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Energy For Kayaking

Discussion in 'Fitness, Exercise and Sport' started by DeejayR, Aug 8, 2018.

  1. DeejayR

    DeejayR Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    Hello again to my friends, and I hope you're able to enjoy this exceptional summer. I am after some advice on feeding for sustained exercise. I've scanned the threads here but don't understand the technical stuff and am not sure what's best for me.
    Thanks to Mrs DeeJay's enthusiasm as a canoe club instructor, I'm in the middle of a weekly sea-kayaking course, which demands sustained energy for about 2½ hours. One of the requirements of the course is that all paddlers bring a sugary snack with them for half-time, and the course leader is a GP who won't countenance any alternatives, such as LCHF, on health and safety grounds, in the same way as a person with a heart defect wouldn't be accepted.
    I've been taking a keto pseudo-bread roll with peanut butter and 90% chocolate bits, but this doesn't do the trick and since I want to finish the course I've got some protein bars with 9.4 carbs each, hoping to work off the excess glucose in the second half.
    For a pre-session supply of slow-release energy I hoped that my old favourite of groats soaked overnight and then heated with almond milk would fit the bill, but alas they now send my BS to between 9.5 and 10.5 after only an hour.
    Is there a safe compromise here?
     
  2. Safi

    Safi Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    I personally find that nothing gives me sustained energy and steady glucose levels quite like beef but then I tend to do my kayaking in calmer waters! I've also never eaten it for breakfast so there's that as well. Perhaps some beef jerky at half-time might be enough to do the trick - some are higher in sugar than others but in addition to the sugar you'll get a good hit of protein & some salt to counter dehydration.
     
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  3. Mbaker

    Mbaker Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    In your shoes I would consider reading any material / books from Volek and Phinney, or even being a bit cheeky and finding them on social networking and asking them direct - these for me are some of the best for LCHF / Keto fuelling for sport.

    I am able to train moderate cardio walking at 120 heart rate for an hour 20 and then do a 3 or 5 set medium to hard weights session fasted easily, and then without eating do another session of either cardio or weights session if I want before dinner. If you can do OMAD you could do the same and to satisfy your instructor, maybe take half an avocado or nuts, half a bar of 100% Montezuma Dark Chocolate and water with a quarter teaspoon of quality sea salt or Himalayan salt.
     
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  4. DCUKMod

    DCUKMod I reversed my Type 2 · Master
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    DeejayR - What actually is that 9.5-10.5? Is it after eating your groats, then an hour of living, or an hour of exercising? If it is the latter, could it be the strenuous exercise contributing to the rise?

    For many gentle exercise lowers blood sugars in a short space of time, but mre vigorous energy pushes the numbers up, but then they fall and can be a sustained fall later?

    I'm just trying to understand the components of the puzzle, but I might be being a bit dim!
     
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  5. Brunneria

    Brunneria Other · Guru
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    Hmm.
    Tricky.
    What kind of thing is meant by 'sugary snack'? Kendal Mint Cake or flapjack? Cocolate bar?

    My experience is as a not-very-fit-person who occasionally does quite challenging (for me) activities caused by momentary insanity while on hol.
    And in those situations, absolutely nothing beats an enormous Full English breakfast, topped up by bulletproof coffee during the Adventure. Presumably you can carry a flask of coffee with you? Energy levels stay steady, and there is no need for anything else until I fall head first into a large low carb evening meal.

    Having said that, if some plonker is going to insist that I eat 'sugary stuff' during my tea break, then there are plenty of bars out there that LOOK sugary yet yield very few carbs. Atkins Bars. PhD Bars. Kind nut bars, home made LC brownies.

    Also (from experience) there are few things that will wreck an good keto energy supply than a shot of sugar. So I would most definitely feel feebler after a sugary snack than before - but then I guess it depends on fat adaption, ketosis, activity levels and so on...

