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Can't get support from medical profession

S

Snoozieboots

Newbie
Messages
2
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Tablets (oral)
Hi,
I was diagnosed with Type 2 diabetes two years ago now. In the first year, I lost a lot of weight, but subsequently piled it all back on again as I couldn't seem to manage without carbs in the cold weather. I also ate fish and vegetables and salad for a year and was bored and depressed about that, no matter what I tried to do to make it interesting.
Now that I have a lot of weight to lose again and having seen Dr Michael Mosley extolling the virtues of a meal replacement diet to kick start weight loss, I asked my doctor and diabetic nurse if I could do this with regular checks from them to ensure that I didn't continue to take my metformin if it wasn't needed. They just won't agree as they say that it won't educate me in what to eat. I know what I should and shouldn't be eating, but I want to lose a good amount of weight before I start to balance out with 'proper' food. Obviously I can't just go ahead on my own as I risk my health even more by doing so. Am I therefore doomed to go back to my boring fish and veg diet again with no help at all from the medics? I know that I would need to choose the replacement plan carefully to avoid sugars and carbs, but that's one other reason for asking for their input. Surely they should be supporting me when I am trying to help myself? Is this a common issue, or is it just me please?
 
Is there a specific reason why you don't eat meat?
Doctors are pretty useless at nutrition (I'm afraid I think Moseley is as well although others follow what he says).
No need to just eat fish and veg and salad. Add in some eggs and bacon and butter and embrace LCHF.
 
I have not seen my dr since I was diagnosed 18 months ago - so I would tend to think that diabetes is not taken very seriously if you show that you can manage it alone.
Was there some reason to eat such a restricted diet?
I do low carb but find I have so much to chose from.
 
Snoozieboots said:
Hi,
I was diagnosed with Type 2 diabetes two years ago now. In the first year, I lost a lot of weight, but subsequently piled it all back on again as I couldn't seem to manage without carbs in the cold weather. I also ate fish and vegetables and salad for a year and was bored and depressed about that, no matter what I tried to do to make it interesting.
Now that I have a lot of weight to lose again and having seen Dr Michael Mosley extolling the virtues of a meal replacement diet to kick start weight loss, I asked my doctor and diabetic nurse if I could do this with regular checks from them to ensure that I didn't continue to take my metformin if it wasn't needed. They just won't agree as they say that it won't educate me in what to eat. I know what I should and shouldn't be eating, but I want to lose a good amount of weight before I start to balance out with 'proper' food. Obviously I can't just go ahead on my own as I risk my health even more by doing so. Am I therefore doomed to go back to my boring fish and veg diet again with no help at all from the medics? I know that I would need to choose the replacement plan carefully to avoid sugars and carbs, but that's one other reason for asking for their input. Surely they should be supporting me when I am trying to help myself? Is this a common issue, or is it just me please?
Click to expand...

Hi and welcome,

Quite a lot of forum members have done meal replacement diets - around 800 calories for a certain number of weeks, usually 8. Some had medical support, others did not. This is one long thread from @Fleegle who completed it successfully, and posted his thoughts and results every day. https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/newcastle-diet.126691/
 
bulkbiker said:
Is there a specific reason why you don't eat meat?
Doctors are pretty useless at nutrition (I'm afraid I think Moseley is as well although others follow what he says).
No need to just eat fish and veg and salad. Add in some eggs and bacon and butter and embrace LCHF.
Click to expand...
I attended a class about food run as an experiment by my GP practice to help those with diabetes. I was told to steer well clear of bacon. Eggs were said to be fine and I have had boiled eggs for breakfast sometimes. I do try to stay clear of processed meats and bacon is one of those so I don't eat it any more.
 
Snoozieboots said:
I attended a class about food run as an experiment by my GP practice to help those with diabetes. I was told to steer well clear of bacon. Eggs were said to be fine and I have had boiled eggs for breakfast sometimes. I do try to stay clear of processed meats and bacon is one of those so I don't eat it any more.
Click to expand...
Did they say why?
 
Please remember that all health care professionals are there to offer guidance and advice. There are no laws that state a patient must follow that advice. The decisions made are, ultimately, the patient's own.
 
Do yourself a favour and check dietdoctor.com . Loads of recipies, and explanations on lchf and keto, how and why they works. An extremely restricted diet doesn't work in the long term for most people because it's both undoable and unhealthy, but diabetes is a long term issue... So find a diet, or rather, lifestyle, you can live with. I dropped 20 kilo's on lchf, lowered my cholesterol too. Went off diabetes meds and statins three months in, almost 2 years ago. The point of no processed meats is usually that "processed" sometimes means carbs have been added as a filler. Not the case with bacon and high meat content sausages. Steak, filets, what have you, are fine. Just check packaging or go to your local bucher. There's loads still okay! It's not salad and fish till infinity. ;) Good luck!
 
