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Weight loss surgery, anyone any experience?

Discussion in 'Weight Loss and Dieting' started by Janice2209, Sep 17, 2014.

  1. Pipp

    Pipp Type 2 · Expert
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    If you can sort out the psychological stuff, you could find surgery is not necessary. I am hoping that is what I have done, but I am a work in progress, like yourself, @Loobles .

    However, this is not helping the OP. Once again, I risk giving an opinion. I believe @Janice2209 needs to urgently lose some of the weight quickly. Have the psych consultation, then make a decision. If at all possible, the consultant offering the bariatric surgery team should offer support of those patients who feel able, who have had the surgery some time ago.

    Unfortunately, again just my opinion, surgeons seem to take a mechanistic view of patients, rather than an holistic view. So it is unlikely that the emotional and psychological needs of their patients will be given any consideration.
     
  2. Loobles

    Loobles Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, I thought I'd written my post with the intention of answering the original post?
     
  3. Pipp

    Pipp Type 2 · Expert
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    You did. I probably didn't.
     
  4. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    So sorry to have not replied. I didn't realise there were any as the e-mail notifications had stopped.

    Loobles, thank you so much for your full and honest response.

    I don't think I have a full blown eating disorder (EDNOS, Bulimia, etc), but I do think I have an unhealthy relationship with food and I use it too much to fix emotional issues rather than other coping strategies. I'm not talking about bingeing on chocolate and we don't eat takeaways - just eating too much.

    I show the classic pattern throughout life of weight gain, diet and successful weight loss, something knocks me off the diet, re-gain all the weight I lost plus more again. I had got to the stage of being afraid to try to lose weight because if I was successful then in a year's time I would be back at square one plus extra.

    I am also a swimmer but I haven't swum regularly now for a couple of years. I was told to stop swimming by a nurse because I had athletes foot and that took a couple of months to clear up and by that time I was roundly told off by another nurse for putting some weight on (honestly she treated my like a 12 year old) and I just have found it very difficult to go back to it. I now have to shower before I dress in a morning as I am so heavy I can't reach to clean myself properly and I'm embarrassed in the changing rooms. (Private club but not private showers and I don't fit in the two private changing rooms there are). Stupid excuses I know, I enjoy swimming and I need to find a way to re-motivate myself.

    I can't walk very far (which is another exercise I enjoyed) as I suffered a dislocated, compound fracture of my ankle which ended up with infection in the bone. It took 3 and a half years to sort out the infection and now I have a deformed joint that means I can only walk a very short distance. Being unable to walk far causes weight gain which makes it even more difficult to walk. Vicious circle.

    I will probably go ahead with the surgery. It may be that I can have the surgery followed by a CBT course of some kind or need the CBT course first. I certainly feel the need to talk things through. Assuming I do go through with it I want it to be successful.

    I also had the shock of my GP making the suggestion and it allowed me to try to lose weight again and I successfully lost 7kg in about 8 weeks. I've since put 2kg of those back on. I am now pretty certain that I can't lose all the weight I need to without the surgery. My focus now is to make the surgery as safe as possible (so swimming to strengthen my heart and reduce my blood pressure; as well as losing whatever weight I can as well); and then to make it as successful as possible by preparing my food brain and getting the right post operative emotional support in place.

    Thank you for listening and all your past and future comments. Loobles, I'll look for your other thread.
     
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  5. Pipp

    Pipp Type 2 · Expert
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    @Janice2209
    I do hope all goes well for you. You have been so open and honest about the difficulties you are facing. I can identify with much of what you have said. If you feel able to, please keep us updated.

    Best wishes
    Pipp
     
  6. Totto

    Totto Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    But LCHF isn't a diet. It is a life style and it works so well for so many. Please give it a try! Before you mutilate yourself.

    And also try a good CBT person,

    Have you really looked through the Diet Doc site? There are a lot of very over weight people indeed who have changed their eating habits and lost like a lot, like 70-100 kilograms, It is not that difficult, you know. And kept their lower weight as the way of eating is so nice an very easy.
     
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  7. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    Totto, I've been there, got the T-shirt, etc. I am 58 and changed my lifestyle several times. I've successfully lost weight several times and sustained both the lifestyle and the weight loss for up to 2 years. Then something happens that knocks me off course and the weight goes back on. It is very much that difficult and is very much not easy.

    I totally agree with Pipp and Lou that I have to have the psych consult and probably a CBT course before I make my final decision. Believe me if there is another way I would prefer not to have my innards re-plumbed.

