Weightwatchers new tie in to Big Pharma

[Oldvatr]

Revealed: experts who praised new âskinny jabâ received payments from drug maker

Novo Nordisk gave millions to obesity charities and healthcare professionals, including expert who advised Nice

www.theguardian.com

Quelle surprise!

In a nutshell. What a salvo that article has in it. Very investigative journalism and the best takedown I have seen in ages, The proof is in the pudding.

Beware of lookalikes that are cheaper because they have been diluted with other additives to get round the FDA regulations

Obesity specialists warn against 'bootleg' weight-loss drug

Semaglutide, a weight-loss drug developed by Novo Nordisk, is currently in short supply due to high demand, leading some people to seek out

www.advisory.com

Note that the FDA ha a warning about possible thyroid cancer for this drug and we have seen at least two forum members reporting such dignosis after starting this drug.

There is also reports of DKA in insulin users on this drug.

The Mayo Clinic which is a diabetes Centre of Excellence, reports a large list of drugs that are not compatible with Ozempic

Semaglutide (Subcutaneous Route) Side Effects - Mayo Clinic

Now I suspect that this will to a certain extent be controlled for us T2D diabetics, but the general public using Wegovy at a much higher dose and a 2 year treatment phase are currently able to get it online and the only limitation on the application is BMI (weight and height) and that is self declaraton, and not from medical records. ?The public are not being given this info so far. We have a Wunderkindt on the block.

 

[Outlier]

Feeling the swish of the scythe there, and profoundly grateful I was never prescribed this.

Appreciative of the investigative power of the Board here, and its members. Thanks all. Thanks keto.

 

[Oldvatr]

Follow up by the Beeb regarding this move to provide a turnkey solution to obesity

Weight-loss: Are injections the answer to tackling obesity?

The appeal is clear - but should we be turning to appetite-suppressing injections?

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[AloeSvea]

Well, it's made the news in New Zealand today, but NZ is generally at least ten years behind the UK in prescription drugs so I suspect by the time it becomes available here any drawbacks will well and truly have been demonstrated.

I have no issue with it being prescribed for T2s who it benefits, under the supervision of a GP. Handing it out without proper medical supervision seems dangerous to me.

Disclaimer, I've never used it personally, though I'm a big fan of drugs in their place.

I'm very interested too in prescription drugs for people with diabetes. If not for myself at least generally speaking. I didn't know that Aotearoa/NZ was 10 years, at least, behind the UK in this regard. My understanding is that when something comes out in the US and the UK, especially if it has been developed in the US or Europe, NZ is pretty swift in having it available, as with the example of ozempic. Whether or not it is state funded - now that is another story. They can still be prescribed, (and def bought online as in all internet connected countries, whether or not this is legal I don't know) but they might be available, but not be Pharmac-funded. Is that what you meant, or? If that was not what you meant - I would love to have a gander at the source!

I think too, judging from a 'The Project' news item the other day, there is supply issues around Ozempic, somewhat caused by either trade issues, and, its incredible new popularity outside of the diabetes community!

As for this new wonder drug - I realised this one was - different? As even my daughter knew about it and discussed it with me last weekend. For a weight-loss drug directed at those with type two and she had heard of it - that really was something! She tells me it's all the rage in LA at the moment, and not for those with diabetes, but for those with the money who want a get-slim quick aid.

I am no scientist, but am interested, but I don't really understand how a pharmaceutical can do the lionesses work in weight loss in the same way that what food you eat and drinks can. The Project news item said it used hormone analogs, I think. (Appetite ones I assume.) Saying that, I was affected by metformin, plain old metformin, as a weight loss aid. I absolutely did and do have side effects from that though, which I do not like, like B12 depletion, which is serious indeed, especially over time. What anti-diabetes medication doesn't have side effects? Are there any? My understanding is that there isn't. A long way of me saying - First and foremost using up your fat stores on your body can be safest done and best done by changing the food you eat,and timing issues etc.

