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Carnivory - An Interesting Video
- Thread starter bulkbiker
- Start Date
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Lar oli mu
Guest
What he finds is interesting. What it comes down to is removing the triggers that spice up your immune system. And then you can find out if there is anything else that always puts gasoline on the fire of your immune reaction. This has so little to do with vegan, vegetarian, whateverdietyourelikin’, but with knowing triggers and then removing them. Auto immune testing is so much more available these days. After that you can think about repairing tissues, that have been damaged. And if you have gasolines in your diet you will have fires. If gliadin is your gasoline, there will be fire, that’s what I had to find out. Avoiding gasolines costs a very high price, avoiding gluten is almost impossible if you don’t let go of mostly all processed foods and start cooking for yourself almost every meal. Dr. K and Dr. V call it auto immune lifestyle. And that lifestyle so much beside any other lifestyle I’ve seen. It’s hard.
Safi
Well-Known Member
I've been following that guys story for the last week or so & have noticed that (on youtube at least) a lot of vegans don't just reintroduce animal products but go full carnivore. Fascinating. A few vegans have been supportive of his attempt to fix his health but some are next-level vicious
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
Vegans are impossible to discourse with. Sadly.
The question is, what should one eat on a carnivory diet. Organ meats are rich, but very heavy in cholesterol, and liver is most certainly an acquired taste. In other words, I struggle to find them remotely palatable.
Most sources seem to advocate beef and beef alone. That's off putting as a) it's expensive (other than mince) and b) i find beef dry and hard to eat. I much prefer belly pork or poultry.
The question is, what should one eat on a carnivory diet. Organ meats are rich, but very heavy in cholesterol, and liver is most certainly an acquired taste. In other words, I struggle to find them remotely palatable.
Most sources seem to advocate beef and beef alone. That's off putting as a) it's expensive (other than mince) and b) i find beef dry and hard to eat. I much prefer belly pork or poultry.
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
Those are some strange claims she makes. Beef causing a carb like crash?
Her points regarding GNG don't seem to be supported by the facts.
But without evidence how can I know what she's claiming is true? She may be an outlier, or she may be mistaken or even lying. If beef makes her react negatively then that's a personal 'anomaly' surely?
I'm not sure what the takeaway is.
Indy51
Expert
Saw another guy (heavily weight reduced) on twitter saying the same thing about beef. Not sure what to make of it either, but as they say, "we're all different". Maybe it's something to do with reactive hypoglycemia to the insulin response to beef? I've never had an RH reaction, so can't really say, maybe @Brunneria or @Lamont D might have more of an idea?
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
Maybe an allergic reaction or something. I'm not sure how it could be an actual carb crash for obvious reasons.
Also she doesn't seem to say what she does eat, that I could find, which is disappointing
Indy51
Expert
"For that month trial of LowFiiZC in feb of 2017 I ate eggs and fish every day because they are under 20 on the index.I kept beef to only 2 or 3 times a week for one meal on those days. I kept the beef amount to less than about 24 grams of protein. I ate 3 and sometimes 4 times a day in small amounts of LowFii proteins ( to hunger ques) to keep insulin drive more steady and lower. I drank water and club soda."
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
So she eats fish and eggs only?
fish is great but it's low in fat and very very expensive. I try to treat myself to a small can of salmon a week which gives me a little, but it ain't cheap!
fish is great but it's low in fat and very very expensive. I try to treat myself to a small can of salmon a week which gives me a little, but it ain't cheap!
Lamont D
Oracle
Only going by my own experience, beef depending on how it's prepared is relatively low in initial insulin response, far lower than chicken for example, but it depends on how other hormones respond to any food depending on your own personal conditions.
I have read about intolerance and allergies to most foods, having a few, I do know what it's like, it is about discovering these intolerant foods and avoiding them.
For example, I have a wheat, grain intolerance but not a gluten intolerance!!!
I didn't have a clue until I started testing.
There are many different hormones and other chemical reactions, in our stomach, intestines that have a big effect on your health.
If someone has been vegan or vegetarian for some time, the digestive system is bound to take time to adapt to the new type of food, just as if you go abroad and get an upset stomach, because of a different style of cooking, different spices and so on, not because of the hygiene or the food itself.
I could never be totally vegan, my body demands meat, but it always needs some vegetables, hence salad vegetables, but always with protein!
My weird body does not like cooked vegetables, the taste is so repulsive, but I can and do have baby leaf spinach raw, but cooked, yuk!
I have read in several places that beef is amongst the most insulinogenic meats.
