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I fear I have tried to fix, an already fixed system.

Discussion in 'Type 2 Diabetes' started by WorryingLots, Apr 13, 2019.

  1. WorryingLots

    WorryingLots · Newbie

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    And that I'm now going to be paying the price.
    I am 22, and had type 2 diabetes for many years, but ate correctly, exercised more and became none diabetic roundabout almost a year ago. Still suffering from Pcos however, I still tested my blood sugars, and they were in lovely 5's, and would raise to the highest a six after meals. It was lovely, but then my periods stopped, and around christmas time this year, so I decided amongst myself to adopt a keto way of eating.

    I must confess, quite an unhealthy one, as I pretty much eliminated all carbs out of my food entirely.

    I was very depressed, the type when days morphed into months and so fouth. If I was myself, I wouldn't of done so.
    Sadly, I'm pretty sure I'm now paying the price, as for the first time since Christmas I ate a bowl of pasta, and my sugars were around 14.0, two hours later.

    I had my a1c checked around two months back, and it was fine, but I fear I've unfortunately returned to type 2 diabetes since it was last checked, with no-bodies fault but my very own.

    My doctor is on holiday for another two weeks, and there's nothing I can do besides (hopefully) be tested again when she returns.

    I am fearing, and expecting the worse news, (Through no-bodies fault but my own.) and would rather like a hug if anyone is offering :/
     
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  2. EllieM

    EllieM Type 1 · Moderator
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    Well, happy to give you your first hug. :)

    Given you were diagnosed T2, this probably just means that your body can't cope with the carbs in a bowl of pasta. (Many of the T2s on here, certainly the low carbing ones, avoid pasta, rice, bread and potatoes like the plague.) I'm assuming, perhaps incorrectly, that your lovely blood sugars were happening while you were low carbing?

    a1c's are an average over 3 months, so one reading of 14 won't make any difference if you've been successfully low carbing apart from that. And if you a1c has gone up, it's not the end of the world (speaking as a T1 for 49 years who has survived some true roller coasters of glycaemic control), as you're T2 you can hopefully get things back under control by low carbing again.

    OK, some folk do successfully go completely keto, so this isn't necessarily a bad thing at all, though depression definitely is a bad thing.
    However, has your weight gone down a lot? It's very very easy for diabetics to acquire eating disorders (restrictive diets make people particularly susceptible) so if this is caused by low weight then you need to work on trying to regain weight. Personally, I skipped periods from 15 to 18 and in the end the only thing that seemed to make a difference was to gain just a little weight. Having said that, I know that missing periods can be a symptom of PCOS so I realise that weight may be completely irrelevant here.

    So, try not to worry, even if your a1c has gone up you'll be able to get it down again. Talk to your doctor about all your issues (missing periods, blood sugars, depression).

    And welcome to the diabetic forums, where hugs are always free. I'm tagging in @daisy1 to give you the intro to diabetes talk, though I suspect you already know it all.
     
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  3. Jim Lahey

    Jim Lahey I reversed my Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    Hi and welcome. If I’m reading this right, you’re saying that ketogenic eating brought your diabetes back?
     
  4. Rachox

    Rachox Type 2 (in remission!) · Moderator
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    Hi WorryingLots and welcome to the forum. Sorry you’re not in a good place at the moment, but you’ve come to the right forum for advice, support and hugs.
    If you are finding keto too difficult or depressing why not just eat a low level of carbs. I eat between 30 - 50g per day and keep my HbA1c non diabetic. I do take Metformin aswell. Is that something you’d consider as it treats both type 2 and PCOS.
    Stick around and it won’t be long til you change your screen name to WorryingLess ;)
     
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  5. bulkbiker

    bulkbiker Type 2 · Oracle

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    Hardly surprising.. you have been eating a very low carb diet for a few months and then blast your poor body with a bowl of pure starch... What did you expect it to do..?
    The reaction was entirely as I would expect and the cure is simple.. don't eat bowls of pasta.
     
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  6. BB8.HG

    BB8.HG Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    I'm offering a hug. I know it's really hard.
    I'm slightly struggling to understand what you mean by fixing a fixed system. As Jim says above, do you think that your low carbing contributed to that high pasta reading?

