Covid and Work, Covid Advice and General Chat

[JRT]

Well an interesting first day back in earnest. Never had a panic attack just because I was inside before!! Stood outside the morning briefing and heard pretty well nothing but considering all staff were pretty much sitting next to each other I'll take the not hearing anything! Was ok outside or standing in a doorway but that won't last as the winter draws in. Brings it's own set of problems as well as the mask isn't something you can wear 8 hours non stop so when you go outside you take it off and then have to put it back on again when you go inside. Suspect that could leave yourself open to contamination by keeping doing that. I certainly need a workers belt though to hang masks, visors, sanitizer, wipes, gloves, pens, and god knows what else.

My GP then rang after school to see how things were and to discuss the letter. Pretty pointless really. I score 67 on the Covid Age test which apparently places me at the lower end of higher risk. The only things I score for were diabetes and age, that's it. Hypertension doesn't give you any score, neither do lifetime vices like drinking or smoking or even BMI wasn't on her list! No idea why BMI or blood pressure didn't rate. Not sure which Covid Age Table she was using! She just admitted that it's a lottery and you could either get seriously ill or not even know that you have had it. Reassuring,,,,,not!! I'm not as risk as some and I'm more at risk than others and I was lucky to be in a school with smaller children who in her opinion don't shed the virus., I then reminded her that I work in the Secondary bit with 11-19 year olds!

Not sure the GP's can even agree in what is going on.....

Well at least your GP called I suppose! It is extremely weird/ frustrating that the only thing we are certain of is that diabetes and covid not a good combination and the more comorbidities you throw in the higher the risk. In the real world it just seems a case of oh dear that could be nasty but off you go anyway!
There seems to be an element of surprise that after encouraging people to go on holiday/go down the pub/ enjoy the summer etc infections are rising. Those that are at minimum risk are pretty much living a normal life. That's before Universities start.
People are scratching their heads and wondering why people arent dying,I think we know the answer to that.
Things must be getting a bit worrying because they wheeled out Matt Hancock to remind those not at risk to be careful as they could still get very poorly and potentially kill a few vulnerable people. That's all sorted then. I think hes a bit worried we will start filling the hospitals!
I'm sure there are some good school examples of how it should be done but I havent found any.
Yes, you do need to be careful removing masks, i know in care they are given a training session on it. The assumption is that the outside of the mask has the virus on so you have to take it off without contact with face/ hair/ hands.
I remember in one of your posts you queried turning taps on and off. I used a clean paper towel,then of course you have to dispose of the paper towel...
I wish you all the best. As I have mentioned before I did one 12 hour shift under such conditions and it was mentally exhausting.

 

[JRT]

Interestingly I have just received an email from Diabetes UK about the results of their petitioning Parliament regarding vulnerable groups returning to work.
Apparently although the Government acknowledged the concerns vulnerable people face returning to work they have not yet committed to providing more support to keep them safe.
Theres not a lot you can sat about that really.

 

[lucylocket61]

the thing about healthy young people getting the covid-19 virus is that yes, they are generally ok. But they pass it on to others, many others, and each growth of circulating virus makes the likelihood of vulnerable people getting very ill or dying higher.

its not rocket science, is it.

 

[Max68]

the thing about healthy young people getting the covid-19 virus is that yes, they are generally ok. But they pass it on to others, many others, and each growth of circulating virus makes the likelihood of vulnerable people getting very ill or dying higher.

its not rocket science, is it.

Totally agree. What baffles me is how many younger folk don't seem worried. Maybe the best way forward would be to just let them get on with it whilst telling the vulnerable to hunker down. Then they would get their herd immunity! Problem these younger folk have families and work mates who maybe vulnerable. Let the young just go free but force the vulnerable into the firing line doesn't exactly constitute a duty of care!

 

[Max68]

Well at least your GP called I suppose! It is extremely weird/ frustrating that the only thing we are certain of is that diabetes and covid not a good combination and the more comorbidities you throw in the higher the risk. In the real world it just seems a case of oh dear that could be nasty but off you go anyway!
There seems to be an element of surprise that after encouraging people to go on holiday/go down the pub/ enjoy the summer etc infections are rising. Those that are at minimum risk are pretty much living a normal life. That's before Universities start.
People are scratching their heads and wondering why people arent dying,I think we know the answer to that.
Things must be getting a bit worrying because they wheeled out Matt Hancock to remind those not at risk to be careful as they could still get very poorly and potentially kill a few vulnerable people. That's all sorted then. I think hes a bit worried we will start filling the hospitals!
I'm sure there are some good school examples of how it should be done but I havent found any.
Yes, you do need to be careful removing masks, i know in care they are given a training session on it. The assumption is that the outside of the mask has the virus on so you have to take it off without contact with face/ hair/ hands.
I remember in one of your posts you queried turning taps on and off. I used a clean paper towel,then of course you have to dispose of the paper towel...
I wish you all the best. As I have mentioned before I did one 12 hour shift under such conditions and it was mentally exhausting.

