Feedback on my readings, if possible?

KernowKeith

Active Member
Messages
38
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Other
Hi I'm fairly recently diagnosed as pre-diabetic, having asked to be tested as at the age of 65 I'd never been tested specifically for diabetes. My late mother was diagnosed with what I presume to have been Type 2 diabetes in her 70s, but we never talked about it much so don't know any details. However as a family member had been diagnosed with it in the past, I decided I ought to get tested.

In May this year, the Plasma Fasting Glucose reading was 5.7mmol/L, which was flagged as being abnormal with 'normal' being 3–5.4mmol/L.
The HbA1c level was 43mmol/mol, again flagged as high, with 'normal' said to be within the range 20–42.

Interestingly, I looked back through my records, and the last time the Plasma Fasting Glucose level was checked was as part of a general health check in July 2016 and the reading was 9.5mmol/L, but nothing was said at the time... The 'normal' range back then was stated as 3–7.8mmol/L.

My BMI is 22 – I have never weighed more than 9st 12lbs at any time and am stable at 9st 11lbs – height 5ft 6in. Weight has never been an issue, and my diet is a healthy one (no junk food, etc), plenty of veggies (my wife was a vegetarian for over 25 years). My downfall in recent years has been a lack of exercise – I'm a magazine editor and spend most working days sat at a computer (ironically, like now!). Just over three years ago, I had an angioplasty (stent) and was very good at daily exercise for the first year, then work, life etc started to muscle in and I let things slip. Recently I've been making a conscious effort to walk more and start cycling again. I've also bought a blood glucose monitor and started taking some readings. They are all over the place...

First thing in the morning, roughly half an hour after a cup of tea, readings have been 2.4–2.5mmol/L. In the afternoon, around 4.00pm, 5.7mmol/L. In the evening 2-3 hours after a meal, 7.6–8.00mmol/L.

I would welcome any feedback . I was referred to our local NHS Diabetese awareness programme, but the meetings are run by Weight Watchers and clearly aimed at losing weight, with NO mention of diabetes at all!
 

Brunneria

Guru
Retired Moderator
Messages
21,889
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Hi and welcome @KernowKeith

Here are the standard recommended ranges for diabetics in the UK. Of course you are pre-D not D, so feel free to aim lower. In fact any type 2 diabetic can aim lower. I do too. :D
https://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes_care/blood-sugar-level-ranges.html
I think it answers quite a few of your questions.

Do you get any unpleasant symptoms when your blood glucose is in the 2s in the morning? Or does it just feel like a normal morning for you?
 
  • Like
Reactions: KernowKeith

bulkbiker

BANNED
Messages
19,576
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Hi and welcome.
Your very low morning readings are interesting. Maybe try taking them very first thing before any tea as soon as you get up (or even when you wake up in bed). Some indication of what you are eating would be useful as what is generally considered "healthy" for the general population ( which is dubious in itself) might not be so healthy for a pre-diabetic.
Your HbA1c at 43 mmol/m is just over the diagnostic level for pre-diabetes so I'm guessing a few dietary tweaks could help lower than back to more "normal" levels.
This will probably be best achieved by cutting out some of the more starchy carbohydrates in your diet. But without knowing what you eat it's hard to advise.
 

KernowKeith

Active Member
Messages
38
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Other
Sorry, yes, when I say 'healthy' I mean no processed food, no fast food of any kind, no fry ups, plenty of fresh veg, etc - generally staying away from anything with high fat or salt content in deference to my arteries following my angioplasty (both my parents passed away from heart-related problems, hence my keenness not to follow the same path). However, I am now aware that some foodstuffs I relied on (home-baked bread, Weetabix, the occasional banana, for example) are bad in terms of sugar content, or the way they turn to sugar when digested.

We (my wife and I) are now looking into ways to further reduce carbs, without increasing fat or salt intake. We eat a fair bit of chicken, vegetable stir fries, (brown) pasta and brown rice dishes, omelettes etc, and sweet potato in place of regular potato. Hopefully these are steps in the right direction, along with increased exercise. I do enjoy red wine with most evening meals, I'm afraid...

As for how I feel in the morning with what now turns out to be a low blood glucose level, I guess I've always felt tired in the mornings so wasn't aware of any particular changes. I'll try taking a reading before I get up and see what that is.

