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Type 2 When are blood sugar values 'high' for white rice, white bread and potatoes?

R

resander

Well-Known Member
Messages
122
Location
London, Dagenham
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
WHEN I EAT: ----- MY T2 BLOOD SUGAR [mmol/L] after 2 hours
white rice 200g 13-15
white rice 100g 9-12
1 slice white bread 9-11
2 slices white bread 12.5 or higher
150g boiled new potatoes 7-8 (smiling)
150g boiled old potatoes 9-11
150g instant potato mash 11 and higher

I think these blood sugar values are high, but don't know. Are they?
So, I am only eating new potatoes, rejecting the others.
Would be interesting too see your values for some of these?

white rice = long grain rice, white bread = medium slice,
potatoes = in plastic bags
all as sold in ASDA, Tesco, Sainsburys,....
 
Also is slightly dependent on the readings before eating all that...
Personally I try to be under 6 mmol/l at all times so would freak out at your levels.
Then again I don't eat any of the foods you mention...
 
resander said:
WHEN I EAT: ----- MY T2 BLOOD SUGAR [mmol/L] after 2 hours
white rice 200g 13-15
white rice 100g 9-12
1 slice white bread 9-11
2 slices white bread 12.5 or higher
150g boiled new potatoes 7-8 (smiling)
150g boiled old potatoes 9-11
150g instant potato mash 11 and higher

I think these blood sugar values are high, but don't know. Are they?
So, I am only eating new potatoes, rejecting the others.
Would be interesting too see your values for some of these?

white rice = long grain rice, white bread = medium slice,
potatoes = in plastic bags
all as sold in ASDA, Tesco, Sainsburys,....
Click to expand...
Are you a T1 or a T2? On medication, insulin?

I wouldn't know what my postprandial numbers are for those things, because I haven't eaten them since I found out practically all carbs turn to glucose once ingested. And all of what you mention is carb-heavy. Yes, those bloodsugars are high, you're right. You should be aiming for no higher than 8,5 after a meal. I'll add my little nutrition sheet, but it is geared to T2's, and I don't know if that applies to you. And if you're on medication that can cause hypo's, don't try any of it without your doc knowing.

There’s a few things you should know.

1. Practically all carbs turn to glucose once ingested, so not just straight sugars, but starches too. Food doesn’t have to taste sweet to make your blood sugars skyrocket.

2. A meter helps you know what foods agree with you, and which don’t. Test before and 2 hours after the first bite. If you go up more than 2.0 mmol/l, the meal was carbier than you could handle. (It’s easy to remember, as you’re a T2: all 2’s, all over the place!)

3. In case you didn’t know already, this isn’t your fault. It’s genetics, medication, decades of bad dietary advice, and basically all manner of things, but nothing you can actually blame yourself for.

4. Diabetes T2 is a progressive condition, unless you (also) change your diet. So you have options. Diet-only, diet with medication, or medication only. But that last option will most likely mean more medication over the years. (And there is more than just metformin, so if it doesn’t agree with you, there’s lots of others to try). So even if going really low carb isn’t for you, you might consider moderately low carb an option, with meds to assist.

5. Are you overweight? 90% of T2’s are. Yeah, that means 10% are slim and always were. If you did gain weight, it was the precursor of this metabolic condition. We make loads of insulin, but become insensitive to it. So carbs we eat turn to glucose, and normally, insulin helps us burn that glucose for fuel. When it doesn’t, that glucose is stored in fat cells instead. When those fat stores are full, the glucose remains in our bloodstream, overflowing, into our eyes, tears, urine, saliva… And then we’re T2’s. So weight gain is a symptom, not a cause. This also means that “regular” dietary advice doesn’t work for us. The problem lies in our inability to process carbs. And most diets focus on lowering fats and upping carb intake. Which is the direct opposite of what a T2, or prediabetic, for that matter, needs.

