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The Men Who Made Us Fat

I watched the program with interest...

Some of it I already knew, such as the impact of Corn syrup and other 'ose' sweeteners, that shoved into our processed foods and drinks! And I've known for over 20 years, that often 'low fat' processed foods the fat will be replaced with an 'ose' of some sort, Fructose, Sucrose, Maltose etc...

Fat wise, I've always be a septic concerning the 'low fat' but I haven't been a believer of high fat doesn't do any harm moderation is needed in this area!

How anybody can claim that this one program, proves that everybody should be off to follow Atkins and a VLC/HF diet is beyond me indeed.. Nor can I see how anybody can park the blame totally at the door of the manufacturer's and/or scientists for obesity! Nor can I say that it suggests the human underlying trait of 'greed' has absolutely no part in obesity at all!

American housewife's protested over high cost of food, Japanese scientists found a way of processing corn/maize into a cheap sweetener in foods, and the American's having not only the land but the climate to mass produce this, and also cut down import costs of sugar cane and increase export!, several problems solved at once!

Keyes convinced everybody that high fat's caused heart disease and created obesity etc... Yeltin had it right within sucrose was probably the biggest criminal in this area, but his research was based around sugar cane, we know know that any 'ose' such as fructose and Maltose have the same impact!

But the manufacturer's could/can only do what they did and have done purely because of human's gullibility and greed, we brought the products, and we chose one product over another, manufacturer's worked out why, so added more corn syrup or a 'ose', they also unwittingly tapped into how our brains, process our visual sight all based on 'reward' of that food!

We know that sugar cane is sucrose, eat a lot of it you'll put on weight! We know that Fructose is in fruit and you can eat fruit bountifully without putting on weight, so when Corn syrup etc, a very condensed fructose source, nobody sussed in this form it's weight gain abilities were in league with sugar! Our underlying trait of 'greed' is overridden, because we can be greedy without the impact it brings! of weight gain!

Even Atkins realised the 'gullibility and greed' traits of humans in the similar manner has other food manufacturer's have! Reversing some of it, but using certain aspects to aid his claims... Instead of convincing people that it's the highly concentrate fructose of our diets such as corn syrup, which is added to in high quantities to our complex carbs (healthy foods) and to low fat foods to make these more palatable to our taste buds, and in larger quantity... So he goes for maintaining overall quantity by convincing people, eat the fat and protein cut out complex carbs where it happens that these 'high impact concentrated fructose etc' are hidden, he like the manufacturer's don't have to tackle human 'greed' trait but use it to his advantage!

Perhaps it's because I'm the advertisers executive's worst nightmare punter as I ignore their attempts to temp me into their products, now matter how easy, appetising, healthy or 'look what' quantity you can eat 'cheap' nor does MacyD's temp me through their door very often, or can a restaurant tempt me back by giving me a larger portion nope, nothing more off putting than a large plate full of food! But I know plenty of people who would with let's go to so and so's... Get more value for your money (larger portions)!

Don't get me wrong, I'm no saint, I very much suspect if you did the same experiment as they showed at Hammersmith hospital, where they scan the brain's activity when various pictures of different types of food is flashed up! My brain cells would fire up, in similar fashion when a slice of double chocolate fudge cake was flashed up, as being a high reward value food item! But why is it I don't choose to eat it or on the odd occasion that I do, I eat a small amount for reward! When others will chose the to fulfil the reward aspect and will eat as much of that high award as possible!

I'm looking forward to the rest of the series to see what else going on! Next week it's 'super sizing' which is going to be based more around the human trait of 'greed' a bit more, what curtails it and what doesn't! So far simple hints have been given behind this, and that's if the reluctance of an individual to buy two of one item, but will chose a larger portion of a single item!

But impressions and thoughts so far, no individual is to blame, but it does seem a lot of things are basically based around a all or nothing theory though! Wonder how or if, I think differently once the series has finished!
 
swimmer2 wrote:
''To be blunt guys, how much of this stuff do you really know and how much is Google, because I want to make the right choices based on informed debate and experience.''


