1. Get the Diabetes Forum App for your phone - available on iOS and Android.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Guest, we'd love to know what you think about the forum! Take the Diabetes Forum Survey 2022 »
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Diabetes Forum should not be used in an emergency and does not replace your healthcare professional relationship. Posts can be seen by the public.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
Find support, ask questions and share your experiences. Join the community »

Who made Britain Fat? Channel 4 Michael Mosley

Discussion in 'Diabetes Soapbox - Have Your Say' started by MrsA2, Mar 9, 2022.

  1. MrsA2

    MrsA2 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,133
    Likes Received:
    4,230
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Just started and already fuming. I know I shouldn't watch...
    Maybe it will end the right way but I'm disliking the blaming and sensationalist style
    Grrr!
     
    • Like Like x 3
    • Agree Agree x 2
  2. zand

    zand Type 2 · Master

    Messages:
    10,509
    Likes Received:
    16,375
    Trophy Points:
    298
    Couldn't face watching it. Do let us know who is to blame lol
     
    • Funny Funny x 3
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. shelley262

    shelley262 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,120
    Likes Received:
    9,888
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Just watched it’s very dispiriting and there is one more episode next week! I’m not sure if I could face it.
     
  4. MrsA2

    MrsA2 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,133
    Likes Received:
    4,230
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Only half watched, it was on in the background while I did something else.
    Seemed to be a mix of blaming government for not doing more, for underfunding, for not monitoring effect/cost of campaigns etc.
    Blaming food industry for advertising, for blocking government
    Blaming fats, sugar and salt, but sometimes all three, sometimes fat OR sugar Or salt indiscriminately

    At least is might get more people talking or thinking, but the usual sensationalist reporting without hard facts or just one conclusion .

    At least he seems to have moved away from just low calorie approach.

    Anyone else see it?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Silos

    Silos · Newbie

    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    1
    I saw the second half. He's very much about self promotion, and is trying to be the diabetes tzar. It was a muddled programme, beating the drums without much of substance. Still banging on about sugar, and not sure what his real point was.
    The alarming part was the implication that food companies went criminal to stop Jamie Oliver's campaign.
     
    • Informative Informative x 4
  6. Daibell

    Daibell LADA · Master

    Messages:
    12,428
    Likes Received:
    7,366
    Trophy Points:
    298
    Typical Mosely. He started with the (wrong) assumption that it was all down to the failure of the Sugar/Fat/Salt message. He obviously hadn't bothered to check whether SFS was based on good science for obesity which it isn't. So having got off on an invalid path it was going to go nowhere. One day we will see the Carb message but I'm not expecting that soon as the food industry is a big problem - Carbs are a very profitable food group. Also i wish these guys wouldn't talk about eating 'Calories' - I eat 'Food'.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  7. AndBreathe

    AndBreathe I reversed my Type 2 · Master
    Retired Moderator

    Messages:
    10,052
    Likes Received:
    16,044
    Trophy Points:
    278
    If you look Michael Mosely up, he describes himself as a journalist, not a doctor. Reading his professional profile some time ago, he only worked in clinical medicine for a brief period.

    I find his still trading on his medical degree distasteful.
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  8. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

    Messages:
    6,956
    Likes Received:
    3,790
    Trophy Points:
    198
    If you look at his earlier works, his Blood Sugar 800 diet used to be very low calorie, low fat. His latest works appear to be leaning towards low carb, but he still has a bias towards low calorie and weight ;loss. As a doctor wishing to keep his licence from the GMC to practice, he has to tread the path laid down by NICE and the NHS i.e. Low Calorie Low Fat. Especially if he has a diet plan in place which he needs to promote to keep himself in the manner he has become accustomed to. He is riding on the back of the Newcastle Diet studies which the nutritionista approve of. He will be aware of the trouble that Dr David Unwin faced with his Low Carb diet being used in his NHS practice. David has his approvals removed because of a problem with one minor graphic detail , but his diet advice is no longer supported by NICE because of it. Not sure if he has recovered that situation. It was withdrawn not for it being a bad diet or unsafe or anything like that, but for the use of a graphic that could be misinterpreted. Interesting that Moseley used the same info in one of his TV series without any problem. Thr Government also used the same approach for their Sugar Tax literature without complaint. Strange World we live in.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Oracle

    Messages:
    19,047
    Likes Received:
    12,609
    Trophy Points:
    298
    "Michael Mosley is a real qualified medical doctor, though he is no longer registered as a medical doctor."
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

    Messages:
    6,956
    Likes Received:
    3,790
    Trophy Points:
    198
    Yes indeed.. He was training to be a psychiatrist. He is not a practicing doctor. He is also an ex T2D, and went into remission after following a 5:2 diet plan himself

    However, he has a diet plan of his own that he is trying to sell and get the medical profession to accept and recommend to their patients, so he needs to stay on the Low Calorie Low Fat pathway as a line of least resistance. As we know from comments on this site, NHS HCP's are generally anti LCHF diets

    Interesting who sponsors DUK (the other one) which is important since they are the official recognised body representing diabetes care in the UK
    https://www.diabetes.org.uk/get_involved/corporate/acknowledgements/partners

    And the British Nutrition Foundation, the other body that represents nutitionists
    https://www.nutrition.org.uk/our-work/support-what-we-do/corporate-partnerships/current-members/
    In 2010 their sponsorship was noted as:-
    "However, the organisation's 39 members, which contribute to its funding, include – beside the Government, the EU – Cadbury, Kellogg's, Northern Foods, McDonald's, PizzaExpress, the main supermarket chains except Tesco, and producer bodies such as the Potato Council."

    Note the BNF also has a partnership with the British Vegan society.

