresses I have had, will effect both my dp and exercise readings meaning that if I do a good cardio workout for an hour, when I take my reading straight after it will be higher but it will drop about an hour later to what I would call my base level. It will then continue to drop into the 5s thereafter. I am not sure if I am supposed to test straight after my work outs but I do.