Hi - I'm embarking on a low carb diet as I've read lots of evidence that it can reverse diabetes. I've cut out bread, rice, pasta and potatoes from lunch and dinner, that's not too hard, but breakfast options are trickier, because I like to start the day with something solid. So I've resorted to porridge, using 'proper' oats (not the microwave type) which I've always understood is ok for diabetics as this is a slow sugar release food. However it is still a carb-based food, and my question is, is it ok to include porridge in a low carb diet, or does it upset the whole thing? Basically, instead of cutting out carbs altogether, I'm reducing my intake by around 75% - is that ok?
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Carbs in a low carb diet
- Thread starter jeanser
- Start Date
bulkbiker
BANNED
The only way you can tell for sure is by testing before and then 2 hours after to see how much your blood sugar has gone up.
For me there's no way I'd eat porridge.. but I don't eat breakfast so that solves that problem. Bacon and eggs seems to work for most. As for total carbs it depends again on how your body reacts to them how low you need to go. A lot of people try to go as low as possible to start with then re-introduce if they feel the need later again while testing. Others may try to gently reduce... but I think it is harder that to way to find the right level as you will be having higher blood sugar levels whilst experimenting. As with all of this we all must do our own experiments but testing before and after eating is essential to get decent control.
For me there's no way I'd eat porridge.. but I don't eat breakfast so that solves that problem. Bacon and eggs seems to work for most. As for total carbs it depends again on how your body reacts to them how low you need to go. A lot of people try to go as low as possible to start with then re-introduce if they feel the need later again while testing. Others may try to gently reduce... but I think it is harder that to way to find the right level as you will be having higher blood sugar levels whilst experimenting. As with all of this we all must do our own experiments but testing before and after eating is essential to get decent control.
kokhongw
Well-Known Member
Chart from (http://www.ejinme.com/article/S0953-6205(09)00098-3/fulltext)
Depending on how far down the path of the Natural progression of T2D you have gone
But I would say 75% reduction is a great start!
Welcome to the forum.
Pinkorchid
Well-Known Member
There is no proven evidence that eating low carb will reverse diabetes only that it can help lower BG. There is no general amount of carbs to eat only the amount that suits you as an individual. If you can eat porridge and many do then it is fine some people find it does not spike them like wheat cereals do
miahara
Well-Known Member
Hi and welcome jeanser! As bulkbiker has said, the only way you can really tell how your food affects your blood glucose is by testing. When I first set off on the low carb route I also had the same idea as you about porridge and tried it in various guises but they all raised rather than lowered my BG. Breakfast for me now is bacon and eggs, sometimes sausage bacon and eggs and the eggs are either fried or scrambled or in a cheese omlette.
AM1874
Well-Known Member
Hi @jeanser .. and welcome
I agree with @bulkbiker but I think there may be something of a misconception here. Reducing your carbs by 75% is a great start but, for me, the low-carb lifestyle is governed by taking in a maximum of 25grams of carb (usually nearer 20) per day rather than a target reduction .. if I had reduced my carbs by 75%, I reckon I would now be taking in around 70 to 80 grams a day. Having said that, you can only really find out what carbs are doing to your blood sugar levels by testing .. it's a case of different strokes for different folks
Other that that, you have made a good move coming here. Since joining this forum the folks here have given me so much info, advice and support that I am now much more confident about the journey ahead. So ask your questions and be assured that you will receive the answers that you need .. in my experience, it gets easier .. very quickly.
Managing and controlling your diabetes through exercise, diet and testing your Blood Glucose seems to be the best way forward for many people. For me, committing to an LCHF (Low Carb High Fat) lifestyle and testing 3-5 times a day seems to be working and you'll find that there is a wealth of info, relevant advice and positive support about LCHF on the forum ..
I have tagged @daisy1 for you and I would suggest that you read up on the Low Carb Program in the information that she will soon be sending you. You might also find the discussion on the Low Carb Diet forum helpful .. and the following Diet Doctor websites ...
Low Carb Intro and Information
Low Carbs in 60 Seconds
Note: plenty of breakfast ideas on these sites
Not sure whether you are testing but if not, I strongly recommend that you get yourself a meter .. I suggest that you try the website at:
https://homehealth-uk.com/product-category/blood-glucose/
for the SD Codefree meter, which costs £12.98 (you don't pay VAT) or:
http://spirit-healthcare.co.uk/product/tee2-blood-glucose-meter/
who distribute the TEE 2 meter, which is free.