    (Edited to remove cat typing)
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
    #10 Oldvatr, Mar 12, 2022 at 12:04 PM
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2022
  11. Antje77

    Antje77 LADA · Moderator
    Staff Member

    Messages:
    13,972
    Likes Received:
    8,940
    Trophy Points:
    298
    :cat::D
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  12. Outlier

    Outlier · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    382
    Likes Received:
    302
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Sigh. Why am I not surprised (about the sponsors not the cat)?

    You really can't serve God and Mammon.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  13. Daibell

    Daibell LADA · Master

    Messages:
    12,428
    Likes Received:
    7,366
    Trophy Points:
    298
    Also the 'research' used by SACN (part of PHE) for their (infamous) Eat Well Plate was funded by the food industry with the usual suspects.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  14. AndBreathe

    AndBreathe I reversed my Type 2 · Master
    Retired Moderator

    Messages:
    10,052
    Likes Received:
    16,044
    Trophy Points:
    278
    My understanding is it is some time since Michael Mosley was on the medical register. He only worked in medicine for a short while.

    Of course, he may still call himself doctor, due to his academic qualifications, in the same way a PhD can.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

    Messages:
    6,956
    Likes Received:
    3,790
    Trophy Points:
    198
    And appear in a white coat on I'm a Doctor, Trust me.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. Dollylolly

    Dollylolly Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    189
    Likes Received:
    186
    Trophy Points:
    83
    I think he’s sold out as he does shakes now not real food

    I went looking for his dr credentials and he isn’t on the register anymore that I can see. So can he actually still use this tag when being introduced to anyone as that isn’t right.

    I missed the first episode and watched the 2nd

    for me food is in abundance as we can order food at the click of the fingers. Schools don’t do cooking lessons anymore or very little. Parents are not taught as kids either now what is healthy or not by their own parents and the cycle continues. Plus if on a very tight budget like many it’s cheaper to eat the ****.

    government won’t change the eat well guide as it’s called now as they have their sponsors for that. I’ve noticed that the Infograph’s from Dr Unwin say it’s the glycemic response not carbs amounts that causes the spikes. Is this to say it’s not a low carb diet? was this the get out clause for them

    2017 I was scolded like a kid for going low carb by my surgery saying I’d harm myself and it isn’t sustainable, now in 2022 I’m praised for going low carb by the same surgery oh how times have changed well for my area anyways.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  17. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

    Messages:
    6,956
    Likes Received:
    3,790
    Trophy Points:
    198
    He is not currently registered as a practising doctor, but he is entitled to use the title since he graduated as such. My son is a Dr. too, but his is purely an academic title.

    The change from real food to shakes shows that although the condition has not changed its spots, the target audience has. Modern living is breeding a tribe of people who demand instant answers. T2 Remission, web browsing clickbait easy living. Quick Fix It used to be people living off canned foods, then the froxrn ready meal came and then TV dinners. The weight loss market is similar. Gone from calorie counting to meal replacement in a box. Just add water ( I did see someone marketed Instant Water by the way) As you point out, we are no longer teaching domestic science or cookery and we now have supermsrkets selling meal kits and weekly meal planners based on deliveries as advertised on the TV or Facebook.

    There is a school of thought that we should use the GI and GL data to assist in our control of bgl levels. It is a valid technique to reduce spikes, but it still produces the same glucose so is not a fix IMO. I use it myself sometimes but my main weapon is Low Carb anyway.

    I have not seen much in the way of science studies that show whether it is spikes or overall glucose load that causes the damage. I.e. is a spike of 10 mmol/l for 15 minutes worse than a general level of 8 mmol/l for most of the day? Does the spike pump more glucose into the red blood cells and have worse effect on HbA1c or does the fasting level being high cause more problems for the heart and kidneys? Food for thought. (the brain stops working without food)

    Edit to add: one problem with using GI control is that it can lead to a false sense of security in that it drops the post meal reading so it looks like things are under good control. You can easily fool yourself and the GP.
     
    #17 Oldvatr, Apr 13, 2022 at 11:17 AM
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2022
  18. finzi1966

    finzi1966 · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    118
    Likes Received:
    71
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Just to say re: “practising doctor” - it’s a real hassle to maintain a licence to practice, involving £500 a year registration fee to the GMC, having privately funded annual appraisals and paying someone to be your “responsible officer” (£1500), 5 yearly revalidation involving extensive 360 feedback from patients and colleagues, 50 hours proven CPD annually, evidence of annual audits.

    There is no shame in not having a licence to practice if you don’t require one for the job that you do (in his case, TV presenter and author). It does *not* mean he isn’t a doctor, or that he doesn’t have a right to use that title, or that he’s in trouble with the GMC.

    No comment one way or the other about his views on diet etc - I don’t really know what they are (although I do usually quite enjoy watching his TV shows). But I wanted to counter any “he’s not a real doctor” narrative.
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Dollylolly

    Dollylolly Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    189
    Likes Received:
    186
    Trophy Points:
    83
    I have to say I did assume he couldn’t use the title after not renewing his licence and ruddy Nora that’s a lot of money to keep it too.
     
  20. Grant_Vicat

    Grant_Vicat Don't have diabetes · Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    940
    Likes Received:
    1,265
    Trophy Points:
    178
    I think the title of the programme further creates the impression that obesity is a modern phenomenon in this country. In 1963, when I was in a class of 16 boys on the edge of Brighton, 4 of them would be rated seriously obese today!
     
  • Meet the Community

    Find support, connect with others, ask questions and share your experiences with people with diabetes, their carers and family.

    Did you know: 7 out of 10 people improve their understanding of diabetes within 6 months of being a Diabetes Forum member. Get the Diabetes Forum App and stay connected on iOS and Android

    Grab the app!
  • Tweet with us

  • Like us on Facebook