    The human body is incredibly complicated. There are hormones we know little about and their role in our metabolic system is still being studied. 100 years ago T1 diabetes was probably a fairly quick death and T2 if it existed was only noticed when there was no insulin produced by the pancreas so a slightly slower death. So we now have insulin injections to control diabetes.

    The treatment for cancer is brutal. Surgery, chemotherapy (controlled poisoning) and radiotherapy (cell mutilation and death). In 100 years people may look back at these treatments and think they were barbaric and mutilating.

    Cystic Fibrosis is a genetic condition that now can be treated with gene therapy.

    Chronic, morbid obesity may have a number of causes. It may be that in this environment of plenty we are now seeing the results but not the cause. Put one or two of the possible causes together and you have a problem.

    Possible causes:-

    1. A genetic pre-disposition.
    2. A hormone influence.
    3. A mental blip
    4. Food industry profits
    5. Lack of education (healthy diet, cooking skills)
    6. Eating too much and not exercising enough
    7. Pure laziness and greed

    The popular press would like to ascribe all fat people to point 7, particularly if they are on benefits.

    So if I do go ahead with this surgery it will be in the knowledge that I am willingly asking surgeons to mutilate my body but the result is probably that I will live longer. In years to come there may be genetic therapies, CBT and drugs that will address 1-3. I am doing my best to teach my grandchildren to cook and hopefully turkey twizzlers are a thing of the past.

    I look at this surgery as a crude and barbaric solution to a problem that will be solved differently in the future.
     
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  8. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    I saw the consultant this morning. Good chat, next appointment in three months. Good news is that I don't have sleep apnoea, bad news is that the psych consult could take another 2 or 3 months. I want to be sure my head is the right place before any other decisions. Maybe if I can address my dysfunctional relationship with food mentally then I may not need surgery.
     
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  9. Loobles

    Loobles Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    For what its worth i do think the psychological help for eating issues is getting better. The problem is many don't know the help exists so don't ask for it and some doctors aren't proactive at suggesting it. I'm having great results from CBT but it's slow going and probably the most difficult thing i've ever done. Good luck with it, it really sounds like you've done your research x
     
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  10. Paul Burton

    Paul Burton · Member

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    My Mum lost a very close friend who had a band fitted because she continued eating to excess after it was fitted something burst and she died so be very careful. I suggest you try this first as you should definitely loose weight.
    I would just like to let you know a system that works. If you eat 20 grams of carbs per day for three days and then on the fourth day women should eat 40 grams of carbs and men should eat 60 grams of carbs, I call this the high carb day, then for the next four days eat 20 grams of carbs per day then have the high carb day i.e. women should eat 40 grams of carbs and men should eat 60 grams of carbs then for three days eat 20 grams of carbs just keep repeating three days on the low carb then the fourth day the high carb day as above then the four days low carb then the high carb. The great thing about this system is it fools your body into using your fat stores for fuel. The advantage is you don't get hungry as you can eat as much as you like of foods with no carbs i.e. meat fish cheese etc. If you get the Collins Carb Counting book it lists loads of foods with their carb values. The additional info you need is the Collins book also lists the net carb value of foods so for instance nuts have fibre so they have a nil value of net carbs for the diet point of view. You will have to check with your diabetes advisers as to if you have to include the insulin for those items just to be safe. I have lost a stone in six weeks. If you get hungry it is well worth drinking water and as I say you can eat nuts etc. My wife is also doing this diet but struggled to loose any weight initially as she has recently been diagnosed with thyroid problems and has to take tablets for that but now the tablets are working the diet is working. before that she just kept putting weight on even though she was cutting down on her food. At least when she was following the low carb high carb diet she wasn't putting the weight on. It is important to make sure you do eat the 20 grams of carbs per day to keep your body in working order. The difficult thing is working out the different meals with the reduced amount of carbs. If after the three or four days i.e. on the high carb day you have way over the 40 or 60 grams of carbs you can get light headed I guess it's a sugar rush so be careful. I hope this helps you people trying to loose weight. Some people report because their bodies switch from using the food they normally eat to using their body fat for food and fuel they have more energy. As with all diets if you can increase the amount of exercise you do this helps you burn more fat off more quickly. I sit and work at a computer all day so don’t get enough exercise. At lunch time I saw up my firewood this is a win win as I then get a bit of exercise and I get a nice pile of fire wood and chopped logs for the fire. Obviously this is easier for me as I work from home. Another thing I now do is more regularly walk to the shops to buy your food rather than driving etc. Glass of red wine on this diet is low carb a whiskey is no carbs. Cheers!
     