Thank you both for replying – I was losing confidence thanks to the experience with the local WW sessions...
 

bulkbiker

BANNED
Messages
19,576
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
(brown) pasta and brown rice dishes, omelettes etc, and sweet potato in place of regular potato. Hopefully these are steps in the right direction

I'm afraid that many of us have found out that the colour of the starch doesn't make much of a difference your body is an equal opportunity converter of starch to glucose once ingested.
So I'd be looking at reducing the pasta and rice and sweet potato and replacing with above ground veg and more meat and fish.
 

bulkbiker

BANNED
Messages
19,576
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
the experience with the local WW sessions...

To be honest WW for your situation is unlikely to do any good whatsoever.

You will get misleading dietary info as its a repeat business model.. come to us to lose weight go off our diet put it all back on and a bit more then come back to WW again...
 

KernowKeith

Active Member
Messages
38
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Other
I came to that conclusion about WW straight away. I had no idea the local NHS diabetes awareness course was run by them!
 

Resurgam

Expert
Messages
9,849
Type of diabetes
Type 2 (in remission!)
Treatment type
Diet only
I'd advise close scrutiny of anything labelled low fat, as they are normally higher in carbs to compensate.
The advice on fat in the diet is becoming problematic, as the low fat diet appears to be of little benefit. The establishment is fighting back - I found an article on the BMJ Open site which seemed to show that age at death was higher with higher LDL - but it has been removed, presumably because it goes against the current beliefs. I'd have thought that age at death was pretty much set in stone.....
Red wine is not a problem, you'll be glad to hear - but the rice, pasta etc. will not help as they are high carb foods. Sweet potato is higher in carbs than the ordinary ones, I don't eat either.
I have lots of salads and stirfries, along with meat fish seafood eggs and cheese. I feel great.
 
  • Like
Reactions: KernowKeith

SlimLizzy

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,212
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Diet only
Dislikes
football, both the game and the culture.
Hi Keith. One easy swap is to use cauliflower rice. Simply grate it up, more or less the whole thing, bag in portions and freeze. Can be steamed in the microwave or fried with whatever flavourings you like.
Quicker than real rice as well.
Potatoes, if you can get organised enough, form resistant starch when cooked and kept in the fridge overnight. This greatly reduced their impact on Blood Glucose, but you do need to practice portion control.
One other thing you could look into, the Carbs and Cals book. Or App.
I found it really useful, when my local health practice offered no helpful advice at all.
With your positive attitude and willingness to change your diet you should get your BG levels under control fairly soon.
 

KernowKeith

Active Member
Messages
38
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Other
Well, today I forsook the usual bread, cheese etc at lunchtime and had a two-egg cheese omelette, resulting in an afternoon reading of 5.1 – the lowest of the week (6.1 Monday, 5.7 Tuesday). The evening meal was homemade pork meatballs in a tomato sauce, small portion of chickpea pasta and steamed peas and broccoli. Tonight's reading was 7.1 compared to 7.6 Monday and 8.0 last night. Baby steps in the right direction...but some way to go.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Redshank

bulkbiker

BANNED
Messages
19,576
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
2.6 mmol/L on waking, before food or drink. Why consistently so low?

Interesting question.. how old are your test strips? Check the use by date just in case.

Sounds like rather than pushing out some extra sugar to get you up in the morning your body is pushing out some extra insulin to lower it.
This may possibly be a mild Reactive Hypoglycemia case although of course we can't diagnose you here ?
I'll tag in @Brunneria and @Lamont D our resident experts on that condition.
However certainly worth reporting to your HCP's
 

KernowKeith

Active Member
Messages
38
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Other
Interesting question.. how old are your test strips? Check the use by date just in case.
However certainly worth reporting to your HCP's
Test strips are brand new with 2020 use by date.

What I also find interesting is that I had a fasting test done at the doctor's back in May which was taken at about 9.15am, having had no food since 7.30pm the night before, and no drink other than water after 9.00pm, and the reading was 5.7 mmol/L.

I'll look into Reactive Hypoglycemia... Thanks.
 