Google can certainly be very helpful and I use it to highlight the advice given by the NHS, British Heart Foundation and Heart UK when discussing dietary fats, my own choices are based on my experience talking with Endocrinologist, GP's, DSN and last year Cardiologists.......and of course my bg,bp and cholesterol results, what dietary method people follow is up to them to decide but members do need to be told both sides of the debate whether that upsets some people or not, none of us are experts and members both old and new should always keep this in mind.

Hoping to watch The men Who made Us Fat tonight :thumbup:
 
Paul_c said:
this bit on the Mediterranean Diet Pyramid did annoy me though:
Click to expand...

Well the Swedish take on it seems to be that the wine is ok so go for it :)

Alcohol is often consumed daily. The diet contains amongst other things, less sugar, bread, cereals, root crops and rice than a traditional diabetic diet
Click to expand...

They also seem to say it is a higher fat diet so I would simply substitute the "low fat" stuff with real natural Greek yoghurt or similar. You can gaurantee the original Mediterranean regime never had processed "low fat" products in it.

The only reason I didn't choose it was it looked a bit carb rich for me but if you look the majority of the carbs are vegetables and nuts and similar so far less starch.

With all of these things Paul it should just be a case of getting a long term regime put in place that works for you. I don't see tweaking any regime to individualise it as a bad thing so long as its done within the context of giving you safe blood levels. In fact you may need to tweak to get those safe levels.
 
Most recent estimates of the fat content of the Cretan diet (the archetypical Med diet) put the fat content at 27%-30%. Keys put it at 40% but is thought to have overestimated the olive oil.
You have to into account the fat content of the local cheese and yoghurt and of course the amount eaten. A typical Cretan cheese (Anthotyros, Graviera )have a fat content of 38%, Xynotyro has only 20%, cheddar has a fat content of 48%(slightly higher than a full fat camembert at 45%)
The Cretan diet also included significant amounts of omega 3 fatty acids in the wild picked greens that formed an important part of the diet. I notice a lot of elderly people here in SW France also picking 'greens' from the hedgerows. I've tried to do the same and have picked a fair amount of purslane (pourpier), wild asparagus and good King Henry, however I think that you can get the same properties from mache (corn salad)
 
borofergie wrote
yzzy wrote:
When its available going to add a link to my new member post to that program. It is the best thing that's been on the beeb for ages. It validates all that the majority of us have been saying. Show's the whole lot, politicians, sugar industry, fast food industry and especially the low fat food industry and their snivelling sycophant supporters to be complicit in the forced addiction then murder and mutilation of millions of people. No better that Columbian drug lords and just as evil.


They only stay on iPlayer for a week...
Click to expand...

It's now available on Youtube :thumbup:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iE-H__aIEFE

Geoff
 
Interesting programme and covered a lot of ground, Earl Butz won't be a name easily forgotten with his drive to turn around the American economy which resulted in mass production of HFCS, at the Superbowl it was staggering how many food items contained HFCS :shock: As they pointed out fructose suppresses leptin and not knowing when to stop eating is inevitably going to lead to weight gain. The Sugar industries defence of their product was as powerful to that of the tobacco industry in light of the risk of cancer from smoking their products.....shame on them!

Back in the UK they made a good point about how we have become a nation of snackers, eat three good meals and there's no reason to snack but the addictive and pleasing nature of sugar and fatty food is a problem not easily overcome as they showed in those tests.

It has to come down to going back to basics, cook fresh wholesome food yourself and you can control the levels of sugar, salt and fat in your diet, education is the key but obesity will not be a problem easily solved overnight.

Looking forward to Super-size :thumbup:
 
those new fangled breakfast biscuits/bars they're pushing at those who haven't enough time for a proper breakfast look like they're gonna be deadly to people's health in the long term as they're packed with carbs and sugars... and they're promoted as healthy as well!!! (pushed on the no HFCS aspect).

(Not sure if any of the images below will show for others, so here's the link to the actual page:)
http://www.nutrigrain.com/product-detail.aspx?product=336#

ServeImage.aspx


Nutri-grain bars have 24grams of carbs per bar!!! from a 37gram bar... and 12 of those grams are sugar as well...

if you look carefully, they have corn syrup listed as an ingredient... isn't that the new "name" for high-fructose corn-syrup?