I did my best to take it off away from the face and same when I put it back on. At lunch I put it in a plastic bag in the boot and put a new mask on. The FFP3 I've quarantined in the garage and the second different one has gone in the wash. Won't wear the reusable FFP again until next Monday. It's difficult because if I changed it every time I took it off when outside I'd probably get through 8 odd masks! Very claustrophobic though wearing them and an itchy nose is a pain!

And yep always use the hand towels or an elbow when using the taps or opening doors and always sanitizing or washing hands.

You just got to do as well as you can do.

 

[Mr_Pot]

Do you know how many 'points' diabetes is awarded on that covid age test Max? I notice it's not included in the score but almost added as an 'and if you have this, it means your score could go higher'. How much higher though? x

If just being diabetic is regarded as a blanket risk then it is a very blunt instrument. Not distinguishing between types is one thing but even if we just consider type 2, surely someone diagnosed just over the diabetic threshold and now with an HbA1c in the 30's controlled by diet does not have the same risk as someone in denial about their condition and taking drugs.

 

[Max68]

If just being diabetic is regarded as a blanket risk then it is a very blunt instrument. Not distinguishing between types is one thing but even if we just consider type 2, surely someone diagnosed just over the diabetic threshold and now with an HbA1c in the 30's controlled by diet does not have the same risk as someone in denial about their condition and taking drugs.

That's exactly the problem with the lack of information that we receive particular to our own personal risk. My GP threw my score at me as 67 as I had an HBA1c of 58. I reminded her that was my score in December but in June it had come down to 51. My Covid age was still 67!! I then just generally queried her on how basically I assumed that by keeping my HBA1c lower etc would lower my risk and she just ummed and aahed! Was quite disconcerting to hear a GP so seemingly unsure!

 

[Fairygodmother]

My GP said it was 15. So my age 52 + 15 = 67. Hope I see my 68th birthday!!!

Is 67 the age people can currently retire?

 

[KK123]

If just being diabetic is regarded as a blanket risk then it is a very blunt instrument. Not distinguishing between types is one thing but even if we just consider type 2, surely someone diagnosed just over the diabetic threshold and now with an HbA1c in the 30's controlled by diet does not have the same risk as someone in denial about their condition and taking drugs.

Hi Mr Pot. Just to add, the 'covid age risk assessment' does distinguish (up to a point) between 'well controlled' and 'not so well controlled' type 1 and type 2 diabetes. It says something like, if your hb1ac is below 53 (ish) then points are deducted and if it's above, points are added. There's a difference of a few points between types as well. I agree of course that it is still a blunt instrument which is understandable because simply sharing this condition doesn't mean we are all at exactly the same risk but I suppose it acts as a starting point when being risk assessed overall. x

 

[KK123]

That's exactly the problem with the lack of information that we receive particular to our own personal risk. My GP threw my score at me as 67 as I had an HBA1c of 58. I reminded her that was my score in December but in June it had come down to 51. My Covid age was still 67!! I then just generally queried her on how basically I assumed that by keeping my HBA1c lower etc would lower my risk and she just ummed and aahed! Was quite disconcerting to hear a GP so seemingly unsure!

Hi Max, I suppose that's because these figures are little more than a guideline? Maybe someone with an hb1ac of 58 but otherwise as fit as a fiddle is less of a risk than someone with an hb1ac of 40 but ten stone overweight (I say that because another question on the covid age thing is BMI). It's back to how they decided who was getting a shielding letter....and we all know the issues that caused.

 

[Fairygodmother]

Well, so it begins: two year groups in older daughter’s workplace have needed to isolate, but no info to members of staff from the head, even to the point of the tutor of one of the groups meeting with them all before the year group were informed.
Six children away from younger grandson’s class today, reasons unknown, but are there enough test kits available if the children have COVID symptoms? I’m just hoping beyond hope that if they all get it they’ll come through without major damage. I wonder how long it’ll be before I can see them all again?

