• Guest - w'd love to know what you think about the forum! Take the 2025 Survey »

Article in today's Times

How do we keep up the pressure? I remember getting a LOT of stick for suggesting that DAFNE (normal eating) gave a misleading message - you're T2, you can't comment.

I had to give up table tennis several years before the DUK diet caused the muscle pains that led me to this site & low carb - & a resumption of sporting activity.

Yesterday I played about 25 games of TT in the Ealing Hospital Olympics & won gold & bronze in 2 events. (QV)

Tennis this evening.
 
I urge everyone to write to their MP's quoting there own experience, without too much detail and copy and paste this thread as a link on the email.

My MP has already been made aware of this website and has promised to investigate further the ppor advice being given out.

It's all looking very promising indeed.

Mary x

PS many thanks libralising and desidiabulum for posting it.
 
CarbsRok said:
Did the author also have a look around some of the American based forums? What they say does not tally with what the authors claims.
Click to expand...

That maybe the case but in my opinion what is far more important is the ADA's position.

http://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/35/Supplement_1/S11.full.pdf

It should be noted that the RDA for digestible carbohydrate is 130 g/day and is based on providing adequate glucose as the required fuel for the central nervous system without reliance on glucose production from ingested protein or fat.
Click to expand...

Or a roughly 25% carbohydrate regime. Backed up and shown in practice here (thanks Alaska)

http://www.diabetes.org/food-and-fitness/food/what-can-i-eat/making-healthy-food-choices.html

Eat lots of vegetables and fruits. Try picking from the rainbow of colors available to maximize variety.
Eat non-starchy vegetables such as spinach, carrots, broccoli or green beans with meals. Choose whole grain foods over processed grain products. Try brown rice with your stir fry or whole wheat spaghetti with your favorite pasta sauce.
Click to expand...

And explicitly stated here:

http://www.diabetes.org/food-and-fitness/food/what-can-i-eat/grains-and-starchy-vegetables.html

About ¼ of your plate should come from starchy foods ...
Click to expand...
 
borofergie said:
CarbsRok said:
Had to laugh when I read this part of the article.
I honestly think MW either didn't understand what he was taught or he didn't want to understand.
Did the author also have a look around some of the American based forums? What they say does not tally with what the authors claims.
Basic line for control is eat what suits your own personal needs. Not what suits someone else we are all different.
Click to expand...

Do you think that the "50% carbohydrate" dietary advice doled out by the NHS/DUK is "tailored or our own personal needs". Does it respect the fact that "we are all different"?

We are indeed "all different". However, as diabetics, we are also "all the same" in that we have all have variously broken endocrine systems that mean that we are all, to a certain degree, unable to tolerate dietary carbohydrate. Some of us are able to mitigate the effects of these carbohydrates using medication or by slavishly choosing special types of carbs, but the fact remains, that for the vast majority of us, that a one-size fits all carbohydrate diet promoted by the authorities, consists mainly of the one thing most of us cannot eat.
Click to expand...

Yep we all the same but different. :)
Having had type 1 for nearly 50 years I have never ever been told I must eat this that or the other. As a child back in the 60's the standard practice was a set amount of carbs per meal. Never a mention of startchy carbs must be eaten. Fat and protien were also measured.

I had a normal diet as in I ate the same as the rest of the family. Well balanced home cooked meals. No junk no trash. Simple reason parents could not aford junk and trash foods. The only differnce for me was sweet or puddings which were made with artificial sweetener which kept the carbs down.
So MY diet was normal for me.
The question is though what do other people call a normal diet?
Also what do HCP's call a normal diet? I wouldn't mind betting theres a fair difference in the normal. :lol:
Perhaps it's time to go back to basics and teach parents how to cook and introduce cooking back into the school lesson, so the children know what the food is they are eating and how to cook it.

