Diet culture is it such a thing.

LaoDan said:

I think this is a pretty bad analogy. I’m also of the opinion that anyone can lose weight, at least from a physiological point of view.

My thought experiment. If a person with such a condition were locked in an eco-bubble. given a daily ration of, essential fats, essential amino acids, and essential micro nutrients. What would happen?

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Again there’s an assumption that poor dietary choices (knowingly or unknowingly) are to blame here. And in some perhaps even lots of cases that may be true, I’d suggest the op was one of these based on his accounts of the changes he made. But very clearly not all.

Whilst there’s been no lock, no bubble and no rations, a real world version of this is what Zand, lucylocket and a number of others are stating they have done. Are you suggesting either they are not accurate in these claims or that their “rations” are not suitable? Is there not room for a 3rd as yet unquantified alternative explanation?

HSSS said:

Again there’s an assumption that poor dietary choices (knowingly or unknowingly) are to blame here. And in some perhaps even lots of cases that may be true, I’d suggest the op was one of these based on his accounts of the changes he made. But very clearly not all.

Whilst there’s been no lock, no bubble and no rations, a real world version of this is what Zand, lucylocket and a number of others are stating they have done. Are you suggesting either they are not accurate in these claims or that their “rations” are not suitable? Is there not room for a 3rd as yet unquantified alternative explanation?

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From a hypothetical point of view, what do you think would happen?

Shaking my head in despair.

I HATE not being believed by those who should know better.

Look around you people!

LaoDan said:

If a person with such a condition were locked in an eco-bubble. given a daily ration of, essential fats, essential amino acids, and essential micro nutrients. What would happen?

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The same as happens to those of us struggling to not put on weight on around 1200 Cal's a day.

What do you think would happen?

lucylocket61 said:

Shaking my head in despair.

I HATE not being believed by those who should know better.

Look around you people!

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Being outright dismissed is not on. Some of us are lucky, changes to our eating let us lose weight, others for whatever reason, don’t. It’s not so simple as calories, that’s clear, human bodies are unique and clever and burn energy in different ways

some conditions cause weight gain, not hard to believe that some are already fighting just to stay stable
https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-weight/nine-medical-reasons-for-putting-on-weight/
https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/healthy-weight/nine-medical-reasons-for-putting-on-weight/

Andy_Warlow said:

Wow, I never realised a lot of this.

Lastly I don’t want to sound like a ****, but I believe now anyone can lose weight.
It is an energy balance at the end of the day. Your having to much calories. Even with low carb high fat this can still happen. Don’t get much insulin resistance make it harder but not impossible.
If you are struggling, make try and a nutritionist and look at your diet by diet I mean the way you eat.
You could also try a food log and be honest. I found the amount of little trips to the kitchen in a day. With handful of food each time. That I wasn’t counting. It all adds up.

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If only it was that easy. I was given a stark choice from an endocrinologist in my early 20s after my GP sent me to him following me making myself severely ill after undertaking a vlc diet in which I only lost about 7lb in 8 weeks but caused my metabolism to go into starvation mode and begin, quite literally, to shut my body down. The choice I had was to eat the balanced diet that I had returned to and live or cut calories and risk it happening again as the problem was an unstable Thyroid. I was disappointed and asked if there was anything I could do to lose weight and his response was that he rather I didn’t. I decided to chose the former.

Andy_Warlow said:

There is a lot of factors is weight loss.

I was just using the example of of going to the kitchen. I was a nightmare with my food. I finish a meal and get seconds or a sandwich all the time. I would have take aways or eat out a couple of times a week. Washed down with serval beers.
So I had to totally changed my life style. To lose weight.

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To be perfectly honest I expect most people would lose weight if they went from eating as you say you did to a normal healthy diet however, a lot of people who eat healthily and have average portions have problems losing weight despite cutting calories due to metabolic and other problems.

lucylocket61 said:

The same as happens to those of us struggling to not put on weight on around 1200 Cal's a day.

What do you think would happen?

