"As muscle fatty acid uptake and oxidation is increased in insulin-resistant and diabetic individuals, increased fatty acid metabolism can thus directly impair glucose metabolism in muscle. In addition, accumulation of fatty acid metabolites in muscle can impair insulin signaling," (Is this also the same as the physiological insulin resistance people experience when in ketosis?)
https://www.karger.com/Article/Fulltext/448357
I haver seen a few of these mouse studies which appear to give results that aren't consistent with what appears to work for us (T2Diabetics).
Here is one that I commented on in 'the other forum':
Another member posted:
"A ketogenic diet -- which provides 99% of calories from fat and only 1% from carbohydrates -- produces health benefits in the short term, but negative effects after about a week, Yale researchers found in a study of mice.
The results offer early indications that the keto diet could, over limited time periods, improve human health by lowering diabetes risk and inflammation. They also represent an important first step toward possible clinical trials in humans.
The keto diet has become increasingly popular as celebrities, including Gwyneth Paltrow, Lebron James, and Kim Kardashian, have touted it as a weight-loss regimen.
https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/01/200127134741.htm "
I replied:
I quote the relevant part of this and bold the key phrases, the rather strange parts I put in italics:
"A keto diet tricks the body into burning fat, said lead author Vishwa Deep Dixit of the Yale School of Medicine. When the body's glucose level is reduced due to the diet's low carbohydrate content, the body acts as if it is in a starvation state -- although it is not -- and begins burning fats instead of carbohydrates. This process in turn yields chemicals called ketone bodies as an alternative source of fuel. When the body burns ketone bodies, tissue-protective gamma delta T-cells expand throughout the body.
This reduces diabetes risk and inflammation, and improves the body's metabolism, said Dixit, the Waldemar Von Zedtwitz Professor of Comparative Medicine and of Immunobiology. After a week on the keto diet, he said, mice show a reduction in blood sugar levels and inflammation.
But when the body is in this "starving-not-starving" mode, fat storage is also happening simultaneously with fat breakdown, the researchers found. When mice continue to eat the high-fat, low-carb diet beyond one week, Dixit said, they consume more fat than they can burn, and develop diabetes and obesity."
My comments / questions:
It is important to note that where 'diabetes' is mentioned, it really should be saying Type 2 Diabetes - since this doesn't apply to other forms such as Type 1.
1. We do know that it is possible to over-eat when on a Keto 'Way Of Eating'. But surely this isn't possible on a Keto diet - the word diet implying a calorie restriction!
2. Do mice exhibit that same satiety controls such as humans and cats, or do they lack them as in dogs and bears? If they lack the satiety controls, then the 'continuing to eat high-fat, low-carb' portion of the text shows that the experiment was designed to show a poor longer-term result.
3. Do natural mice develop diabetes from eating fats - or is this just because the lab mice are genetically altered to be susceptible to diabetes?
4. Is there any evidence that humans ever develop type 2 diabetes from eating fat without carbs? All the evidence I see shows that it is due to carbohydrates.
How do you develop Insulin Resistance by eating something that lowers your Insulin? Do people with allergies get worse by avoiding that to which they are allergic to?
A. It's in mice who find it hard to be in ketosis as they haven't evolved to work that way.
B. It is really important to look at exactly what the mice were fed. The chow is often very high in seed oil which could well promote inflammation rather than healthy animals fats.
C. We're simply not mice so any conclusion drawn from the study applies to mice and not humans.
Hope that helps.. I tend to ignore anything that involves mice these days...
That does help because I forgot about those rodent studies using seed oils for their high fat experiments. Makes sense that it might cause inflammation. So eating healthy fats and the fat burning your body does when in ketosis shouldn't be causing inflammation then hopefully.
Good point !It seems pretty unlikely or we'd be inflamed most of the time especially when sleeping... which would be an odd mechanism to build health on.
Makes me laugh when these studies feed mice the exact stuff that most seasoned keto/paleo/carnivore types avoid like the plague, and then use the negative outcomes as alleged evidence of the dangers of keto/paleo/carnivore.
I know that Siobhan Huggins identified the mouse chow that was used in the most recent "keto makes mice fat" studies and it was composed of very large concentrations of seed oils. The mice are also bred to be susceptible to obesity and cancer.. makes you wonder.. I'm afraid it was on twitter and I didn't save the link..That's it, I haven't read anything that actually discloses what the diet they are fed is. It's a bit like chalk and cheese (No pun intended) when it comes to diet for two different animals where one lives a fast paced short life and another lives a much longer life.
The main reason for using mice in these studies is mice are cheap and ethics just don't apply.
I know that Siobhan Huggins identified the mouse chow that was used in the most recent "keto makes mice fat" studies and it was composed of very large concentrations of seed oils. The mice are also bred to be susceptible to obesity and cancer.. makes you wonder.. I'm afraid it was on twitter and I didn't save the link..
But a balanced diet is open to interpretation.The bottom line is even on low carb try your best to eat a balance diet.
But a balanced diet is open to interpretation.
The only things I eat are ones that my BG meter tell me don’t spike my blood sugar.
So no grains, little seeds and nuts. No legumes, no root vegetables and no fruit. For the general population that would not be considered a “balanced” diet.
But a balanced diet is open to interpretation.
The only things I eat are ones that my BG meter tell me don’t spike my blood sugar.
So no grains, little seeds and nuts. No legumes, no root vegetables and no fruit. For the general population that would not be considered a “balanced” diet.
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