I have both for comparative purposes and I have never found any significant difference between them. Unless you are prescribed test strips by your doctor (unlikely), the costs of testing comes down to the ongoing charges for test strips and lancets. I'm testing 3-4 times a day which works out at around £10 to £12 per month for either of the two packages above but, more importantly, I now know what my BG levels are .. and I can now manage them
Hope this helps
I agree with @bulkbiker but I think there may be something of a misconception here. Reducing your carbs by 75% is a great start but, for me, the low-carb lifestyle is governed by taking in a maximum of 25grams of carb (usually nearer 20) per day rather than a target reduction .. if I had reduced my carbs by 75%, I reckon I would now be taking in around 70 to 80 grams a day. Having said that, you can only really find out what carbs are doing to your blood sugar levels by testing .. it's a case of different strokes for different folks
Other that that, you have made a good move coming here. Since joining this forum the folks here have given me so much info, advice and support that I am now much more confident about the journey ahead. So ask your questions and be assured that you will receive the answers that you need .. in my experience, it gets easier .. very quickly.
Managing and controlling your diabetes through exercise, diet and testing your Blood Glucose seems to be the best way forward for many people. For me, committing to an LCHF (Low Carb High Fat) lifestyle and testing 3-5 times a day seems to be working and you'll find that there is a wealth of info, relevant advice and positive support about LCHF on the forum ..
I have tagged @daisy1 for you and I would suggest that you read up on the Low Carb Program in the information that she will soon be sending you. You might also find the discussion on the Low Carb Diet forum helpful .. and the following Diet Doctor websites ...
Low Carb Intro and Information
Low Carbs in 60 Seconds
Note: plenty of breakfast ideas on these sites
Not sure whether you are testing but if not, I strongly recommend that you get yourself a meter .. I suggest that you try the website at:
https://homehealth-uk.com/product-category/blood-glucose/
for the SD Codefree meter, which costs £12.98 (you don't pay VAT) or:
http://spirit-healthcare.co.uk/product/tee2-blood-glucose-meter/
who distribute the TEE 2 meter, which is free.
I have both for comparative purposes and I have never found any significant difference between them. Unless you are prescribed test strips by your doctor (unlikely), the costs of testing comes down to the ongoing charges for test strips and lancets. I'm testing 3-4 times a day which works out at around £10 to £12 per month for either of the two packages above but, more importantly, I now know what my BG levels are .. and I can now manage them
Hope this helps
Chook
Expert
Hello and welcome to the forum. Yes, breakfast was my problem at first, too.
I agree with the others - the best thing you can do is test, eat porridge, test again after 1 and then again after 2 hours - then if the rise is too much you should reduce your portion size until you get to an acceptable (for you) test result. You might then think there isn't enough porridge in that bowl worth worrying about (which is what happened tome).
My normal breakfasts are two boiled eggs and some buttered Lidl high protein roll soldiers, Lidl protein roll bacon sandwich, scrambled eggs on buttered toasted Lidl protein roll or once or twice a week I'll have the Full Monty - eggs, bacon, (low carb) sausages, fried mushrooms, and a grilled tomato.
As you can see, the Lidl high protein rolls feature quite heavily in my breakfasts - available in their open rolls bakery section - they are dark brown triangles and quite a few people on this forum find they can eat them without too much of a BG spike (if any).
The other option as @bulkbiker has said is to not eat breakfast.
I agree with the others - the best thing you can do is test, eat porridge, test again after 1 and then again after 2 hours - then if the rise is too much you should reduce your portion size until you get to an acceptable (for you) test result. You might then think there isn't enough porridge in that bowl worth worrying about (which is what happened tome).
My normal breakfasts are two boiled eggs and some buttered Lidl high protein roll soldiers, Lidl protein roll bacon sandwich, scrambled eggs on buttered toasted Lidl protein roll or once or twice a week I'll have the Full Monty - eggs, bacon, (low carb) sausages, fried mushrooms, and a grilled tomato.
As you can see, the Lidl high protein rolls feature quite heavily in my breakfasts - available in their open rolls bakery section - they are dark brown triangles and quite a few people on this forum find they can eat them without too much of a BG spike (if any).
The other option as @bulkbiker has said is to not eat breakfast.
daisy1
Legend
@jeanser
Hello Jeanser and welcome to the Forum Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. This includes a link to the Low Carb Program which you could try. Ask more questions when you need to and someone will be able to help.
BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS
Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.
A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 235,000 people who are demonstrating this.
On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.
The role of carbohydrate
Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.
If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.
The bad news
Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.
The good news
People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.
Controlling your carbs
The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.
There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:
A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.
The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.
Choosing better carbohydrates
The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.
Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.
Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a free 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.
Eating what works for you
Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.
To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.
The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:
Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
Access to blood glucose test strips
The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:
Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.
You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.
Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
Take part in Diabetes.co.uk digital education programs and improve your understanding. They're all free.
