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Fasting For Type 2's

Discussion in 'Fasting' started by Winnie53, Mar 17, 2015.

  1. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    I'm into my sixth week of the LCHF diet, and am looking for additional ways to lower my blood glucose.

    Jason Fung, M.D. is a Canadian nephrologist in Ontario, Canada who specializes in weight loss and diabetes. Two years ago, he began posting lectures on YouTube. One of the approaches he uses with patients is fasting, something I'm interested in trying myself.

    He will be one of the presenters at the 2nd annual Diabetes Summit, March 23-30. Each day, we'll have 24 hours to view that day's presentations, for free. Dr. Fung's presentation will be on fasting. Go here to learn more and to register for the Summit, again it's free... http://thediabetessummit.com/

    I've watched two of Dr. Fung's videos on YouTube so far. I find his approach to treating type 2 diabetes in his patients interesting. Here's a list of his videos...

    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=jason+fung

    In his most recent video, he's presenting to healthcare professionals during Grand Rounds at his hospital...



    I also like this video, in part because it's only 9 minutes long but also because he interviews one of his patients along with the patient's wife. They both used fasting to lose weight. The husband's blood glucose, and I believe his lipid panel, improved... :)



    Dr. Fung individualizes treatment for his patients. Fasting is done by drinking water, teas, and bone broth, with no artificial sweeteners. How long the person fasts, and at what intervals varies. In addition, patient's are seen weekly and their blood work is monitored weekly too. I'm not sure how many of his patients are following a LCHF diet. I have more questions than answers right now.

    Dr. Fung is not alone in using fasting.

    As I listened to a 2014 interview with health and fitness expert Mark Sisson, author of The Primal Blueprint, I learned that he uses Intermittent Fasting (IF). Mark suggests being on his diet for at least 3 weeks before beginning IF. Here's a link to an article on IF from his website, Mark's Daily Apple - (a link to an update for women is included at the end of the article)...

    http://www.marksdailyapple.com/health-benefits-of-intermittent-fasting/#axzz3UfR0CqiR

    Two nights ago, I took the time to read all the forum posts here related to Jason Fung. Response was neutral or reserved, one or two negative. Not sure why. Perhaps it's because his approach is new to the diabetes community and not enough is known about it yet.
     
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    #1 Winnie53, Mar 17, 2015 at 6:46 PM
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 17, 2015
  2. Spiker

    Spiker Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for all the links.

    I'm sure I have seen many positive links to Dr Fung on here.
     
  3. Lamont D

    Lamont D Reactive hypoglycemia · Master

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    It probably is because it's new!

    I fast every now and then, especially if I am a little high. But I'm weird.

    What it does is give my pancreas a rest and restores my blood glucose levels back in to the 4s mmols.

    It also gives me a break from cooking and washing dishes.

    It is not recommended for diabetics whom fasting has a detrimental effect.
     
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  4. uart

    uart Type 1.5 · Well-Known Member

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    I'm interested in this, but the above links don't seem to provide very much specific info as to how this fasting is done. Does anyone have any specific information regarding this fasting. What sort of duration and frequency? What is or is not consumed during fasting etc.
     
  5. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    uart, I'm hoping for more information from his lecture for The Diabetes Summit next week. See my above post for info on how to register. Each presentation is free to view for 24 hours. I'm not trying this until I know more too. :)
     
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  6. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    I started digging today for more information on Dr. Fung's fasting program. I found his recipe for bone broth here...

    http://intensivedietarymanagement.com/bone-broth-broth-can-cure-cold-idm-6-2/#comment-349

    From the lectures I've learned that his patients drink non-caloric liquids: water, tea, coffee, and bone broth, but no artificial sweeteners. One of his fasting patients mentioned gas at the beginning of the fast, which was addressed by drinking mineral water.

    In the comments section of his blog, Dr. Fung was specifically asked for more information about his fasting program. On March 5, 2015, he responded, "Some general information will be upcoming in the blog. We avoid specifics since there are many situations where close medical supervision is necessary." On March 10, 2015, he added, "Fasting is simply the voluntary withholding of food. Time and frequency up to you. But best to have medical supervision especially if on any medications."

    This leads me to believe that he won't be forthcoming with the specifics of how to fast at the upcoming Diabetes Summit, in future YouTube videos, or on his blog, which I understand.

    Their are interviews with patients in some of his lectures and on his website. It sounds like the first couple of days are the hardest, then there's a burst of energy which I assume is ketosis. How long patients fast initially is unknown. How intermittent fasting is done is also unknown. It likely varies. [Edit: Here's another comment from Dr. Fung... "Specific regimens are generally individualized for patients. Obviously some will need more and others less. People on medications need to be extra careful about monitoring. A commonly used regimen would be 24-36 hours of fasting 2-3 times per week. A general multivitamin can be taken if you are worried about micronutrient deficiency. For cramping, we often supplement magnesium specifically, not calcium or potassium. Epsom salt baths are often useful for cramps."]

