Extended fasting

[eddie07]

Many thanks to @bushbiker for advice on starting and posting to this forum.
As they say "never too old to learn "
Day 1 of a liquid only fast. I say liquid only as may have some bone broth later in the evening if very hungry.
Did a 5 day fast earlier this month but gave up on day 5 as felt queasy.
Today FBG was 7.5, weight 65kg, BMI 22.5 and body fat 28.7%.
Target reduce FBG to 4.0, weight to 60 kg, BMI to 19 and body fat to 22.0%.
Seems too ambitious but its worth a try.
Anyone else care to join me?

 

[bulkbiker]

I would have but we have a dinner engagement this week .. sorry.. well done on starting the thread though .. you're never too old!

What are your liquids? I tend to have coffee with cream when not eating which some say is not "real fasting" although I get a few benefits like reduced hunger because of it. Also a bit of butter melted in the bone broth makes it taste nicer and provides some satiety.

 

[eddie07]

Thanks @bushbiker.
I used to put some double cream in my coffee in the past and butter in my bone broth is absolutely lovely.
Just had some sea salt and apple cider vinegar in a pint of warm water which took the edge off my hunger for the moment.

 

[Lamont D]

One of my tricks is to do something, anything, to get your brain away from thinking about food, I usually go for a walk, an activity, or read a engaging book. Keeping busy and occupying your time.
I used to drink strong black tea or just water, a sliver of ice is just as good.

 

[eddie07]

Thanks @LamontD.
I'll try that when hunger gets overwhelming.


Sent from my GT-I9505 using Diabetes Forum mobile app

 

[Fenn]

This is fascinating, you clearly are far more clever and knowledgable than myself, I have never researched or even heard of extended fasting, but every fibre in my body tells me this cant be healthy?

 

[bulkbiker]

This is fascinating, you clearly are far more clever and knowledgable than myself, I have never researched or even heard of extended fasting, but every fibre in my body tells me this cant be healthy?

Really? why on earth not.. fasting has been a human practise for centuries. Gives your body a rest from constant food processing. Allows extended autophagy, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autophagy, and in most people lowers blood glucose and kick starts ketosis. Many, many benefits and from the oodles of reports I have read, no harm whatsoever.

 

[eddie07]

Fasting is a requirement in most religions. Christians fasting during lent or Ramadan for Muslims or fasting by Buddhist monks or Hindus prior to Diwali.
In nature most animals hibernate during winter when food is scarce.
Dr Jason Fung one of the leading proponent of fasting has written a couple of books on the power of fasting for curing diabetes.
When I used to smoke I would get a severe bout of chest infection. I used to cure myself by not eating for a few days and let the body fight the infection.
Dr Jason Fung also talks about autophogy where the body cleans up defective cells and grow new healthy cells.
I am not recommending this or any other course of action. Please consult with your health care professionals and research the benefits of fasting.
It's not easy and it doesn't suit everyone.
Gradually building up to a longer term fast by following a ketogenic lifestyle and intermittent fasting will help.

 

[Fenn]

Really? why on earth not.. fasting has been a human practise for centuries. Gives your body a rest from constant food processing. Allows extended autophagy, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Autophagy, and in most people lowers blood glucose and kick starts ketosis. Many, many benefits and from the oodles of reports I have read, no harm whatsoever.

Please dont misunderstand, its great if it works, im very happy for you guys, I can understand the short term fasting but 7 days? I just cant see that being healthy, our ancestors life expectancy was about 30 years and they would certainly not fasted out of choice, the religious folks all over the world dont as far as I know enjoy better health, I am almost (I say almost as I have no idea) certain, the religious folks fasting in the Uk dont enjoy better health? Surely our bodies will begin to eat themselves if starved that long? Or is that the point? Please forgive my ignorance

 

[bulkbiker]

our ancestors life expectancy was about 30 years

Mainly due to infant mortality being high and no antibiotics!

Surely our bodies will begin to eat themselves if starved that long?

Partly the point.. did you read my link on autophagy?.. its is a good state to be in rather than a bad one...
I've done a few 7 day liquid only fasts and am still here to tell the tale.. others on other forums have done far longer (although that is usually advised to be under medical supervision) a bit like Angus Barbieri who fasted for 382 days (yes that's 382 days) and survived.
The science of it is quite fascinating although (as you are insulin?) you would have to watch out for hypos as blood sugars can drop fast.

 

[britishpub]

I’m still trying to work out who @bushbiker is

 

[Fenn]

Mainly due to infant mortality being high and no antibiotics!

