Gender differences in the management of type 2 diet only?

[lucylocket61]

I seem to be noticing that there are gender differences in the successful management of type 2 diet only.

Men appear to manage to lose weight, maintain weight loss, and have more stable blood glucose levels more easily than women. They also seem to respond to keto diets, of all varieties: carnivore, vegetarian and vegan, better than women.

1) is my perception correct?

2) could female hormone amounts and fluctuations, even post-menopause, have something to do with it

3) is it possible women could need slightly different dietary advice than men?

I am interested in any (polite) responses, even if its that I am seeing something that isnt accurate in the main, due to posting frequencies and styles of frequent posters.

 

[jpscloud]

I don't have any evidence to quote but I always had a raging (even more than my usual outrageously big) appetite just before a period, and if circumstances meant that I couldn't eat to excess at that time, I'd be a mess emotionally. Now post-menopause I still notice fluctuations that mimic those symptoms.

I do think there must be a link between female hormones and the (is it 26?) number of hormones that work in conjunction with insulin.

I've also noticed more men than women that I know have successfully kept weight off, but there are exceptions.

 

[lucylocket61]

I don't have any evidence to quote but I always had a raging (even more than my usual outrageously big) appetite just before a period, and if circumstances meant that I couldn't eat to excess at that time, I'd be a mess emotionally. Now post-menopause I still notice fluctuations that mimic those symptoms.

I do think there must be a link between female hormones and the (is it 26?) number of hormones that work in conjunction with insulin.

I've also noticed more men than women that I know have successfully kept weight off, but there are exceptions.

Its been over 7 years since my periods stopped. I got diagnosed with tye 2 the same month . But i still get a clear 5 weeks cycle of emotional ups and downs, a crying day or two, a headache day or two, like clockwork. I dont know how long it will go on for. I m not on HRT or suitable to take it. I couldnt take the pill either.

 

[Deleted Account]

@lucylocket61 I recollect reading an article that agreed with your point.
I can't find it now. Typical!

And I can't comment from personal experience.

 

[Deleted Account]

Yay! I have found the article: https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/324792.php
The study is based on mice but the article also includes anecdotal evidence from humans.

There could well be something in what you say @lucylocket61

 

[lucylocket61]

Ah - Estrogen again. I wonder if PCOS is also part of the problem too?

 

[lucylocket61]

Although I am technically post menopausal, the fact that my cycle remains with just the absence of periods, would indicate that I am still producing hormones. My most recent blood test said i am not even post menopausal, my hormone levels are still almost as high as non-menopausal women. I wonder if that is a factor in diagnosis and treatment?

 

[TriciaWs]

More research, but done with people who were prediabetic:
https://www.livescience.com/63324-men-women-weight-loss-difference.html

 

[DCUKMod]

Ah - Estrogen again. I wonder if PCOS is also part of the problem too?

I'd wager PCOS and thyroid issues are all there in the mix, amongst other things. Hypothyroidism can make weight loss tricky and there's a lot of it undiagnosed out there, in both genders, but the stats say it's more common in women than men.

I haven't done any reading into this and only looking at it from the perspective of my observations and being one of those wimmin sorts myself.

I do quite often see posts from chaps whose weight loss has gone great guns, then stalls, so I'm positive it's a bit like most things in this life, there are no hard and fast rules or outcomes.

 

[Guzzler]

There is a hypothesis that says that because women must become insulin resistant while pregnant in order to gain weight for pregnancy and later for lactation this may be why women have a harder time losing weight and stabilising bg.
Even post menopausal women have different hormone reactions than the fellas do.

 

[Hotpepper20000]

My understanding of PCOS is that one of the symptoms is insulin resistance.
I notice that on some Facebook pages for it that they advocate low carb to help control the symptoms of PCOS like belly fat and acne.

 

[Brunneria]

I did some reading on PCOS when I got diagnosed with it.

Yes, it causes greater insulin resistance than other women have.
Yes, weight loss is slower, harder to achieve, and weight regain is more likely.

And as for menopause...
M for PCOSers is longer, slower, results in even more insulin resistance than they had before and can last into their 70s.

Yes, up to 20 years before their hormones settle down into the normal post-M state.

Basically all bad news, then.

The one bright gleam in the darkness was that PCOSers’ slow M is often less dramatic (the hot flushes and stuff) than non-pcosers. My own experience of this is simple; I only get the sweats and hormone nonsense when I am out of ketosis. Ketosis is my friend. Without ketosis my life is quite miserable (for PCOS and other reasons), I always think 'lucky git' whenever I read about anyone managing well on more than 10g carbs a day, and when I see people managing on 100+ I am glad for them, but just think that they have completely different life experiences from me.

Edited, for clarity.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

Oh. I didn't know any of this, but it explains a lot. Thank you!

I did some reading on PCOS when I got the diagnosis.

Yes, it causes greater insulin resistance than other women have.
Yes, weight loss is slower, harder to achieve, and weight regain is more likely.

And as for menopause...
M for PCOSers is longer, slower, results in even more insulin resistance than they had before and can last into their 70s.

Yes, up to 20 years before their hormones settle down into the normal post-M state.

Basically all bad news, then.

The one bright gleam in the darkness was that PCOSers’ slow M is often less dramatic (the hot flushes and stuff) than non-pcosers. My own experience of this is simple; I only get the sweats and hormone nonsense when I am out of ketosis. Ketosis is my friend.