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I’m going to do a PSMF from May 1st until May 14th. Would you like to join in? I can post the details if you’re interested. I have no idea if it will work, I’ve done months of investigation. I can post my plans, so you can consult with your doc

OK another analogy. I found it easy to breast feed my 2nd child. Some women can't do this and I don't judge them for it, I know there are reasons why.

So @LaoDan and @Andy_Warlow let's see you do that. Ridiculous? Yes that's how you sound to those of us who can't lose weight. Try listening to us instead of judging. Try seeing that our bodies don't work like yours.

LaoDan said:

I’m going to do a PSMF from May 1st until May 14th. Would you like to join in? I can post the details if you’re interested. I have no idea if it will work, I’ve done months of investigation. I can post my plans, so you can consult with your doc

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A crazy very low cal diet to slow our metabolisms even more?!
And none of my doctors have ever been interested in my diet plans

zand said:

OK another analogy. I found it easy to breast feed my 2nd child. Some women can't do this and I don't judge them for it, I know there are reasons why.

So @LaoDan and @Andy_Warlow let's see you do that. Ridiculous? Yes that's how you sound to those of us who can't lose weight. Try listening to us instead of judging. Try seeing that our bodies don't work like yours.

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zand said:

A crazy very low cal diet to slow our metabolisms even more?!

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Low cal indeed, but with the goal of preserving the metabolism

zand said:

A crazy very low cal diet to slow our metabolisms even more?!
And none of my doctors have ever been interested in my diet plans

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I’m interested to know what you have done to increase your metabolism? I’ve been working on that for the last year. Crazy difficult

LaoDan said:

I think this is a pretty bad analogy. I’m also of the opinion that anyone can lose weight, at least from a physiological point of view.

My thought experiment. If a person with such a condition were locked in an eco-bubble. given a daily ration of, essential fats, essential amino acids, and essential micro nutrients. What would happen?

Click to expand...

Are you actually saying that starving a person proves your point that 'anyone' can lose weight? I guess physiologically you are correct, a deceased person does lose weight! We are talking about people who require and consume enough FOOD to live and keep their organs, etc going, those who cannot lose weight by eating a restricted diet that is also sufficient enough to keep them healthy and alive. I have never heard such nonsense. To all those that fall into this category, I really don't know why you are taking the time to reply to those people that are effectively calling your integrity into question.

KK123 said:

Are you actually saying that starving a person proves your point that 'anyone' can lose weight? I guess physiologically you are correct, a deceased person does lose weight! We are talking about people who DO require enough FOOD to live and keep their organs, etc going. Some people cannot lose weight by eating a restricted diet that is also sufficient enough to keep them healthy and alive. I have never heard such nonsense.

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Actually, I was a bit offended because I was working out with a guy with no legs, at the gym all last month.

BTW, have you ever read about the guy who did a doctor assisted fast, for one year?

LaoDan said:

Actually, I was a bit offended because I was working out with a guy with no legs, at the gym all last month.

BTW, have you ever read about the guy who did a doctor assisted fast, for one year?

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No and to be honest I'm not interested.

LaoDan said:

My thought experiment. If a person with such a condition were locked in an eco-bubble. given a daily ration of, essential fats, essential amino acids, and essential micro nutrients. What would happen?

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Since we do not live in bubbles your thought experiment is pointless speculation. I certainly won’t be subjecting my already compromised metabolism to such abuse.

in fact, your thought experiment reminds me of a poster on this very forum who once announced that anyone claiming they can’t lose weight should go and hang out in a concentration camp. Because they would lose weight then, wouldn’t they?


Both you and that member fail to grasp a very simple basic concept. We are human beings, with emotions, thoughts, suffering, disappointment, fatigue, diet fatigue, nutritional requirements or malnutrition, disrupted sleep, social isolation, and constantly bombarded (even here on a support forum) by people who seem to lack basic empathy.

However, I will play your pointless little game.

Put me in your eco-bubble, and what would happen?
My already super- efficient metabolism would seize the opportunity to become even more energy efficient. And I would lose a little weight.

