Stop Keto Now - The Mice Have Spoken!

[Waveman]

quite odd this report I'd say. Having my bloods go from 75 to 42 in 8 months and lost 10kilo I have to ask who commisioned this study? Cereal manufacturer maybe or tate and lyle?

 

[Birdwoman]

Interesting.. have you ever tried just hot/cold water.. no tea or cream or any food at all from getting up until 1 pm just as a complete elimination experiment?

@bulkbiker and @Brunneria

Please can you give me your thoughts on my 5 day experiment.

I started on Monday morning and drank plant flavoured water in the morning, in fact throughout the day too. I have not had ANY dairy at all. My BG’s have come down a little which they do do sometimes but they are still in the same pattern as before.

Monday FBG 114 - drank water with a couple of slices of cucumber in. - 1hr later 139. 2 hours later - 134. 3 hours later - 129.
lunch pre meal - 101 - ate meat with runner beans.


Tuesday FBG’s 112. water with cucumber. 1 hour later - 128. 2hrs later - 114.
Lunch time pre meal - 106. cold meat with cabbage, cauliflower and a few cherry tomatoes. 2 hr later - 117 (blamed the tomatoes). Evening meal pre meal - 111. cabbage, cauliflower and meat. 2 hrs later - 118.

Wednesday BFG’s 110. water with a piece of lemon. 2 hrs later - 123.
lunch pre meal - 130 cabbage, cauliflower and meat. 1hr later - 131. 2 hrs later - 124. evening meal. pre meal - 106. cabbage and meat. 2hrs later - 105.

Thursday BFG’s - 107. water with cucumber and mint. 1 hrs later - 117. went out for lunch had steak, green beans, half grilled tomato, cauliflower.
Evening pre snack - 103. meat. few blackberries with coconut milk. 2 hrs later - 115.

Friday FBG’s - 105. Water with lemon verbena. 1 hr later - 126

Saturday FBG’s - 113. Water with mint. 1 hr later - 122. 2hrs later - 131.

I have deliberately kept to eating just few things all week, things that I know I am OK with, so as to see any spikes that would occur.

I have not come to anything on this, only that i’m gasping for a cup of tea!!! The only thought I have, is it water??? Any thoughts would be useful.

Thanks

 

[Brunneria]

Hi @Birdwoman

I look at those numbers and they all look fine to me. Seriously.
I’ve no idea what target you have set yourself, but getting fasting bgs down can take months even years of consistent low carbing for some of us. Mine are stubbornly in the 6s (approx 110-130) every day, and i have been low carbing most of my adult life. On a stressful morning the number can easily be over 10 (180+).

A few things stand out to me
- your fruity waters may be dodgy. Worth checking the ingredient list if they are bought? Ignore my comment if you make them yourself with a berry or two in water.
- your fbgs got lower every day, steadily dropping, til saturday, when they rose again. Stress? Different routine?
- are you aware that simple activities like work, shopping, housework, climbing a flight of stairs, etc will constantly affect your blood glucose. Both up and down, as the body balances and regulates its bg levels with mini liver dumps of glucose into the bloodstream, and as blood glucose is pulled into the muscles and organs to cope with daily life. All the rises and falls of your numbers will be affected by that, as well as by food intake.

Your biggest rise all week was the first day, 114-139 at 1hr, which then dropped slowly. That is less than 1mmol/l in uk units!
Since you hadn’t had breakfast, that had to be a liver dump.
But since it was such a tiny rise I would call it pretty insignificant.
Other days, your breakfastless rises were smaller. Perhaps your body was adjusting to not having breakfast?

If you reintroduce dairy, and your numbers spike up, that will indicate something (i hope they don’t, since dairy is a pleasant part of life )

Personally, I find that a protein or fat breakfast (think bacon and eggs or coffee aand cream) will ALWAYS stop a liver dump dead. I used to eat a piece of cheese or a handful of nuts before getting out of bed, back in the days when I worrited about my dawn phen. Nowadays i just put a splash of cream in my 1st cup of the day, and don’t even bother to test any more

 

[Birdwoman]

Hi @Birdwoman

I look at those numbers and they all look fine to me. Seriously.
I’ve no idea what target you have set yourself, but getting fasting bgs down can take months even years of consistent low carbing for some of us. Mine are stubbornly in the 6s (approx 110-130) every day, and i have been low carbing most of my adult life. On a stressful morning the number can easily be over 10 (180+).

A few things stand out to me
- your fruity waters may be dodgy. Worth checking the ingredient list if they are bought? Ignore my comment if you make them yourself with a berry or two in water.
- your fbgs got lower every day, steadily dropping, til saturday, when they rose again. Stress? Different routine?
- are you aware that simple activities like work, shopping, housework, climbing a flight of stairs, etc will constantly affect your blood glucose. Both up and down, as the body balances and regulates its bg levels with mini liver dumps of glucose into the bloodstream, and as blood glucose is pulled into the muscles and organs to cope with daily life. All the rises and falls of your numbers will be affected by that, as well as by food intake.