 

[Max68]

Is 67 the age people can currently retire?

Maybe I should put that to my MP., I am 67 Covid age so should be able to withdraw my pension!! Not so according to my MP's latest reply.

What amazes me about it is how she has assumed that I haven't already had several conversations with my GP!! Before I reply to her could someone advise if it is the Government who has now insisted that you need a Specialists approval to work from home and that GP's are now powerless because it seems my MP thinks GP's have more clout if I have read her reply properly!

"Dear Mr.

Thank you for your further reply. I completely understand and empathise with the difficult position you and others are in.

Unfortunately accessing your pension early without detriment is not a viable option. At this point, whilst we are still waiting to hear from Department of health and Social Care, I highly recommend you book a meeting with your GP again,. I would highlight the distress this fear is causing you and how unsafe you feel in your place of work.

I will be chasing up DHSC about their response, although as I’m sure you’ll be able to understand, there is a high volume of correspondence coming into departments at the moment, but I hope they will be able to provide you with a reply as soon as possible.

Kind regards,"

Saw my Head today and he asked how things were. I was honest enough to say not good and he said we would catch up before the end of the day. I'm still waiting! Also was emailed a Health and Wellbeing form to complete for work and I was brutally honest with them to the extent that I probably came across as a drama queen! However I figured it's not the time to play brave and give them the "I'm ok" thumbs up, after all it isn't a football injury I am bravely limping through. Haven't heard back yet but it goes to the Line Manager.

Wasn't too impressed yesterday though as they forwarded the schools sickness policy for the new term. Meetings if more than 7 days off in a certain period of time etc etc, it all seemed a bit insensitive considering you could easily bypass your sick leave maximum if you contracted Covid, was isolating from an outbreak at school or Track and Trace contacted you. I assume they will be sensible if that were to happen.

Outside again today was fine but at one point I was asked if I could write a document in the Computer Room. Went up to it and there were eight staff all crowded around PC's in this small room with no masks. Madness. I declined the task!!

 

[KK123]

Maybe I should put that to my MP., I am 67 Covid age so should be able to withdraw my pension!! Not so according to my MP's latest reply.

What amazes me about it is how she has assumed that I haven't already had several conversations with my GP!! Before I reply to her could someone advise if it is the Government who has now insisted that you need a Specialists approval to work from home and that GP's are now powerless because it seems my MP thinks GP's have more clout if I have read her reply properly!

"Dear Mr.

Thank you for your further reply. I completely understand and empathise with the difficult position you and others are in.

Unfortunately accessing your pension early without detriment is not a viable option. At this point, whilst we are still waiting to hear from Department of health and Social Care, I highly recommend you book a meeting with your GP again,. I would highlight the distress this fear is causing you and how unsafe you feel in your place of work.

I will be chasing up DHSC about their response, although as I’m sure you’ll be able to understand, there is a high volume of correspondence coming into departments at the moment, but I hope they will be able to provide you with a reply as soon as possible.

Kind regards,"

Saw my Head today and he asked how things were. I was honest enough to say not good and he said we would catch up before the end of the day. I'm still waiting! Also was emailed a Health and Wellbeing form to complete for work and I was brutally honest with them to the extent that I probably came across as a drama queen! However I figured it's not the time to play brave and give them the "I'm ok" thumbs up, after all it isn't a football injury I am bravely limping through. Haven't heard back yet but it goes to the Line Manager.

Wasn't too impressed yesterday though as they forwarded the schools sickness policy for the new term. Meetings if more than 7 days off in a certain period of time etc etc, it all seemed a bit insensitive considering you could easily bypass your sick leave maximum if you contracted Covid, was isolating from an outbreak at school or Track and Trace contacted you. I assume they will be sensible if that were to happen.

Outside again today was fine but at one point I was asked if I could write a document in the Computer Room. Went up to it and there were eight staff all crowded around PC's in this small room with no masks. Madness. I declined the task!!

Hi Max, you may find (like in my job) that any absences that are Covid related are recorded differently so do not come under the normal sickness policy. x

 

[JRT]

Maybe I should put that to my MP., I am 67 Covid age so should be able to withdraw my pension!! Not so according to my MP's latest reply.