 

[Brunneria]

Oh. I didn't know any of this, but it explains a lot. Thank you!

it does, doesn't it?
I am afraid that I no longer have the links to the various articles and research I found - because I did that reading around 5-6 years ago. But I am quite sure that the info is easily findable, via Google, if anyone wants to go looking.

I am constantly amazed how little wimmins hormones are mentioned on this forum, and how big a contributory factor they are in so many diabetes related happenings. I think many of us are just so used to our bodies, and the monthly grind, and dealing with the hassle of it all, that we don't realise that other people are free of these hassles, or that their experience of insulin resistance, menopause, weight loss, etc. is completely different.

 

[JoKalsbeek]

it does, doesn't it?
I am afraid that I no longer have the links to the various articles and research I found - because I did that reading around 5-6 years ago. But I am quite sure that the info is easily findable, via Google, if anyone wants to go looking.

I am constantly amazed how little wimmins hormones are mentioned on this forum, and how big a contributory factor they are in so many diabetes related happenings. I think many of us are just so used to our bodies, and the monthly grind, and dealing with the hassle of it all, that we don't realise that other people are free of these hassles, or that their experience of insulin resistance, menopause, weight loss, etc. is completely different.

Well, my mom brings up the possibility of early menopause to me every week, because I've been having issues. Not the usual menopausal ones, but it's the only answer she can come up with. I do everything right, food-wise, bloodsugars are perfection, and still... After medication use for almost half a year, I regained a few kilo's, and I can barely shift them, even with keto and IF. I've battled for a month or two, to move little under a kilo off. I'm nowhere near as obese as I was, thank heavens, but in my head I feel like I'm right back where I started, and I feel like an abject faillure. The scales say I'm not morbidly obse again, nowhere near it, but still. In my mind I am. It's good to know -and I completely trust you, as it makes sense, so no need to go source hunting- that it's just the PCOS throwing up hurdles. It's less to do with my efforts and more to do with the thing that got me to T2 in the first place. I'm not looking forward to being menopausal well into my pension years, gotta admit, but it's a relief to me that it's just my little friend that took up residence on my ovary, not my own personal faillure that's gotten me back to 83-and-a-bit kilo's.

You have no idea what this means to me right now. But it's a biggy. Thank you.

 

[Brunneria]

Another joyful detail that women rarely realise, is that our hormones start to shift in our 30s.
That is 10-20 years before menopause, and it is just a kind of 'growing older, and no longer in our 20s' kind of thing.
Also, since many women experience a lot of body changes after having children, they often don't realise that the changes are as much due to gently drifting towards M, than to do with the children.

- I can reference that bit clearly: John R Lee 'What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Menopause'
Although I see that he has now also brought out another book atoub Perimenopause, so you may find that interesting too.

 

[Member496333]

Since pretty much our entire metabolic biochemistry is orchestrated by the endocrine system, it stands to reason that there will be differences between men and women. However, I’m not entirely sure there’s much evidence pointing toward it being necessarily more difficult for women to achieve their goals vs. men. There are surely as many men who struggle with weight loss and glycemic control whilst seemingly doing the exact same thing as others who have more success.

For example, overcoming insulin resistance was a monumental task for me personally, but everything I now know suggests that is because I was TOFI and unable to become obese. Nothing to do with the junk between my legs

 

[JoKalsbeek]

Another joyful detail that women rarely realise, is that our hormones start to shift in our 30s.
That is 10-20 years before menopause, and it is just a kind of 'growing older, and no longer in our 20s' kind of thing.
Also, since many women experience a lot of body changes after having children, they often don't realise that the changes are as much due to gently drifting towards M, than to do with the children.

- I can reference that bit clearly: John R Lee 'What Your Doctor May No Tell You About Menopause'
Although I see that he has now also brought out another book atoub Perimenopause, so you may find that interesting too.

I will look those up, thank you!

 

[Tophat1900]

I seem to be noticing that there are gender differences in the successful management of type 2 diet only.

Men appear to manage to lose weight, maintain weight loss, and have more stable blood glucose levels more easily than women. They also seem to respond to keto diets, of all varieties: carnivore, vegetarian and vegan, better than women.

1) is my perception correct?

2) could female hormone amounts and fluctuations, even post-menopause, have something to do with it

3) is it possible women could need slightly different dietary advice than men?

I am interested in any (polite) responses, even if its that I am seeing something that isnt accurate in the main, due to posting frequencies and styles of frequent posters.

I agree with your perception.

Ivor Cummns did an interview with Dr. Jay Wrigley on woman's health, hormones and weight loss and much more. I'm pretty sure he had said during the interview that for women who need to lose weight, it doesn't make a lot of sense to be eating a lot of fat. So, perhaps the standard LCHF approach needs to be a little different for women in this situation. Anyway, the interview is below if interested.

https://thefatemperor.com/dr-jay-wrigley-on-womens-hormonal-issues-weight-loss-and-more/

 

[Member496333]

I agree with your perception.

Ivor Cummns did an interview with Dr. Jay Wrigley on woman's health, hormones and weight loss and much more. I'm pretty sure he had said during the interview that for women who need to lose weight, it doesn't make a lot of sense to be eating a lot of fat. So, perhaps the standard LCHF approach needs to be a little different for women in this situation. Anyway, the interview is below if interested.

https://thefatemperor.com/dr-jay-wrigley-on-womens-hormonal-issues-weight-loss-and-more/

Good point well made. I also listened to that podcast.