  11. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    Thanks Paul for your input.

    To be honest a stone in six weeks is what you should expect from any diet. I'm glad it is working for you and your wife. Enjoy your whiskey (presumably not scotch).

    I don't have any problem losing weight, I can see your stone in six weeks, match it and better it by at least a stone.

    What I can't do is sustain the weight loss over more than a year.
     
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  12. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    Oh, and your mother losing a friend through something bursting after overeating after a lap band? Well she obviously didn't have her head sorted out about her eating issues before having surgery. This is precisely why I'm doing my research and taking my time. Lap band surgery has fallen out of favour anyway and is very rarely recommended these days.
     
  13. Pipp

    Pipp Type 2 · Expert
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    Just because you haven't in the past does not mean you will not be able to in the future.
    Do not let your past determine your behaviour in the present and future.
    I used to think like you, and had similar problems with weight loss and weight gain. It is a constant battle, but one I am winning.
    Best wishes
    Pipp
     
  14. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    Please, please, please could I ask that you leave diet and lifestyle suggestions out of this thread. I have had it up to the earlobes with advice from well meaning people. I can do the maths of calories in and calories out. I could give lessons on simple and complex carbs; GI calculations; calorie content; low carbing; bulimia; you name it I could give a convincing lecture on it. Please, please, please don't suggest hypnosis.

    I have a severe ankle injury that means I am disabled. I can't tell you how much I miss simply going for a walk let alone being able to stand up and walk around the kitchen long enough to make a meal without having to take a sit down break.

    The one refreshing thing about the bariatric team at the hospital is that they are totally non-judgemental. They know I have tried everything and I'm at the last chance saloon.

    So please, anyone with helpful suggestions or experience I'd love to hear from you.

    Loobies, I'm still waiting for the psych consult, it may be I'm then put on a CBT course. You say it is one of the hardest things you've ever done. Can you explain and elaborate on that?
     
  15. jack412

    jack412 Type 2 · Expert

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    It's not a magic wand or a panacea. the bariatric surgery has a 1:3-5 people gaining weight after initial loss. and the weight loss comes because you can't physically eat

    you can listen to Dr Taylor's latest lecture from a link on this page.
    http://www.ncl.ac.uk/events/public-lectures/item.php?roy-taylor-diabetes

    Knowing and doing is a separate thing, I know I should do the 8 week Newcastle because I'm stuck at my current weight after losing 10kg
    but in an ideal world, I'd do the Newcastle and then do my lazy LCHF type of diet..which is a "keeps a stable weight" diet...so that's good
    I think I need some of my own advice :)
     
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  16. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    Thank you Jack, as you say the knowing and doing are separate things, which is where all the head stuff comes in. I rarely eat rubbish and am a very good cook, with a meal cooked from scratch most evenings. I will listen to the link.

    I was 104kg 8 years ago and working on it after finally packing in the job with extensive travel and stress. I really thought I was getting somewhere and thoroughly enjoying the gym workouts. 75kg was a realistic possibility in six months. Then the stupid boy drove too fast around a wet corner, lost control and hit a lorry. Thank goodness it was a lorry and not a family car. Dan was the only fatal casualty and nobody else had any physical injuries but I'm not sure how long the lorry driver was off work and whether he ever went back. Dan was my husband's 23 year old son and my much loved stepson.

    I was already very obese at 104kg and on the roller coaster of weight loss and regain but the loss of Dan and the fallout in every aspect of our lives has been overwhelming. I've had a net gain of 31kg since then, with the roller coaster giving me shorter rides. I have to find some way off this roller coaster before it kills me. Bariatric surgery is one option, the other is diet and exercise with mental health support. I'm still waiting for the first consult with mental heath even though I was referred in July.

    I took my six year old grandson to stay with my son's family in Surrey for half term. We went to LEGOLAND. I managed to avoid all the rides but we got separated and I queued for 40 minutes with Jackson for the helicopter ride and then found I could not fit into it. It wasn't that it was uncomfortable, I literally could not put one knee close enough to the other knee to fit in. Fortunately my son appeared at that point and was able vault the fence and swap with me.