What amazes me about it is how she has assumed that I haven't already had several conversations with my GP!! Before I reply to her could someone advise if it is the Government who has now insisted that you need a Specialists approval to work from home and that GP's are now powerless because it seems my MP thinks GP's have more clout if I have read her reply properly!

"Dear Mr.

Thank you for your further reply. I completely understand and empathise with the difficult position you and others are in.

Unfortunately accessing your pension early without detriment is not a viable option. At this point, whilst we are still waiting to hear from Department of health and Social Care, I highly recommend you book a meeting with your GP again,. I would highlight the distress this fear is causing you and how unsafe you feel in your place of work.

I will be chasing up DHSC about their response, although as I’m sure you’ll be able to understand, there is a high volume of correspondence coming into departments at the moment, but I hope they will be able to provide you with a reply as soon as possible.

Kind regards,"

Saw my Head today and he asked how things were. I was honest enough to say not good and he said we would catch up before the end of the day. I'm still waiting! Also was emailed a Health and Wellbeing form to complete for work and I was brutally honest with them to the extent that I probably came across as a drama queen! However I figured it's not the time to play brave and give them the "I'm ok" thumbs up, after all it isn't a football injury I am bravely limping through. Haven't heard back yet but it goes to the Line Manager.

Wasn't too impressed yesterday though as they forwarded the schools sickness policy for the new term. Meetings if more than 7 days off in a certain period of time etc etc, it all seemed a bit insensitive considering you could easily bypass your sick leave maximum if you contracted Covid, was isolating from an outbreak at school or Track and Trace contacted you. I assume they will be sensible if that were to happen.

Outside again today was fine but at one point I was asked if I could write a document in the Computer Room. Went up to it and there were eight staff all crowded around PC's in this small room with no masks. Madness. I declined the task!!

I'm not quite sure if the need to involve a specialist was if you were shielded? I was looking at guidelines earlier and the only people they specifically mention working from home are those that were shielded (although best to check it's been a long day!).
As high risk we should be socially distancing and minimising social contacts and only return to work if covid safe etc. Trouble is very little support if it isnt.
Another chat with my Union rep today. Same old same old. He did ask if my GP would sign me off again. For me I dont think I want this as want situation resolved and she implied last time she wouldnt.
Do you think your MP was suggesting in a roundabout way you see if your GP will sign you off with stress? They do seem a bit anti this,I'm not sure why.
Your MP was waiting to hear from DHSC? I must admit it all appears to be kicking off again at the moment. I'd be surprised if we had a national lockdown but if things dont improve rapidly maybe they are planning to act more quickly than March?
I share your unease with colleagues. If I were to return to work about 95٪ of staff are under 30 and low risk. One would hope they are cautious for the residents sake but it's a risk for me that concerns me.
Once again,good luck. Personally I feel like I did in early March,that its potentially very risky out there in certain settings.

 

[JRT]

Interestingly I've just received an email from WRVS( I signed up as a phone volunteer). They desperately want volunteers back in certain areas of the country.
I think we all know certain areas are more affected.
The only thing I can reccomend Max is the ONS Covid deaths map. It only goes up until end of July but you can type in your postcode, or the schools to get an idea of local area. I did it earlier and it was quite unnerving to see the clusters of deaths circling my specific area,and I live in one of lowest rated in country.

 

[Max68]

I'm not quite sure if the need to involve a specialist was if you were shielded? I was looking at guidelines earlier and the only people they specifically mention working from home are those that were shielded (although best to check it's been a long day!).
As high risk we should be socially distancing and minimising social contacts and only return to work if covid safe etc. Trouble is very little support if it isnt.
Another chat with my Union rep today. Same old same old. He did ask if my GP would sign me off again. For me I dont think I want this as want situation resolved and she implied last time she wouldnt.
Do you think your MP was suggesting in a roundabout way you see if your GP will sign you off with stress? They do seem a bit anti this,I'm not sure why.
Your MP was waiting to hear from DHSC? I must admit it all appears to be kicking off again at the moment. I'd be surprised if we had a national lockdown but if things dont improve rapidly maybe they are planning to act more quickly than March?
I share your unease with colleagues. If I were to return to work about 95٪ of staff are under 30 and low risk. One would hope they are cautious for the residents sake but it's a risk for me that concerns me.
Once again,good luck. Personally I feel like I did in early March,that its potentially very risky out there in certain settings.