As a foot note I saw an NHS dietiction a couple of years ago no mention was ever made of how many carbs I ate or didn't eat. Neither was I told to eat 50% carbs no startchy carbs were mentioned either. The advice was taylored to my own needs. Not taken from the www DUK or anyone else.
That's why it's always better to seek individual advice and go with an open mind and participate in the conversation. Many go with a closed mind so the outcome is negative from the start. :(
 
The dietician I saw told me that I had to eat starchy carbs, that they were essential to health, and obviously they couldn't do anything for me!!! So as a new diabetic I'm left floundering really, they don't want to help me because I won't follow the party line.
I'm off to buy a copy and post it to the dietician.
 
uote

Before the "diabetes activists" here get too over excited and carried away perhaps I should draw your attention to this sentence.

The Times said:
The American Diabetes Association changed its advice on low-carb diets in 2008. It now considers them to be an effective treatment for short-term weight loss among obese people suffering from type 2 diabetes.
Click to expand...


Edited as I was going to reply to Dawns post but didnt
 
Don't know about you - but when I was diagnosed with the old diabetes, all I wanted to do was lose weight in the shortest term possible.

But then again, if I was looking for advice on diabetes or weight-loss, the last people I'd go to would be the ADA or DUK. These people are part of the problem, not the solution.
 
Hey Guys!

I'm not around much at the moment, but just wanted to add to this conversation as it is one of the issue I care very much about. Teaching Type 1s (and Type 2s come to that) to count carbs is a very good thing. Teaching Type 1s to match insulin to carbs is a very good thing. Telling Type 1s they can 'eat normally' is a very bad thing. In my opinion, the 'Normal Eating' part of DAPHNE is absolutely flawed.

When i went onto insulin, I was sent to the dietician. I explained that I low-carb and she told me off. She told me that 'that was how we used to treat diabetes but it is so much better now. You can eat anything you like as long as you work out the appropriate insulin dose. We don't have to use the old-fashioned way anymore'. This was two years ago. My consultant has supported my low-carbing and has told me that he doesn't believe DAPHNE would be appropriate for me.

I have diabetes and that means I have to manage my carb intake. I think it is very wrong to give the impression to newly-diagnosed diabetics that they can 'eat normally'.

Smidge
 
+1 Smidge.

Diabetics can eat "normally". It's just that the defintion of "normal" used by DUK, the NHS and the Government, is completely wrong. There is nothing normal about a high-carbohydrate diet.
 
Good post Smidge!
My consultant and the Diabetes specialist nurses at the hospital have always supported my low carbing,However,at my GP's surgery,My GP and the jack of all trades practice nurse were horrified,so even though reducing carbs is supported at a higher level in the NHS,it does not seem to be filtering down the line.
 
borofergie said:
Don't know about you - but when I was diagnosed with the old diabetes, all I wanted to do was lose weight in the shortest term possible.

But then again, if I was looking for advice on diabetes or weight-loss, the last people I'd go to would be the ADA or DUK. These people are part of the problem, not the solution.
Click to expand...

Well the ADA says you've only got 2 years to do it in regardless of what diet. Again from the 2012 position statement ...

For weight loss, either low-carbohydrate, low-fat calorie-restricted, or Mediterranean diets may be effective in the short term (up to 2 years).
Click to expand...

Although I agree a move to 130g / day isn't enough for quite a few of us it is however a move to half what is still recommended in the UK and is therefore progress in my mind. The 130g / day RDA recommendation seems to have no time limit proviso as far as I can see and neither does the "Making Healthy Food Choices" pages of their web site which is essentially stating the same thing in my opinion.
 
As a DAFNE graduate myself, I really was taken aback by MW's claims indeed!

At no point were we told what amount of carbs to eat, nor were we told what percentage of our diet should be carbs!

We did have one of the group who didn't eat bread, pasta, flour's etc by choice, and nothing was said and they dietitian's catered for her needs.. And the rest of us ate varying amounts, one of our group who was retired, diagnosed as a youngster had spent 40 years having 2 slices of toast for supper, and the dietitian etc, encouraged him to stop this practice!

The only things they kinda of encouraged didn't push it, just encouraged, was the low fat and avoiding 'junk food's',

As to the rest of the article...

Personally I do think there are problems in communications really...

As, Plenty is pretty ominousness word indeed...