(edited to add: of course, I would lose a fraction of the weight you would, as you sat in your next door bubble. You would have to be in a separate bubble because if we shared a bubble I would probably have killed and eaten you by the second week. Out of frustration. Or irritation. Or boredom.)

Then, after however long, I would eventually escape your bubble-torture chamber. At that point, my super efficient super cunning body would think ‘gosh! The famine is over! We MUST replenish those lost resources! Quick! Get HUNGRY. Get OBSESSED with food. Store EVERYTHING ready for the next famine.’
And eventually, after weeks/months of desperately resisting, I would cave and eat until I was satisfied (long months later, and significantly heavier).

how do I know this?

That would be from the series of fasts and vlc diets (330 cals a day) back in the 80s when these things were trendy last time.

So please, go and bubble to your hearts content. You want to mess up your metabolism? Go for it. But you will be doing it without my company.

Guys and Gals, I’m not judging, If anyone knows how difficult it is, it’s me. I’ve spent the last 10 months grinding off one pound at a time. Hours every day at the gym, running until I’m about to collapse, sacrificing meals with my family. It’s my only goal, I want to live long enough to see my children grow up.

please don’t give up, don’t tell yourself you can’t. Just keep trying

Brunneria said:

Since we do not live in bubbles your thought experiment is pointless speculation. I certainly won’t be subjecting my already compromised metabolism to such abuse.

in fact, your thought experiment reminds me of a poster on this very forum who once announced that anyone claiming they can’t lose weight should go and hang out in a concentration camp. Because they would lose weight then, wouldn’t they?


Both you and that member fail to grasp a very simple basic concept. We are human beings, with emotions, thoughts, suffering, disappointment, fatigue, diet fatigue, nutritional requirements or malnutrition, disrupted sleep, social isolation, and constantly bombarded (even here on a support forum) by people who seem to lack basic empathy.

However, I will play your pointless little game.

Put me in your eco-bubble, and what would happen?
My already super- efficient metabolism would seize the opportunity to become even more energy efficient. And I would lose a little weight.

Then, after however long, I would eventually escape your bubble-torture chamber. At that point, my super efficient super cunning body would think ‘gosh! The famine is over! We MUST replenish those lost resources! Quick! Get HUNGRY. Get OBSESSED with food. Store EVERYTHING ready for the next famine.’

how do I know this?

That would be from the series of fasts and vlc diets (330 cals a day) back in the 80s when these things were trendy last time.

So please, go and bubble to your hearts content. You want to mess up your metabolism? Go for it. But you will be doing it without my company.

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I am in a bubble.

Brunneria said:

in fact, your thought experiment reminds me of a poster on this very forum who once announced that anyone claiming they can’t lose weight should go and hang out in a concentration camp. Because they would lose weight then, wouldn’t they?

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Yes, I well remember that guy.

KK123 said:

Are you actually saying that starving a person proves your point that 'anyone' can lose weight? I guess physiologically you are correct, a deceased person does lose weight! We are talking about people who require and consume enough FOOD to live and keep their organs, etc going, those who cannot lose weight by eating a restricted diet that is also sufficient enough to keep them healthy and alive. I have never heard such nonsense. To all those that fall into this category, I really don't know why you are taking the time to reply to those people that are effectively calling your integrity into question.

Click to expand...

I guess I have stuck with this thread because I know there will be others out there like me who haven't been believed by HCPs and I want them to know they are not alone. I was shocked when I eventually found this forum and found there were others here who had suffered in the same way as me. I had genuinely thought it was only me who couldn't lose weight despite trying hard. Low carb was part of the answer and I have yet to find the other part(s)

I am not a T2 Luddite when it comes to food, I will give most stuff a try. I have stuck with a moderate lchf protocol to get my bgl down, I was carrying a bit of weight (bloat) last year, and my GP suggested that I take fluid tablets to rip it of that way.

I have a been doing a fluid restricted diet of 1.5 - 2 litres of water / fluid a day as well. I got rid of 10 kgs that way, which brought me down to a reasonable weight that I am happy with.

I do enough exercise when I am working, so did not want to go and do sessions at a overpriced health gym.