Partly the point.. did you read my link on autophagy?.. its is a good state to be in rather than a bad one...
I've done a few 7 day liquid only fasts and am still here to tell the tale.. others on other forums have done far longer (although that is usually advised to be under medical supervision) a bit like Angus Barbieri who fasted for 382 days (yes that's 382 days) and survived.
The science of it is quite fascinating although (as you are insulin?) you would have to watch out for hypos as blood sugars can drop fast.

Fair enough I am ignorant for sure, I wish you all the best OP will follow with interest but with no intention of ever believing this is a good idea lol sorry. Maybe I should of been a DN

 

[bulkbiker]

Fair enough I am ignorant for sure, I wish you all the best OP will follow with interest but with no intention of ever believing this is a good idea lol sorry. Maybe I should of been a DN

Has been known to get Type 2's off insulin after quite a few years... check out Dr Jason Fung..

 

[eddie07]

Update on my fast.
Yesterday Sunday 28th:
Walked 8.04 miles and burnt 2438 calories.
Consumed 10 calories consisting of 4 mugs black coffee, 30grms apple cider vinegar and 5grms sea salt and 2.0 litres of water.
Today my FBG was 6.6.
Weight 63.8, BMI 22.1 and Fat 28%.
Don't feel ravenous just mild hunger pangs. Bearable

 

[bulkbiker]

Update on my fast.
Yesterday Sunday 28th:
Walked 8.04 miles and burnt 2438 calories.
Consumed 10 calories consisting of 4 mugs black coffee, 30grms apple cider vinegar and 5grms sea salt and 2.0 litres of water.
Today my FBG was 6.6.
Weight 63.8, BMI 22.1 and Fat 28%.
Don't feel ravenous just mild hunger pangs. Bearable

Nice one.. Decent drop in FBG.. everything going in the right direction. keep it up!

 

[eddie07]

Thanks @bulkbiker. Sorry spelt your name wrong yesterday.

 

[Pipp]

Do you have a plan for reintroducing food / refeeding at the end of your fast, @eddie07 ?

 

[zand]

Surely our bodies will begin to eat themselves if starved that long?

Partly the point.. did you read my link on autophagy?.. its is a good state to be in rather than a bad one...

Just being inquisitive...

Don't you have to be careful that the body doesn't 'eat' muscle? I have read of someone on here who has achieved massive weight loss, but now has reduced muscle mass because of starving himself too much. Reduced muscle mass lowers the metabolism?

When I used to do silly diets, I cut down protein because I don't really enjoy protein much, I know now that was a huge mistake.

Or is 7 days without food OK? How long would you leave it before doing the next 7 day spell? I am not sure I could do it, I would be very weak, although I do enjoy One Meal A Day - OMAD.

 

[zand]

Oh and @bulkbiker I tried to read the link on autophagy and couldn't understand a word lol. (and I am in ketosis right now, so there's no hope of me ever understanding it because my brain works best when I'm in ketosis lol)

Anyhow @eddie07 thanks for posting on this subject. I will read this thread with interest. Keep it up, you are doing well.

 

[bulkbiker]

Just being inquisitive...

Don't you have to be careful that the body doesn't 'eat' muscle? I have read of someone on here who has achieved massive weight loss, but now has reduced muscle mass because of starving himself too much. Reduced muscle mass lowers the metabolism?

When I used to do silly diets, I cut down protein because I don't really enjoy protein much, I know now that was a huge mistake.

Or is 7 days without food OK? How long would you leave it before doing the next 7 day spell? I am not sure I could do it, I would be very weak, although I do enjoy One Meal A Day - OMAD.

The body will only turn to muscle after it has "eaten" its way through the fat stores.. I think a 20 stone man has something like 400,000 calories of fat stored.. a regular fit person has something like 40,000 so a 7 day fast should be fine unless you are very skinny already. (can't remember where those figures came from.. someone at the PHC conference I think).
7 days are not recommended really unless you are very aware of what you are doing and certainly no more than a few times a year. But as we know Angus Barbieri went from 207 kg to 82 kg with his 382 day medically supervised fast..

https://www.diabetes.co.uk/blog/2018/02/story-angus-barbieri-went-382-days-without-eating/

Edit to add.. there may be a little lean body mass lost on the fast (which is why Prof Phinney is so anti them..) however a number of people have pointed out this could be because that LBM is being recycled through autophagy and once the fast is over levels recover pretty quickly providing enough protein is eaten.