That's our problem I feel. If you were shielded then you have some support still (I think), if you are low risk you don't need it but it's this middle group, the clinically vulnerable, that seem to have been left to our own devices. It's creating a knock on effect as well because I won't check my emails etc in the busy computer room I do them at home and I've just finished checking them all. Last night I didn't finish all the tasks till gone 9pm so it's adding an hour or two at least to my working day as I am working from home after all, but as an addition to the school day! If Covid doesn't get me I'm sure exhaustion will!

Yep I think you are right I think the MP probably is suggesting that I get signed off with stress but the GP hasn't even suggested this and plus with the schools new sickness policy that would probably get messy! I've emailed the school for an official meeting with the Head and see where we go from there.

 

[Max68]

Interestingly I've just received an email from WRVS( I signed up as a phone volunteer). They desperately want volunteers back in certain areas of the country.
I think we all know certain areas are more affected.
The only thing I can reccomend Max is the ONS Covid deaths map. It only goes up until end of July but you can type in your postcode, or the schools to get an idea of local area. I did it earlier and it was quite unnerving to see the clusters of deaths circling my specific area,and I live in one of lowest rated in country.

Thanks for that, Interesting indeed.

My post code

Deaths
Overall 11
March 0
April 5
May 6
June 0

Works Postcode

Overall 7
March 2
April 4
May 1
June 0

Actually I didn't realise how local that was. The 11 total is for my village only. Town next door only 1 mile away has had 33 deaths but again that's only one particular locality for that town. Not sure if it allows you to search by town in total rather than postcode.

 

[JRT]

Thanks for that, Interesting indeed.

My post code

Deaths
Overall 11
March 0
April 5
May 6
June 0

Works Postcode

Overall 7
March 2
April 4
May 1
June 0

Actually I didn't realise how local that was. The 11 total is for my village only. Town next door only 1 mile away has had 33 deaths but again that's only one particular locality for that town. Not sure if it allows you to search by town in total rather than postcode.

You may have to pretty much tell your GP it's what you want,only in a roundabout way. To be honest early summer I was having nightmares most nights that I was at work as usual then suddenly realised I was there and it wasnt safe!
By scrolling the map around I could see local areas and further afield.
I wouldn't worry unduly about the sickness policy ,as is frequently stated these are unprecedented times.
Yes,I think the government have a definite policy of individuals negotiating with employers.i can appreciate a blanket policy might not be appropriate. Its frustrating and stressful that the government have been so unhelpful,for whatever reason. Their basic guidelines alone make some work settings out of the question but no one official will will say it

 

[Max68]

You may have to pretty much tell your GP it's what you want,only in a roundabout way. To be honest early summer I was having nightmares most nights that I was at work as usual then suddenly realised I was there and it wasnt safe!
By scrolling the map around I could see local areas and further afield.
I wouldn't worry unduly about the sickness policy ,as is frequently stated these are unprecedented times.
Yes,I think the government have a definite policy of individuals negotiating with employers.i can appreciate a blanket policy might not be appropriate. Its frustrating and stressful that the government have been so unhelpful,for whatever reason. Their basic guidelines alone make some work settings out of the question but no one official will will say it

Tough one isn't it. Not sure I could survive on Sick Pay although it may be the only option. Not at all surprised about the pension, as this Government seem to be doing nothing to help. Saw an article earlier saying billions has been paid out in Furlough either by error or to people who fraudulently claimed it. Absolutely sickening when you do things by the book and get no assistance at all, and then you can't claim a pension a little earlier because of unprecedented circumstances and yet it's your own money!! Laughable.

 

[Max68]

Breaking News -

Social gatherings of more than six people will be illegal in England from Monday - with some exemptions - amid a steep rise in coronavirus cases. A new legal limit will ban larger groups meeting anywhere socially indoors or outdoors, No 10 said.
But it will not apply to schools, workplaces or Covid-secure weddings, funerals and organised team sports.

"It is absolutely critical that people now abide by these rules and remember the basics - washing your hands, covering your face, keeping space from others, and getting a test if you have symptoms."

Health Secretary Matt Hancock yesterday warned MPs that the UK was on the brink of a second Covid peak.

He said Britain has seen a “concerning rise” in coronavirus infections which could lead to more deaths in just a matter of weeks.

He went on: “Each and every citizen has a responsibility to follow social distancing and help stop a second peak.”

And yet they still allow the clinically vulnerable to attend the workplace!! Beggars belief!