But common sense dictates that no matter how insulinogenic it is, it isn’t nearly as insulinogenic as common carb sources.
I have also read repeatedly that gluconeogenesis is demand driven, and that only those with severe glucose dysregulation need to factor it in, even with high protein intake. Maybe she has extreme glucose dysregulation?
If I saw a hyper/hypo style reaction from any type of meat i would probably start looking at it in terms of food intolerance. And i would be checking blood glucose with a meter, since some food intolerances throw out similar symptoms to glucose dysregulation symptoms.
Edited for typos
But common sense dictates that no matter how insulinogenic it is, it isn’t nearly as insulinogenic as common carb sources.
I have also read repeatedly that gluconeogenesis is demand driven, and that only those with severe glucose dysregulation need to factor it in, even with high protein intake. Maybe she has extreme glucose dysregulation?
If I saw a hyper/hypo style reaction from any type of meat i would probably start looking at it in terms of food intolerance. And i would be checking blood glucose with a meter, since some food intolerances throw out similar symptoms to glucose dysregulation symptoms.
Edited for typos
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Indy51
Expert
Answering most questions people may have about protein, ketones, gluconeogenesis, insulin etc. with one of the world's top protein researchers, Prof. Stuart Phillips:
https://humanperformanceoutliers.libsyn.com/episode-27-professor-stuart-phillips
https://humanperformanceoutliers.libsyn.com/episode-27-professor-stuart-phillips
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
I'm not convinced by zero carb. It might be fine temporarily, but I don't think there's enoug evidence that it's sustainable healthwise. Even a broad array of organ meats is going to lack some things (if you can stomach them, liver is unpleasant imo).
It might be fine for a short term cleanse and perhaps theat's where the positive reports come from, like the vegan guy.
To be honest, I've tried engaging zero carb/carnivory advocates and they are just awful people to deal with in the main. Unhelpful, unwilling to look at evidence, unable to answer basic questions. I've even asked if what I eat is suitable and they couldn't even answer. I certainly couldn't stomach beef 3x a day, which is claimed as the optimal source despite not having enough eleoctrolytes.
If someone tells me that's what they eat then good luck to them, but the evidence doesn't support this.
In fact I could say this about the low carb community online as a whole. So many groups are just unwilling to tolerate questions, become highly defensive and antagonistic if you dare to offer a counter argument or question whether the evidence supports their claims, etc. It's tiring and frustrating.
It might be fine for a short term cleanse and perhaps theat's where the positive reports come from, like the vegan guy.
To be honest, I've tried engaging zero carb/carnivory advocates and they are just awful people to deal with in the main. Unhelpful, unwilling to look at evidence, unable to answer basic questions. I've even asked if what I eat is suitable and they couldn't even answer. I certainly couldn't stomach beef 3x a day, which is claimed as the optimal source despite not having enough eleoctrolytes.
If someone tells me that's what they eat then good luck to them, but the evidence doesn't support this.
In fact I could say this about the low carb community online as a whole. So many groups are just unwilling to tolerate questions, become highly defensive and antagonistic if you dare to offer a counter argument or question whether the evidence supports their claims, etc. It's tiring and frustrating.
bulkbiker
BANNED
to see the same person across various forums and websites asking the same questions, ignoring the multiple detailed answers they get then saying that no-one listens or answers.
lucylocket61
Expert
beef from corn fed cattle is different to beef from grass fed cattle, and so, according to my t1 friends, gives a different insulin response in her.
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
Which are never given.
Instead what you get is based on feelings not scientific evidence, and often contradcitory
bulkbiker
BANNED
There are no "studies" in science on nutrition ... it is simply not feasible to do..there are lots of assumptions but even more individual experiments with great results. There are no "definites" in this field you have to do your own work. You can ask as many times as you want the studies you seek don't exist so you can either wait until they do or try it and see.
Alexandra100
Well-Known Member
If you are in the UK, Asda sells a 213g tin of wild pink salmon (enough for two meals?) for £1.29. Home Bargains used to sell cheapish tinned salmon too. Morrisons sells 360g of frozen wild Alaskan salmon (4 smallish portions) for £3. Or you can buy frozen Alaskan pollock from Morrisons, 690g for £3. Heron Foods sell it even cheaper. Because fish is, as you say, low in fat, I find it is greatly improved by the addition of one or even two fried eggs.
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
That's what I do now, i buy one tin of salmon. But is it worth it for two meals a week?
ghost_whistler
Well-Known Member
I don't think this is true at all. There are plenty of nutritional studies