Your biggest rise all week was the first day, 114-139 at 1hr, which then dropped slowly. That is less than 1mmol/l in uk units!
Since you hadn’t had breakfast, that had to be a liver dump.
But since it was such a tiny rise I would call it pretty insignificant.
Other days, your breakfastless rises were smaller. Perhaps your body was adjusting to not having breakfast?

If you reintroduce dairy, and your numbers spike up, that will indicate something (i hope they don’t, since dairy is a pleasant part of life )

Personally, I find that a protein or fat breakfast (think bacon and eggs or coffee aand cream) will ALWAYS stop a liver dump dead. I used to eat a piece of cheese or a handful of nuts before getting out of bed, back in the days when I worrited about my dawn phen. Nowadays i just put a splash of cream in my 1st cup of the day, and don’t even bother to test any more

Thanks @Brunneria for your thoughts. I did this for 5 days because of the pattern of BG's. I was having like you say cream in my first cup of tea and something protien or fatty for breakfast but whatever I had would not stop the rise of the BG that followed, so did this to see what happened. I am quite happy with my FBG's as they don't seem to rise much at all from the night before, it is the mid morning that I don't understand and that then puts the figures high for the rest of the day.

The water I make myself and is just cucumber, plant leaves or mint, so no baddies hidden. I do know that doing housework etc. can send your BG's up, so I relaxed for the first hour and made other things wait, there was no reason for the rise at all. My numbers do tend to go in a pattern where the whole set of numbers go down and then up again like Saturday's.

Thanks for your help

 

[bulkbiker]

Thanks @Brunneria for your thoughts. I did this for 5 days because of the pattern of BG's. I was having like you say cream in my first cup of tea and something protien or fatty for breakfast but whatever I had would not stop the rise of the BG that followed, so did this to see what happened. I am quite happy with my FBG's as they don't seem to rise much at all from the night before, it is the mid morning that I don't understand and that then puts the figures high for the rest of the day.

The water I make myself and is just cucumber, plant leaves or mint, so no baddies hidden. I do know that doing housework etc. can send your BG's up, so I relaxed for the first hour and made other things wait, there was no reason for the rise at all. My numbers do tend to go in a pattern where the whole set of numbers go down and then up again like Saturday's.

Thanks for your help

I'm guessing that your morning rise is simply a continuation of your dawn phenomenon. Your overall numbers look pretty ok to me and I know from personal experience that the morning numbers can be slow to react to low carbing. Looks like you can go back to the morning coffee if you want!

 

[Birdwoman]

I'm guessing that your morning rise is simply a continuation of your dawn phenomenon. Your overall numbers look pretty ok to me and I know from personal experience that the morning numbers can be slow to react to low carbing. Looks like you can go back to the morning coffee if you want!

Thank you for your thoughts and help. Perhaps it is time.

 

[bulkbiker]

Thank you for your thoughts and help. Perhaps it is time.

Also I should say many congratulations for going through with our suggested experimentation. I hope you discovered something from it.

 

[Birdwoman]

Also I should say many congratulations for going through with our suggested experimentation. I hope you discovered something from it.

Thanks. I think the only thing I learnt was - I cannot alter it, so I have to let it take it's time.

Thanks for your help

 

[Charis1213]

It's all about the amount of carbs. If you want to 'spend' your approx. 20g carb 'allowance' on veg then you can. I have butter on my veg instead of gravy.

I tried WFPB and only lasted a few days. It wasn't for me. I didn't lose weight and my BGs went up. All I can say is if a certain diet doesn't work for me (or stops working when it used to work) then I try something else. I don't dismiss anything until I have tried it and even then I bear in mind that just because it doesn't work for me now, it doesn't mean it won't work at some time in the future.

what is WFPB please ?

 

[Boo1979]

what is WFPB please ?

Whole food plant based
Some people equate that to vegan, and also assert that it isnt possible to be a healthy vegan of any kind, let alone a keto one. Ive never been either vegan or keto so have no views either way, although I incorporate some food from both camps in my diet. There is clearly a range of strong opinion on both sides
See what I mean

Personally speaking I think they are both somewhat at the extremes

 

[Charis1213]

Whole food plant based
Some people equate that to vegan, and also assert that it isnt possible to be a healthy vegan of any kind, let alone a keto one. Ive never been either vegan or keto so have no views either way, but there is clearly a range of strong opinion on both sides
See what I mean

Thank you so much for explaining that to me

 

[Oldvatr]

I always wondered what happened to Basil Brush!

Just watched him being interviewed on TV News today. He has new Xmas single out. Looks exactly as he used to - hasn't changed at all with no silver fox hairs either.