    Good luck with the course. Hope you continue to have a great time with it. :D
     
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  6. DeejayR

    DeejayR Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for all your input.
    @Safi The need for salt is new to me. Biltong looks lower in carbs, would that be ok?
    @DCUKMod : One lunchtime at home I tested 5.9 before lunch, then had 60g of pre-soaked groats which resulted in 10.5 after an hour, retested immediately at 9.5, and recorded 7.7 at two hours.*
    @Brunneria : Yes, that kind of nutri-bar, although the coaches also just hand round sweets. The session next week is no problem as it's a picnic so I'll deffo take a small flask of coffee as well as water, plus cold chicken and maybe a bratwurst sausage, tomatoes and anything green I can find on the veg plot. And nuts and seeds.
    It's only a couple of hours a week atm but next month we're on a kayaking holiday in Corfu so I need to get the basics right, since the catering will be largely out of my control.
    I start swimming lessons tomorrow. Just a precaution :nailbiting:

    * Comparison extract from Oct 2014, only testing 2 hours after meals
    8.0am (fasting) 5.0
    9.0am Breakfast: groats etc, stewed cooking apple & blackberries, seeds, nuts
    11am 6.0
    12.30pm 5.5
    12.45pm Lunch (snack): chicken in leftover tomato sauce
    2.45pm 5.0
    3.0pm Snack: avocado, cheese, tomato, home-made mayonnaise; nuts
    5.15pm 4.9
    6.15pm Tea: fish'n'chips, ketchup
    8.15pm 12.8 Too shocked to re-test!
    10.45pm 6.8
     
  7. Safi

    Safi Prediabetes · Well-Known Member

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    Yeah @DeejayR - biltong should do the trick & the bonus is you can get less chewy versions of biltong than jerky :) The need for salt varies for people who restrict carbs but I found a couple of summers ago I very slowly became dehydrated over the course of a few active months which messed a bit with my heart rate & energy levels - all easily fixed with a bit more salt. I'm guessing that sea kayaking on sunny days could really take it out of you so just something to think about. Have a glorious time in Corfu!
     
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  8. DeejayR

    DeejayR Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    OK thanks, I'm on the hunt for biltong at my local Tesco.
    And pork scratchings! :) Our butcher has slabs of scored pork skin which are great roasted with salt and broken up into bite-sized bits.
     
  9. DCUKMod

    DCUKMod I reversed my Type 2 · Master
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    DeejayR, my local Lidl stocks a Chilli Biltong which is very acceptable, and in a snack sized bag. The other flavours are very carby, but the chilli is less so.

    I must admit I rather like it, to the extent I'm considering a dehydrator to do my own.

    Enjoy your paddling holibob.
     
  10. DeejayR

    DeejayR Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    @DCUKMod mmm new things and I love Lidl's meat aisle
     
  11. Pipp

    Pipp Type 2 · Expert
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  12. DeejayR

    DeejayR Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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  13. Pipp

    Pipp Type 2 · Expert
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    That should do it, @DeejayR .
    I am impressed at the kayaking. How is life generally? You settled in the new home now? I seem to remember you were creating a new garden.
     
  14. DeejayR

    DeejayR Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    Yes thanks @Pipp .Still digging!
     
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  15. Brunneria

    Brunneria Other · Guru
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    Homemade low carb chocolate brownies are the solution to most problems. ;):D
     
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  16. Robbity

    Robbity Type 2 · Expert

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  17. Alexandra100

    Alexandra100 Prefer not to say · Well-Known Member

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  18. Brunneria

    Brunneria Other · Guru
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    Being fat adapted and in ketosis means that you have a steady, almost infinite supply of energy, with no need for carb top ups.
    https://www.dietdoctor.com/100-mile-american-record-holder-eats-almost-no-carbs
    Endurance athletes go out to race or train without needing breakfast. They certainly don’t need quick release top ups or carb loading.
     
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  19. Alexandra100

    Alexandra100 Prefer not to say · Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I understand the theory. But in that case no need for fat top ups either, which in any case could not provide any energy, but would rather if anything use energy to digest them, or would sit in the stomach undigested til after the exercise.
     
  20. Brunneria

    Brunneria Other · Guru
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    Except that, as DJ has already explained, he is required to eat something that looks like a carby snack - so a fatty snack that looks like a carby snack will fit the bill perfectly.

    Besides, we are talking about a snack, so I doubt if a small item like a nut bar, brownie or fat bomb would sit heavily.
     
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