    I suppose another option would be to go back and read the studies he references in his videos beginning in the mid-60's.

    We have a physicians who specialize in weight loss in our community. Perhaps they would be willing to provide medical supervision for patients who wish to try fasting. There's also lots of information on Intermittent Fasting on YouTube and elsewhere online. :)
     
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    #6 Winnie53, Mar 20, 2015 at 12:06 AM
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 20, 2015
  7. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    For those wishing to hear the Jason Fung, M.D. presentation, it's today. Go to http://thediabetessummit.com/ to register. It's free. We only have 24 hours to view it for free. Of the four or so presentations I've heard by him, I got the most from this presentation - (I bought all the presentations last week) - but there was not much conversation about fasting. So the plan now is to glean as much information on fasting as I can from his blog.
     
  8. Indy51

    Indy51 Type 2 · Expert

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    There are many different ways of intermittent fasting and I can understand why Dr Fung is cautious when it comes to people on medication, especially insulin and other insulin stimulating drugs. You would definitely require medical supervision for that.

    I remember reading his stuff a while back and 36 hour fasts/alternate days was one of the options given - I gather that is at the intensive end of options. Compressed eating windows, 5:2 etc are a number of different variations. If you read the patient stories, you'll get more of an idea of the various regimes followed.

    I do recall he based a lot of his regimes on Brad Pilon and recommended his book for people wanting to know more about intermittent fasting. There are various podcast interviews with Brad around the web. Brad's blog is: http://bradpilon.com/

    I'm currently trying a strict under 1200 calorie, 17-18 hour fasting compressed window variation.
     
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  9. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    Indy51, thank you for that lead. I'm going to follow up on it tomorrow night. I really, really want to try fasting. I only have 8 weeks to get my blood glucose into the normal range, and my weight and blood glucose hasn't changed in three weeks. Frustrated. :banghead:
     
  10. Indy51

    Indy51 Type 2 · Expert

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    @Winnie53 Just ran across a new interview with Brad Pilon you might find interesting:

     
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  11. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I've done some fasting recently. A 3 day fast in December and a few 1 day fasts since. It's not all that bad when you are on a LCHF diet. I usually get a liver dump between when I wake up and late morning and during the 3 day fast that virtually went away by the third day (it's back now).

    I have watched some of Dr. Fung's videos and looked at hos website and mostly I am impressed. However, I'm skeptical about the Chinese herbal supplements he advocates.
     
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  12. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    Thanks Indy! I'm so mad at myself right now. After I watched the Jason Fung lecture on The Diabetes Summit, I thought someone had posted that Dr. Fung had read a book on fasting, and the commenter gave the author's name, or something like that, but I didn't write it down. I went back to look for it yesterday, but it had been deleted. Last night I found a blog in which someone did a 21 day fast and blogged about it, but haven't gotten back to it yet. Here it is... http://personalexcellence.co/blog/fasting-series/

    Will watch the video you posted tomorrow night if I can. Hubby and I are taking a day trip tomorrow, so have to get ready. :)
     
  13. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    After snacking between meals for the last 4 days or so, I decided no snacks today. It was interesting. Got a huge energy surge in the afternoon. My thinking is that my experience will be similar to yours the first three days. What did you drink during your fast?
     
  14. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Coffee, water, and beef bone broth.
     
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  15. uart

    uart Type 1.5 · Well-Known Member

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    Thanks NoCrbs. I heard Dr Fung mention the beef bone broth on one of his videos. Did you make it yourself, and can you please elaborate on what it contains. I mean is it literally just a boiled up beef bone, or are there other ingredients?
     
  16. NoCrbs4Me

    NoCrbs4Me I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I roast them first, then cook them in a pressure cooker with water and beef broth. I add salt and pepper and a few spices. There are lots of recipes on the Internet. Just search and you can get ideas how to make your own. Or just have Knorr beef broth or something similar.
     
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  17. msmi1970

    msmi1970 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    for those who think fasting may be too tough, maybe try very low calorie intake for a few days. like NoCrbs said, if already on LCHF, it is not too difficult.
    inadvertently went on 3 days low cal, just brekky & dinner (around 800 cals) eating eggs, butter, chicken & veg. decided to continue & made it through 8 days.
    whoosh on day 3. best FBGs & random sugars of around 4.7 in many months. now a week later back on proper LCHF & the numbers are still excellent. Oh & i lost 9lbs.
     
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  18. Indy51

    Indy51 Type 2 · Expert

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  19. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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    Oooh, thanks Indy51! :)
     
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  20. Winnie53

    Winnie53 Type 2 · BANNED

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