Here is The Project news item, at any rate

 

[EllieM]

I'm very interested too in prescription drugs for people with diabetes. If not for myself at least generally speaking. I didn't know that Aotearoa/NZ was 10 years, at least, behind the UK in this regard.

Fair challenge, I must admit I was pulling that figure out of this air. I just know that as a T1 there are a number of drugs available in the UK and Australia that are not available here. And last time (just before covid) when I looked at T2 drugs there seemed to be quite a few that weren't on the NZ shelves, though I admit that my T2 knowledge is patchy.

 

[AloeSvea]

Fair challenge, I must admit I was pulling that figure out of this air. I just know that as a T1 there are a number of drugs available in the UK and Australia that are not available here. And last time (just before covid) when I looked at T2 drugs there seemed to be quite a few that weren't on the NZ shelves, though I admit that my T2 knowledge is patchy.

Well - the immigrant-from-the -British-Isles experience is a very special one, perhaps?

 

[Oldvatr]

Fair challenge, I must admit I was pulling that figure out of this air. I just know that as a T1 there are a number of drugs available in the UK and Australia that are not available here. And last time (just before covid) when I looked at T2 drugs there seemed to be quite a few that weren't on the NZ shelves, though I admit that my T2 knowledge is patchy.

Drugs change names when they cross national boundaries. For instance, Gliclazide is UK and Europe, and is not available in USA.. But the same drug is called Diamicron or Zircon, amongst others and those are the USA versions. It is a market share agreement problem as well as cross-licencing.

 

[Oldvatr]

I don't want to worry anyone, but I was doing some research into another medication that predates these wonderdrugs, but does much the same thing. I am talking Acarbose, which is a T2D medication, and is cheap and plentiful. It has been around for donkeys years, end has a long track record. It is not common in the UK, but I have seen it in Boots as an OTC for weightloss. It is found in USA and mainly in the Eastern Bloc in places like Iran and India.

The safety and FDA trials showed no problems apart from gastric distress, but nothing serious. The drug works by delaying stomach emptying, and research has shown that it increases GLP-1 peptides, just like drugs like Ozempic. Acarbose has a small effect re glucose level reduction, and reduces apetite and hence weight like the GLP-1 argonists. It too causes severe nausea and flatulence like them.

But it is ultra cheap to make,

Now my research has found that it is associated with gallbladder problems that leads to requiring surgery and removal. Gall stones and bile duct blockages is fairly common it seems in the long term.

The role of GLP-1 in the postprandial effects of acarbose in type 2 diabetes

Aims The alpha-glucosidase inhibitor acarbose is believed to reduce plasma glucose by delaying hydrolysis of carbohydrates. Acarbose-induced transfer of carbohydrates to the distal parts of the intestine increases circulating glucagon-like peptide 1 (GLP-1). Using the GLP-1 receptor antagonist...

eje.bioscientifica.com

We are already seeing the first shots in this war

Link Between Ozempic and Gallbladder Disease? | Ozempic Lawyer

There have been numerous adverse event reports related to the diabetes drug Ozempic and gallbladder disease as well as thyroid cancer.

www.rheingoldlaw.com

It is also considered to be the cause of severe liver damage that can be fatal.

Acarbose - LiverTox - NCBI Bookshelf

There is also a possible connection to alzheimers but its good news for women. This group experienced reduced onset of dementia while taking acarbose, but men went to their doom as usual.

Dementia Risk in Type 2 Diabetes Patients: Acarbose Use and Its Joint Effects with Metformin and Pioglitazone - PubMed

This population-based retrospective cohort study investigated dementia risk associated with acarbose in patients with type 2 diabetes mellitus by using Taiwan's National Health Insurance database. A cohort of 15,524 matched pairs of ever and never users of acarbose based on propensity score...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

My concern is that by opening up to off label use and effectively OTC has opened the door for more guineapigs, but are they being properly monitored? Will Weightwatchers be using the yellow card system?