    I realise that bariatric surgery is not a magic bullet and a gastric bypass will only get you down to the middle of the obese range through not physically being able to eat. After that hopefully I will have established a healthy eating and exercise regime I can live with. I realise that this is not an easy route but I have to do something.

    Pipp, how much weight have you lost?
     
  17. Pipp

    Pipp Type 2 · Expert
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    @Janice2209
    I am so sorry for your loss of your stepson, Dan. How awful for you, and no wonder your weight loss was derailed.

    I am not sure how forum members can help you, as I don't know what sort of suggestions you are looking for. You have told us what it is you don't want. So I am loathe to give advice. I can identify with some of your emotions around food. I too know all about nutrition, and I have previously had weight loss derailed by tragic circumstances.

    However, you have asked about my weight loss, so briefly; I weighed 144kg 4 years ago. I followed Newcastle diet method, and within days my BG became non-diabetic levels and have remained so for over 3 years. My weight dropped to 92kg,. I have since gained 15kg , following immobility due to 2 major operations, but recently have started to lose weight again. Currently I weigh 102 kg. i am also disabled, not able to walk very far, following road accident 22 years ago. I have wheelchair which I hate, but I exercise in water at least 5 hours a week.

    My decision to finally lose the weight came from reading the Newcastle research papers, and the chance to reverse diabetes. The alternative was bariatric surgery. I have had enough surgery to last several lifetimes, and have allergic reactions to many anaesthetic agents, so the threat of more surgery was the catalyst that worked for me.

    I hope you can find something that works for you too, but I hope you will forgive me for mentioning that you appear to have grief of the loss of Dan to deal with too.
     
  18. Janice2209

    Janice2209 Type 2 (in remission!) · Active Member

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    I thought I'd replied to this but obviously never posted it.

    Did anyone listen to You and Yours yesterday (11th November 2014), specifically on weight loss surgery, available on listen again for the next week. Some very interesting comments about genetic pre-disposition and hormonal changes in obesity that make it very difficult to sustain weight loss.

    I'm very sorry if I got a bit shouty about what I didn't want. What I do want from the forum is very simple, experience and opinions from people who have undergone or considered weight loss surgery.

    Pipp, thank you so much for being so straight forward in your reply. I should have said that I'd gone from 116kg to 104kg 8 years ago before Dan died to make the roller coaster a bit more realistic. Whatever, I do know I have lots of issues to work through, Dan dying was one of the triggers over the years that has knocked me off course. I'm sure we can all name several life changing moments but not all of us end up putting weight on over it and not all of us can point at something quite so traumatic (fortunately). A couple of years ago a nurse really upset me (I think I've said this up thread) and that was enough to throw me off the weight loss course again.

    I've had another look at the Newcastle diet and, whilst I know it could work in the short term, I'm pretty certain it is not something I could use to maintain weight loss. I'm very glad it has worked for you, 144 down to 92 is impressive and even though this has crept back up I hope you are successful in losing more weight.

    Please note I have not said, "Well done you" or "You must be very proud of yourself". I've learned over the years that whilst I am very happy each time I have achieved weight loss it the comments come back to bite me when I put weight back on. The converse of "being proud of yourself" is to "be ashamed of yourself". My friends don't actually say (to my face), "You must be ashamed of putting that weight back on" but I do feel it. As if social and media shaming wasn't enough I can do it to myself as well. Thank goodness I'm not a catholic!

    I'm a bit in limbo at the moment because waiting for the psych consult. I've gone through all the other tests, consults and meetings and would be on the maximum 18 week countdown if it wasn't for this. I'm not sure why the wait is so long.
     
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  19. jack412

    jack412 Type 2 · Expert

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    it may be carb sensitivity and triggers a carb craving? you may need to stay below your carb level for life
    http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/lowcarbliving/a/Food-Cravings.htm
    http://lowcarbdiets.about.com/od/lowcarb101/a/carblevel.htm

    https://www.google.com.au/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&rlz=1C1AVNA_enAU560AU561&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=carb sensitivity
     
  20. jack412

    jack412 Type 2 · Expert

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    I have a close relative that has had the surgery, there is still a life time diet, the hardest part is being ok with healthy fats in the diet again

    Dr Eric C. Westman, MD and president elect of the American Society of Bariatric Physicians, has 15 years of experience helping patients lose weight and improve their health using low carb. He has also helped do several high-quality scientific studies on low carb.

     
    #60 jack412, Nov 13, 2014 at 1:47 AM
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 13, 2014
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