I would tell you that my meal I had 'Plenty' on my plate but a lot of people would say it's starvation rations!

I have a small appetite so for me it's plenty, for somebody who's got a larger appetite they going to see it differently! And we all eat and portion size with our eyes!

The problem is how to get over basic information, that can be translated in the same manner by every individual!
 
CarbsRok said:
Perhaps it's time to go back to basics and teach parents how to cook and introduce cooking back into the school lesson, so the children know what the food is they are eating and how to cook it.
Click to expand...

That's not going to happen while the big food processing companies are calling the shots for the government... I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out they had a hand in drawing up the relevant parts of the National Curriculum in order to keep the poor saps dumb and consuming what they're told to consume via advertisements... same as there's no proper financial education any more... no one is informed how to budget or of the true dangers of compound interest and credit cards...
 
Paul_c said:
That's not going to happen while the big food processing companies are calling the shots for the government... I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out they had a hand in drawing up the relevant parts of the National Curriculum in order to keep the poor saps dumb and consuming what they're told to consume via advertisements... same as there's no proper financial education any more... no one is informed how to budget or of the true dangers of compound interest and credit cards...
Click to expand...


Agree in part Paul but the Big food Processing companies don't dictate what we eat at home in our kitchens, education isn't all about what is taught in school and we can do much as parents to ensure our children eat well and know what is healthy.
 
noblehead said:
Agree in part Paul but the Big food Processing companies don't dictate what we eat at home in our kitchens, education isn't all about what is taught in school and we can do much as parents to ensure our children eat well and know what is healthy.
Click to expand...

Healthy wholegrains.
 
Paul_c said:
CarbsRok said:
Perhaps it's time to go back to basics and teach parents how to cook and introduce cooking back into the school lesson, so the children know what the food is they are eating and how to cook it.
Click to expand...

That's not going to happen while the big food processing companies are calling the shots for the government... I wouldn't be surprised if it turns out they had a hand in drawing up the relevant parts of the National Curriculum in order to keep the poor saps dumb and consuming what they're told to consume via advertisements... same as there's no proper financial education any more... no one is informed how to budget or of the true dangers of compound interest and credit cards...
Click to expand...

No one is forced to buy processed food or even eat the stuff.
If you have a TV there's a thing called the off button, again it's not compulsery to watch adverts or even TV .
Same with kids if you have them it's your house your TV you say what they watch. Solves a lot of problems.
No proper financial education??? Has maths been removed from lessons as well :shock:
 
CarbsRok said:
No one is forced to buy processed food or even eat the stuff.
If you have a TV there's a thing called the off button, again it's not compulsery to watch adverts or even TV .
Same with kids if you have them it's your house your TV you say what they watch. Solves a lot of problems.
No proper financial education??? Has maths been removed from lessons as well :shock:
Click to expand...

You need to eat your healthy wholegrains. More pasta, more rice, more bread, more cake.
 
borofergie said:
CarbsRok said:
No one is forced to buy processed food or even eat the stuff.
If you have a TV there's a thing called the off button, again it's not compulsery to watch adverts or even TV .
Same with kids if you have them it's your house your TV you say what they watch. Solves a lot of problems.
No proper financial education??? Has maths been removed from lessons as well :shock:
Click to expand...

You need to eat your healthy wholegrains. More pasta, more rice, more bread, more cake.
Click to expand...

Lol slight problem I hate pasta,rice and bread doesn't agree with me. non to keen on cake either.
 
CarbsRok said:
No one is forced to buy processed food or even eat the stuff.
If you have a TV there's a thing called the off button, again it's not compulsery to watch adverts or even TV .
Same with kids if you have them it's your house your TV you say what they watch. Solves a lot of problems.
No proper financial education??? Has maths been removed from lessons as well :shock:
Click to expand...


Unfortunately CarbsRok as well as telling everyone to eat the wrong foods we have also told everyone that nothing is their fault and someone else is always to blame, for everything. In the blame and claim society of today its all to easy to say "its not my fault I ate all the pies it was the wicked pie man that made them so tasty" :lolno:

Its so much easier to blame someone else isn't it?
 
Back
Top