6. There are 3 macro-nutrients. Fats, protein and carbohydrates. Those macro’s mean we get the micro-nutrients we need: that would be vitamins and minerals. So… If you ditch the carbs, you should up another macro-nutrient to compensate, to make sure you don’t get malnourished or vitamin deficient. Carbs make our blood sugars rise. Protein too, but nowhere near as bad as carbs do, so they’re alright in moderation. Fats however… Fats are as good as a glucose-flatline. Better yet, they’ll mitigate the effects of any carbs we do ingest, slowing down their uptake and thus the sugar-spike. Contrary to what we’ve been told for decades; fats are our friends.

7. Worried about cholesterol? On a low carb diet, your cholesterol may rise a little as you start to lose weight. That’s a good thing though. (Believe it or not). What was already there, stored in your body, is starting to head for the exit, and for that it’ll go into your bloodstream first. So when you have lost weight and it stabilises, so will your cholesterol. And it’ll probably be lower than what it was before you started out.

8. You’ll lose weight on a low carb diet. Weight loss will help with your insulin-resistance, and not only that… Going low carb might help with other issues as well, like non-alcoholic fatty liver disease and depression.

9. Always ask for your test results. You don’t know where you’re going, if you don’t know where you’ve been.

10. Last, but certainly not least: If you are on medication that has hypoglycemia listed as a side-effect, like Gliclazide for instance, do NOT attempt a LCHF diet without a meter nor your doctors’ knowledge/assistance. You can drop blood glucose levels too far, too fast, if your dosage isn’t adjusted accordingly. This could mean a lower dose in stages or even stopping medication completely. Never do this without discussing it with your doctor first!


So what raises blood sugars? Aside from the obvious (sugar), starches raise blood glucose too. So bread, and anything made with grain/oats flour, rice, potatoes, pasta, corn, cereals (including all the “healthy choices”, like Weetabix and muesli), most beans and most fruits. So you’ll want to limit your intake, or scratch them altogether.

Which food items remain on the shopping list? Well, meat, fish, poultry, above ground veggies/leafy greens, eggs, cheese, heavy cream, full fat Greek yoghurt, full fat milk, extra dark chocolate (85% Lindt’s is great!), avocado, (whole) tomatoes, berries, olives, nuts, that sort of thing… Meal ideas? Have a couple:

Scrambled eggs with bacon, cheese, mushrooms, tomato, maybe some high meat content sausages?
Eggs with ham, bacon and cheese
Omelet with spinach and/or smoked salmon
Omelet with cream, cinnamon, with some berries and coconut shavings
Full fat Greek yoghurt with nuts and berries
Leafy green salad with a can of tuna (oil, not brine!), mayonnaise, capers, olives and avocado
Leafy green salad with (warmed goat's) cheese and bacon, maybe a nice vinaigrette?
Meat, fish or poultry with veggies. I usually go for cauliflower rice or broccoli rice, with cheese and bacon to bulk it up. Never the same meal twice in a row because of various herbs/spices.

Snacks? Pork scratchings, cheese, olives, extra dark chocolate, nuts. :)

Of course, there’s loads more on the web, for people more adventurous than I. (Which is pretty much everyone). Just google whatever you want to make and add “keto” to it, and you’ll get a low carb version. There’s a lot of recipes on the diabetes.co.uk website, as well as on www.dietdoctor.com where you’ll also find visual (carb content) guides and videos. And I can wholeheartedly endorse Dr. Jason Fung’s book The Diabetes Code. It’ll help you understand what’s going on in your body and how to tackle it, whilst not being a dry read. Not only that, but you’ll know what to ask your doctor, and you’ll understand the answers, which is, I believe, quite convenient.
 
resander said:
WHEN I EAT: ----- MY T2 BLOOD SUGAR [mmol/L] after 2 hours
white rice 200g 13-15
white rice 100g 9-12
1 slice white bread 9-11
2 slices white bread 12.5 or higher
150g boiled new potatoes 7-8 (smiling)
150g boiled old potatoes 9-11
150g instant potato mash 11 and higher

I think these blood sugar values are high, but don't know. Are they?
So, I am only eating new potatoes, rejecting the others.
Would be interesting too see your values for some of these?

white rice = long grain rice, white bread = medium slice,
potatoes = in plastic bags
all as sold in ASDA, Tesco, Sainsburys,....
Click to expand...
As you haven't filled in your profile I don't know what type of diabetic you are and whether you are on medication but nevertheless I would find all those readings too high and wouldn't eat any of those things.
 