I think you should try lchf diet. You'd love it. Modify from there.
Most of us have.

I know I only lose on low carb, low fat but it loses from my muscles. No where else.
Hence now I can barely walk and to add insult to injury I've added my 2st I keep off with metformin since I needed to stop it. :(

Try lchf and see if a winner for you, like many in 'success stories and testimonials' thread.
Low carb in any variation will give you a start.
 
Snoozieboots said:
I attended a class about food run as an experiment by my GP practice to help those with diabetes. I was told to steer well clear of bacon. Eggs were said to be fine and I have had boiled eggs for breakfast sometimes. I do try to stay clear of processed meats and bacon is one of those so I don't eat it any more.
Click to expand...

I hardly take any bacon...but had a good share of pork knuckles and roasted pork belly. They help keep my glucose flatline...
 
Snoozieboots said:
Surely they should be supporting me when I am trying to help myself? Is this a common issue, or is it just me please?
Click to expand...

I can understand why a doctor or DN would not support something that is traditionally frowned upon. Most dieting organisations will warn against VLCD rapid weight loss and will advocate losing about 1 to 2 lbs a week. Perhaps they haven't heard of the Newcastle Diet, that's also about 800 calories and using meal replacement. When I informed my GP of wanting to try a VLCD I said it was to stablise my BG and weight loss was secondary. She just said that I was one of the few patients she would be happy to try this approach, so obviously considering the suitability for me. She actually said she could trust me, so I monitor my own health.

I have my own version of a very low calorie diet which relies on loads of vegetables. To me, that's more interesting and varied than meal replacement shakes. I also fast for 24 hrs, maybe once or possibly twice a week. I also allow myself meat at the weekends and unsmoked bacon is very definitely a weekend treat.

Snoozieboots said:
I also ate fish and vegetables and salad for a year and was bored and depressed about that, no matter what I tried to do to make it interesting.
Click to expand...

I think meal replacement shakes will be even more difficult.

Snoozieboots said:
I was told to steer well clear of bacon.
Click to expand...

The International Agency for Research on Cancer (IARC) has classified processed meat (not just bacon)

as a possible carcinogen. Interesting use of the word possible. They found that eating 50 grams of processed meat every day increased the risk of certain cancers by 6% (above "normal" risk). I don't think they have done any research on 2 rashers a week. So I'm not steering well clear.

Snoozieboots said:
I can't just go ahead on my own as I risk my health even more by doing so.
Click to expand...

It would be better to get their full agreement, I believe that looking after one's health is a joint effort. I have avoided meal replacement shakes purely for financial reasons and I enjoy my vegetables, either steamed, roast or in a soup (soup maker - BRILLIANT machine), then there's salad, a much better variety of foods compared to a shake. As has already been said, they can't stop you in the same way they can't stop people smoking, drinking or playing sport (healthy? Yes, but not without it's potential problems).

Perhaps if they have heard of the Newcastle Diet, they might be more accommodating, maybe don't mention Dr Mosley but Professor Taylor at Newcastle University. Just a thought.
 
Hi. In general as others have said, GPs & DNs know little about nutrition apart from the nonsense from PHE that they are trained to profer. Unless you have a specific health condition you are unlikely to harm yourself even with fairly extreme diets. I'm not aware of any evidence that shows VLC diets harm you and as long as you keep the carbs down below 100gm/day if possible but not zero things should be fine. I don't believe in those diets which 'kick start this that and the other'; they are just another way of selling a book. Dr Mosely regularly invents a new diet to sell yet more books. Just keep the carbs down and have enough fat and protein together with veg and non-tropical fruit to keep you feeling full. Gradually the weight should come down and BS control will improve. Don't worry about continuing the Metformin after weight reduction as it's a very safe drug and has little effect anyway.
 
I think the success of any diet is finding food that you enjoy that fits in with your lifestyle. My daughter lost 5 stones using low calorie shakes but never really addressed her eating habits, so as soon as she started eating 'normally' she piled it all back on.
You have to decide, only you know your self, if using a low cal shake is going to kick start you, but I would try and find quick tasty foods to eat and not just have a diet of fish and salad, and have a proper meal at least once a day, so as you start losing weight you can add more low cab real food.
I have been eating LCHF for just under a year, not very low carb, but I have had a sustained weight loss. The hardest part I think is the first month when you have to read every label, walking into a shop/ food outlet and just about everything you can not eat, but the list of things you can eat gets longer and it easier to navigate the food mines.
You have to realise HCP are very risk averse, and low fat has been pushed for so long and is so ingrained they have to very sure of their competence to advocate LCHF. I think most of us have just done it and then tell them when our bloods have improved,
 
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