Brunneria

Guru
Retired Moderator
Messages
21,889
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
@bulkbiker Reactive Hypoglycaemia is almost always (?) usually (?) invariably (?) a reaction to food intake. Usually carbs.
It usually happens within a few (1-5 hours of eating)
By its very name it is a reaction to something.

As an example, I eat a packet of biscuits. Yum. My blood glucose rises sharply.
My body releases masses of insulin to cope with the blood glucose.
It is all a bit of an over reaction, possibly due to insulin resistance, faulty signaling and so on, but the result is that my body over produces insulin in order to get that blood glucose down as quickly as possible.
Therefore there is a bit too much insulin floating about. An over-shoot, as it were.
Therefore my blood glucose drops sharply.
Therefore my blood glucose drops too low (because my body's normal mechanisms kick in too slowly to stop the low from happening).
Then my body pumps out stress hormones and stuff to raise my blood glucose back to normal levels.

Which means that the hypo was a reaction to the whole messy situation of carbs->insulin overshoot->hypo

So, @KernowKeith unless you are eating biscuits in your sleep, or your body has some other reason for sharply rising and falling blood glucose in the wee small hours, your morning low blood glucose doesn't look anything like Reactive Hypoglycaemia to me!

However, just as none of us here can say 'this is RH!' neither can any of us say 'this is not RH!'
We have a set of forum rules, and one of them is 'thou shalt not give medical advice' so we cannot diagnose. Nor should we. That is what medical professionals are for. :)

There are other reasons for hypos and low blood glucose, including reactions to medications, other health issues, food intolerances and even what different bodies consider to be 'normal' can be a hypo for someone else. Some non-diabetics spend time in the 2s and 3s with no sign of hypos at all.

I would suggest that if you are regularly experiencing fasting levels in the 2s you should go and get checked out by your doctor, but in all honesty, I am not sure that most doctors fully understand 'normal' and non diabetic blood glucose levels, since there have been few studies done on the subject, and many, many studies done on 'abnormal' blood glucose levels.

You may find the www.bloodsugar101.com website an interesting read. :D
 

KernowKeith

Active Member
Messages
38
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Other
but in all honesty, I am not sure that most doctors fully understand 'normal' and non diabetic blood glucose levels, since there have been few studies done on the subject, and many, many studies done on 'abnormal' blood glucose levels.

You may find the www.bloodsugar101.com website an interesting read. :D

Certainly they missed the high fasting reading taken back in 2016 (9.5 mmol/L) and didn't say a word. It was only when I specifically asked to be tested this year that any interest was taken - and that by the Practice Nurse, not the GP...

The only meds I take are Statins at night, following the angioplasty in 2016. Although I understand that these increase blood sugar levels, maybe I should try giving them a miss tonight and see if it had any effect on levels in the morning.
 

bulkbiker

BANNED
Messages
19,576
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
@bulkbiker Reactive Hypoglycaemia is almost always (?) usually (?) invariably (?) a reaction to food intake. Usually carbs.
It usually happens within a few (1-5 hours of eating)
By its very name it is a reaction to something.
:D

I did just wonder if you had ever come across someone who had "negative dawn phenomenon"
 

bulkbiker

BANNED
Messages
19,576
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Be just my luck to invent something new! :)
Outliers are always more interesting.. although maybe not when you are dealing with most GP's.

Do you feel ok waking up with those sort of levels or a bit woozy or anything?
 

KernowKeith

Active Member
Messages
38
Type of diabetes
Prediabetes
Treatment type
Other
Do you feel ok waking up with those sort of levels or a bit woozy or anything?
As well as can be expected first thing in the morning! Seriously I don't feel any different to how I've always felt – if I'm off to a photoshoot up country somewhere, I'll be up at 5.00am and on the road by six, with no undue feeling of tiredness. But then I have always had some cereal before I left, and then stopped after a couple of hours for a coffee and danish (which I guess I'll have to stop eating now!). On the whole, I feel great – most of my tiredness throughout the day is attributed to taking Bisoprolol (beta blocker) to reduce blood pressure, which is now constant at around 128/78.
 

HSSS

Expert
Messages
7,465
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
As a bonus eating a lower carb way might improve your blood pressure - it does for many people- allowing a reduction in the bp meds that make you tired. Keep an eye out for it.