Hello Jeanser and welcome to the Forum
Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it useful. This includes a link to the Low Carb Program which you could try. Ask more questions when you need to and someone will be able to help.BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS
Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.
A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 235,000 people who are demonstrating this.
On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.
The role of carbohydrate
Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.
If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.
The bad news
Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.
The good news
People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.
Controlling your carbs
The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.
There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:
- Reduce your carbohydrate intake
- Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates
A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.
The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.
Choosing better carbohydrates
The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.
Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.
Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a free 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.
Eating what works for you
Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.
To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.
The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:
Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
- Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
- 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l
- Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
- 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l
- Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
- 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l
Access to blood glucose test strips
The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:
- structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
- self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education
Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.
You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.
Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
Take part in Diabetes.co.uk digital education programs and improve your understanding. They're all free.
- Low Carb Program - it's made front-page news of the New Scientist and The Times. Developed with 20,000 people with type 2 diabetes; 96% of people who take part recommend it... find out why
- Hypo Program - improve your understanding of hypos. There's a version for people with diabetes, parents/guardians of children with type 1, children with type 1 diabetes, teachers and HCPs.
Kristin251
Expert
I too need to keep all carbs under 20g a day fir good control.
For ME, if I get bf wrong and spike the whole day I run higher. I save most carbs for dinner when I'm most insulin sensitive.
Bf for me is avocado and celery. Amazing how long it holds me and very easy on bs.
For ME, if I get bf wrong and spike the whole day I run higher. I save most carbs for dinner when I'm most insulin sensitive.
Bf for me is avocado and celery. Amazing how long it holds me and very easy on bs.
Jibba Jabba
Well-Known Member
I make my own "porridge" from a recipe found on here a long time ago.
Scottish Porridge Oats (I get mine from Lidl) - 1 tablespoon
Flaxseed - 1 tablespoon
Desiccated coconut - 2 tablespoons
Ground almonds - 2 tablespoons
Pop in a saucepan with some milk and heat up for a couple of minutes or in the microwave for 2 minutes
It may not suit you as everyone is different but I seem to do okay with it. I tested at 6.4 today, two hours after.
Scottish Porridge Oats (I get mine from Lidl) - 1 tablespoon
Flaxseed - 1 tablespoon
Desiccated coconut - 2 tablespoons
Ground almonds - 2 tablespoons
Pop in a saucepan with some milk and heat up for a couple of minutes or in the microwave for 2 minutes
It may not suit you as everyone is different but I seem to do okay with it. I tested at 6.4 today, two hours after.
Mbaker
Well-Known Member
You'll being looking for a spike of no more than 2 mmol. I managed to get a HbA1c of 41 on 35 grams of oats made with water and cinnamon for breakfast, and home made soda bread with mackerel.
Switching to nuts, berries and Greek yogurt, omelettes yielded a 35 HbA1c. I worked out that the slow release nature of the carbs was keeping my blood glucose elevated for long periods - this made sense. As stated several times you will need to test to see what works for your condition.
Switching to nuts, berries and Greek yogurt, omelettes yielded a 35 HbA1c. I worked out that the slow release nature of the carbs was keeping my blood glucose elevated for long periods - this made sense. As stated several times you will need to test to see what works for your condition.
Bluetit1802
Legend
Which of these do you find better for your post meal levels - berries and yogurt or ham and cheese?
mo53
Expert
@Bluetit1802 I think the ham and cheese is best but there isn't a great deal in it. I tend to have my carbs in berries.
VioletViolet
Well-Known Member
Snap! Although I bulk mine up with ground flax seeds too. That gives bulk and a texture not unlike porridge.
Hi Guys and thanks to everyone for so many useful answers. I don't test so no idea what my blood sugar levels are, however after a dodgy week on the low carb diet (feeling tired, nauseous etc, as predicted) I have to say I'm generally feeling better than before on this diet. I'm sticking with porridge for the time being as it seems to work with me, but I'll also try some of the easier breakfast options suggested, by way of ringing the changes.
One further question re carbs, I think I'll get some negative answers....What's the view on beer? I know it's all carbs, so probably best avoided, but I quite like a beer of an evening, and with the recent hot weather it's even more attractive. I'm only talking a couple of 330ml bottles, however does this compromise the whole low carb thing?
One further question re carbs, I think I'll get some negative answers....What's the view on beer? I know it's all carbs, so probably best avoided, but I quite like a beer of an evening, and with the recent hot weather it's even more attractive. I'm only talking a couple of 330ml bottles, however does this compromise the whole low carb thing?
bulkbiker
BANNED
I would say that testing is one of the most important things that you can do to show what you should and shouldn't be eating. It's key to keeping you levels down otherwise its a bit like driving blindfolded.
As for beer there are a few lower carb ones about
http://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/new-low-carb-lager.114087/#post-1370349
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