ServeImage.aspx
 
librarising said:
borofergie wrote
yzzy wrote:
When its available going to add a link to my new member post to that program. It is the best thing that's been on the beeb for ages. It validates all that the majority of us have been saying. Show's the whole lot, politicians, sugar industry, fast food industry and especially the low fat food industry and their snivelling sycophant supporters to be complicit in the forced addiction then murder and mutilation of millions of people. No better that Columbian drug lords and just as evil.


They only stay on iPlayer for a week...
Click to expand...

It's now available on Youtube :thumbup:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iE-H__aIEFE

Geoff
Click to expand...

Thanks Geoff!
 
noblehead said:
It has to come down to going back to basics, cook fresh wholesome food yourself and you can control the levels of sugar, salt and fat in your diet, education is the key but obesity will not be a problem easily solved overnight.
Click to expand...

+1

I do think it really is that simple Nigel.
 
Paul_c said:
if you look carefully, they have corn syrup listed as an ingredient... isn't that the new "name" for high-fructose corn-syrup?
Click to expand...

You are partially correct Paul. The Corn Refiners Association recently tried to change HFCS's name to "corn syrup" in what was seen as an attempt to give HFCS a nice healthy makeover but the FDA told them where to get off.

http://www.fda.gov/AboutFDA/Centers.../CFSANFOIAElectronicReadingRoom/ucm305226.htm

It got rejected for a number of reasons but primarily because in the US Corn Syrup is already a well known existing product, presumably what comes from corn before you process it into HFCS. Some people are fructose intolerant and therefore have to avoid HFCS but can eat corn syrup. The FDA ruled it was not in the public interest to allow the name change for that reason and the fact that chemically the two things are different.

My guess is therefore the bar does contain plain corn syrup not HFCS. In the UK corn syrup would appear to be the same as golden syrup. Still a shed loads of carbs and sugar though so a typical "healthy" Kellogg's product.

A common ingredient in the US, corn syrup is made by adding enzymes to corn starch, which turns it into a thick syrup of dextrose, maltose and/or glucose. It comes in two flavours – dark and light. Light corn syrup is very sweet, like golden syrup while dark corn syrup is similar in flavour to molasses. Corn syrup is used widely in the food industry for sweetening soft drinks, alcohol, ketchup and pickles
Click to expand...
 
As I mentioned in the my previous post that manufacturer's such as Kellogg's aren't the only one to fill our foods with rubbish!

I looked at the ingredients of the Atkins Day Break Crunchy Muesli Cereal

And this is it's listed ingredients

Ingredients: 34% Soy flakes, 18% oat flakes, 13% coconut flakes, 9% Cashew nut pieces, Fibre blend (polydextrose, dextrin, fructooligosaccharide, inulin), 4% Linseed, 3% bran crisps (wheat bran, wheat flour, rice flour, sunflower oil, emulsifer (lecithin), 3% sunflower seeds, 3% almond pieces, vegetable oil, Sweeteners (isomalt, sucralose), Wheat flour, Oat bran, Barley malt, Flavouring, Salt.

Nutritional values

Nutrition information per serving of 25g (13 servings in box): 121 kCal, Protein 5.2g, Fat 7.3g of which saturates 2.7g, Carbohydrates 6.4g of which sugars 0.7g, polyols 0.2g, Dietary fibre 4.8g, Sodium 3mg. Note that if you use milk, for example 100ml, this adds 3.5g of net carbs to your carb count.

Now, you think that because they list isomalt, sucraslose as sweeteners, that these are the only one's added, but polydestrose and fructoolgosaccharide etc are also sweeteners.. so is barely malt! So it's loaded with sweeteners of various kinds... and lecithin sounds foul indeed!

So again, not safety from hidden additives! The company who claims that they have the answer to obesity, weight loss are also using the same tactics as those they claimed caused obesity in the first place!

Reading this and looking into the ingredients of their version of 'healthy foods' don't think I can buy into their other claims of 'healthy eating'
 
It strikes me these days when I'm in asda that despite it being a huge building there is very little there worth buying. Cereal is a perfect example nearly half an aisle of it and yet it's all rubbish :sick:
 
jopar said:
As I mentioned in the my previous post that manufacturer's such as Kellogg's aren't the only one to fill our foods with rubbish!