As type 1 diabetic I would eat all those foods and inject for the relevant carbs. I would be hoping my bloods were a LOT less than yours are. Would be aiming for a 2mmol rise after 2-3 hours (does't always happen thou)

I take it you are T2 @resander ???
 
My understanding is the recommendation to test 2 hours after eating is an approximation when the average BG peak will occur. However, there are a number of things which may impact this. For example,
- I assume you are not only eating rice or potatoes. Accompanying food may impact your BG even if it contains no carbs. For example, fat may delay the absorption of carbs
- As this thread is in the type 2 sub-forum, you probably do not have type 1. However, the timing of any medication (e.g, if you pre-bolus insulin before your meal) may impact your BG.
 
resander said:
Would be interesting too see your values for some of these?
Click to expand...

I would love to help, but I don't eat any of that stuff, and haven't ever since I've had a meter.

Those readings are too high IMHO

As you are a T2D I would think that you should seriously consider whether or not you should be eating those things too.
 
I am T2D and monitor/control my condition by diet only.

I started measuring the values above with my test meter about 18 months ago. Obtained the same values every single time, so I totally banned the foods with high BS values, leaving only new potatoes that I have for dinner practically every day. (Sigh).

Dinner is usually, fish, chicken, beef, meat or sausages with the potatoes and veg (broccoli/cauliflower). BS value after 2 hours is almost always 7-8mmol/L. Kcal max 600.

Breakfast at 6am is typically porridge and 1-2 Hi-Lo slices (5g carb/slice) of bread with cheese and ham giving a BS reading between 6.6-7.6. Kcal 500.

Typical Morning snack at 9am: 100g Greek Style Classical yogurt 50g blue berries or 100g raspberries/strawberries. OR an orange or banana. Usually less than 20g carbohydrates.

Lunch 12-1pm is no carb or low carb, e.g. omelettes, zero-carb quarter pounder, boiled/fried eggs sometimes with a couple of slices of Hi-Lo bread. BS value after this is always less than 7.8. Kcal 600-700 (BMI 23, need this to get 2000kcal/day not to get any thinner).

Forgot to mention I also tolerate Wholewheat Fusili pasta, but only tiny portions ca 80g (resulting BS 7.2-8). I have tried it a couple of times with dinner, like it but it is not enough - still hungry.

I also forgot to mention that white flour used for thickening sauces or deepfrying foods like fish (in fish and chips) is bad. It can push my BS for the meal up to 8+ or even 9+. Without the flour it would be less than 7.8.

I have monitored my BS values for more than a year. 27-28 days per month my BS values for all meals are less than 7.8mmmol/L. The remaining 3-4 days in a month the BS values for lunch or dinner may be in the range 8-10. Usually after I have tried something new, dodgy potatoes or felt unwell.

I do not think it is too bad, BUT clearly I do not tolerate carbohydrates and I still eat 100-120g carbs per day! I have not noticed any bad effects of doing so during the last 12 months. But might there be some 'wear and tear' effect that will make my condition worse later on? I wonder.
 
In all of this may I ask what you HbAcs are ? It is difficult to piece together all these snippets of foods you can and can’t tolerate and all the post meal readings you are quoting which without know your readings before your meals are meaningless I’m afraid.
 
The simple amswer is that if you have diabetes those foods are likely to put you in the too high. BSL at the 2 hor mark. And that what you BSLs show.
Please discuss your diet with who knows about diet.
On the Home page under type 2 doabetes are various diets listed. That will give you some ideas to discuss with someone provided they are flexible and up to date .
 