I looked at the ingredients of the Atkins Day Break Crunchy Muesli Cereal

And this is it's listed ingredients

Ingredients: 34% Soy flakes, 18% oat flakes, 13% coconut flakes, 9% Cashew nut pieces, Fibre blend (polydextrose, dextrin, fructooligosaccharide, inulin), 4% Linseed, 3% bran crisps (wheat bran, wheat flour, rice flour, sunflower oil, emulsifer (lecithin), 3% sunflower seeds, 3% almond pieces, vegetable oil, Sweeteners (isomalt, sucralose), Wheat flour, Oat bran, Barley malt, Flavouring, Salt.

Nutritional values

Nutrition information per serving of 25g (13 servings in box): 121 kCal, Protein 5.2g, Fat 7.3g of which saturates 2.7g, Carbohydrates 6.4g of which sugars 0.7g, polyols 0.2g, Dietary fibre 4.8g, Sodium 3mg. Note that if you use milk, for example 100ml, this adds 3.5g of net carbs to your carb count.

Now, you think that because they list isomalt, sucraslose as sweeteners, that these are the only one's added, but polydestrose and fructoolgosaccharide etc are also sweeteners.. so is barely malt! So it's loaded with sweeteners of various kinds... and lecithin sounds foul indeed!

So again, not safety from hidden additives! The company who claims that they have the answer to obesity, weight loss are also using the same tactics as those they claimed caused obesity in the first place!

Reading this and looking into the ingredients of their version of 'healthy foods' don't think I can buy into their other claims of 'healthy eating'
Click to expand...

Let's get this straight - you're trying to accuse Atkins - the people that more or less invented the low-carb diet* - of trying to sneak carbohydrates into their food? :shock:

I think you'll find that those products are intended to be low-carb replacements for the carbohydrate filled **** that is forced down our throats in aisle of the supermarket. It's not surprising that they have to fill them with nasty chemicals to make them taste like "the real thing". These products are a long-way from the original Atkins philiosophy, but hey, everyone's gotta make a buck.



* yes, I do know about Banting.
 
Borofergie is right about the Atkins Company products being a long way from his original philosophy, which really can be boiled down to "eat fresh, unprocessed food, preferably organic if you can afford it, and avoid too many carbohydrates". The initial 2 weeks Induction phase was to break the carbohydrate cravings; then you are supposed to increase your carbs by 5g per day until you stop losing weight. Then you drop off the last 5g of carb you've added, and that's the level of carb you need. It varies from person to person.

Remember the initial diet was for weight loss; the effects on blood pressure and blood glucose levels was a happy side-effect. :D

I know some of the products were brought in while he was still alive; who knows whether he would have approved of what's being produced now?

The only Atkins product I buy on a regular basis (a box of 5 once a month) are the Atkins Daybreak Bars, chocolate flavour, which I find can be useful as a meal replacement if I'm running late.

IMHO I see no point in eating carb-substitutes on a daily basis if you're trying to break your carb cravings! Also I can't afford to buy them :lol: :lol:

Viv 8)
 
I've just watched the second programme which I taped last week. Did anyone see the breakfast you could buy at the beginning of the programme? It weighed as much as a small child and included 12 sausages, 12 rashers, 4 slices each of bread, toast, fried bread, tomatoes, an eight egg potato omelette, sauted potatoes, hash browns, black pudding, baked beans and 4 eggs. If you could eat it all in 1 hr you got the money back!. Now that's what you call supersizing. I thought it was interesting that some of the research showed that children don't actually move about less than they used to, but advertising etc encourages them (and subsequently parents) to see snacking as normal and most of the snacks were high sugar sweets and biscuits. The weight goes on which then means that exercising is harder.
 
Chris Lowe's post reminds me of my student days in Birmingham. There was a caff called "Mick's Grill" across the Bristol Road South from the University. He specialised in mixed grills, and the deal was "if you can eat two you get the third free!"

I have only ever known one person who got (and ate :shock: ) the third. He's very respectable now, so I won't mention his name, but he has always been able to eat (two pizzas if we went to the Italian; a whole granary cob in a day when on site in winter) though on the whole he ate a good diet. A very appreciative person to cook for!

Needless to say he has never put on much weight and is still as lean as he ever was! I don't think he does much exercise either, apart from being a naturally active person. It's just not fair! :mrgreen:

Viv 8)
 
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