My Blood Sugar(BS) readings before and after meals:

Fasting BS before breakfast at 6am:
Started measuring about 18 months ago. First 2 weeks made daily measurements with values in range 5.5-6.1 (average around 5.6). Then gradually reduced the number of measurements per week with same average result. Now measuring once/twice per month and get same BS value. It seems to be fairly steady.

2 hours after breakfast BS is typically 6.5-7.4 mmol/L Carbs: 40g

Morning snack at 9am: yogurt and berries or orange/small banana Carbs: 20g Not measuring before or after this.

Lunch at 12. Initially measured BS before lunch and got 6.4-7.3 or a bit lower depending on if I had a morning snack or not, but I do not measure BS routinely before lunch any more. Only after a new or different breakfast. Typical value 2 hours after lunch: 6.6-7.2
Carbs: 0 or sometimes 10g (if Hi-Lo bread slices included)

Dinner at 6pm. Reading before eating also 6.4-7.3. Now only measure before meal if I have had something new/different for lunch. Dinner is my largest meal, since I do not want to get any thinner (BMI 23). 2 hours after dinner BS is 6.8-7.8. Carbs: 40g


Typical month of BS readings after all meals:
- 28 days BS is in range 6.6-7.6 mmol/L; daily carbs 100-110g
- 2 days BS is 8-8.9 mmol/L
- 1 day BS is 9-10 mmol/L


The HbA1c measurement represents an average over a period of three months.
My last three HbA1c values 38-39 correspond to an average calculated BS value of 6.5 mmol/L. See table below. I did not expect it to be this low, but I only measure dinner daily and the other meals once per month or less, so I may have lost track. Also I do not eat anything between 6pm and 6am, which perhaps also helps to lower the values during the day. Don't really know. Comments welcome.

TABLE
Hb1A1c in % and mmol/mol units (e.g. 5%,31)
Blood Sugar in mmol/L units (e.g. 5.4) as average calculated from the measured HbA1c

HbA1c <--> Calculated Blood Sugar
5%,31 5.4
5.1%,32 5.6
5.4%,36 6.0
5.5%,37 6.2
5.6%,38 6.4
5.7%,39 6.5
6%,42 7.0 (HbA1c should be below this)
6.5%,48 7.8
7%,53 8.6
8%,64 10.2
9%,75 11.8
10%,86 13.3

From table and by converter calculator in:
http://www.ngsp.org/convert1.asp
 
So your HbA1cs are excellent, you must be doing ok with your diet, well done. In your calculations you seem to be averaging mostly post meal readings which will be higher than pre meal ones generally, so it’s no wonder your HbA1cs are lower than you expect.
This converter on this site is my favourite as it’s so easy to use:
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/hba1c-to-blood-sugar-level-converter.html
 
I became aware I had diabetes about 18 months ago. Searched the Internet then and immediately found that white rice, white bread and potatoes were real troublemakers, but could not find anything about typical BS measurement values. So I tried them myself one by one, measured and got the results shown in my first post. A bit high, I thought. But I still did not know if other T2 diabetes sufferers got similar, higher or lower meter readings for these starchy carohydrates, so I posted this thread.

Also my thanks to all who told me I was eating way too much carbohydrates. I am going to do something about that, possibly even going ketogenic!
 
resander said:
I became aware I had diabetes about 18 months ago. Searched the Internet then and immediately found that white rice, white bread and potatoes were real troublemakers, but could not find anything about typical BS measurement values. So I tried them myself one by one, measured and got the results shown in my first post. A bit high, I thought. But I still did not know if other T2 diabetes sufferers got similar, higher or lower meter readings for these starchy carohydrates, so I posted this thread.

Also my thanks to all who told me I was eating way too much carbohydrates. I am going to do something about that, possibly even going ketogenic!
Click to expand...
Great idea.. maybe try some fasting too.. !
 
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