    When you were 'eating correctly' and your levels were in the 5s, what was your diet? Low carb or an NHS 'eat well' situation?

    Getting back on low carb seems like your best option. Easier said than done though, I know. I speak as someone who's been left spluttering in the dust of the wagon they just faceplanted off.
     
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  7. HSSS

    HSSS Type 2 · Expert

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    That’s very young for type 2! Even more so if you had it for many years. You may have had non diabetic levels. You were still diabetic - just in control or remission by diet rather than drugs. It will always (barring some scientific advances) be there, but you can always control it. That may be easier if insulin resistance has been reduced by losing visceral fat, increasing muscle etc.

    keto is exactly that, very low carbs. It is not inherently unhealthy though. Carbs are not essential. If the other components of your food gave you the nutrients required then it can be very healthy for a diabetic compared to other choices out there. Do you believe it was keto that made you depressed? Did you add fats whilst reducing carbs? And have salts?
    If it’s too rigourous for you then raise the levels a little to low carb rather than keto and see if your bgl remains acceptable.

    One bowl of pasta is not going to give you diabetic levels of hb1ac. And it’s hardly surprising that it spiked your bgl afterwards. It would most any diabetic. It’s a few hours over a 3 month average.
     
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  8. WorryingLots

    WorryingLots · Newbie

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    Firstly, thank you for the hug. :) All in all, whilst I eagerly await my doctors return, your word's have given me great comfort :)

    Ah, yes. My weight at this moment in time, is rather not the best ratio for my height. I am underweight, (and it ended up happening rather suddenly and although I have been speaking to my nurse about this matter, I shall be speaking about my doctor when she returns in two weeks time. I'm taking a stab in the dark here and am going to say, weight troubles also raise blood sugars? (But I could be wrong!)

    Oh dear! Who knows? Maybe gaining a little weight may help my pcos too :)

    That's my fear! In my way of worrying, I researched lots today, and read up somewhere that "Keto diets don't allow the body to properly use insulin, so blood sugar isn't properly controlled."

    That was somewhere on google however, and since google isn't a doctor, it's quite possible I have simply worried myself up a little more for no reason at all. I shall be speaking to my Doctor about my worries though when she returns off holiday.

    I am starting to believe just that! (That I came to the right place, it's certainly starting to feel that way.) Yes! It's something I'll be bringing up with my doctor when she returns, as it looks like a really good course of action :) I think you might be right about me eating low carbs too. And ah, I, too, hope to be renaming myself soon enough! :)

    This gave me a chuckle, Yes, I think you're right! :)

    If i'm honest, it was more "Nhs eat well.", but became rather depressed, and worried round about christmas when my periods stopped point blank, and felt like low carb was the best way to go, as low carb seems to help pcos very much. Yes, that's what I meant when I said "Trying to fix a fixed system." I was doing pretty much okay just eating well before I went onto keto.

    But looking deeper into things, since my periods stopped, maybe it was just the start of this, and just going by the nhs "eat well" wasn't doing me any good either.

    Yes! I was diagnosed at 14!
    I personally need to focus on gaining muscle! I'll be speaking to my Doctor about this the moment she comes off holiday.
    Thank you settling my mind down a little on that matter, you're right! It was only one reading, and overall my bloods are okay! :)

    I want to thank everyone whose replied to me in such a time where my heart feels like it's going to jump right out of my chest. You've all really helped me calm down a little, and till my Doctor returns, at times when I start to worry, I'll keep reading everything you've all said :)

    Thank you all!, and I think you're all lovely :)
     
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  9. Brunneria

    Brunneria Other · Guru
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    Hi and welcome!

    When we eat very low carb, our bodies get out of the habit of pumping out insulin for every snack.
    So when we dump a load of carbs into our bodies, it takes a while for our pancreas to catch up and ramp up insulin production again. Sometimes it can take days.

    So if you want to do a realistic test of how your body is capable of handling carbs nowadays, then you would need to eat carbs regularly for several days (min 3 days, maybe a week) to allow things to settle.
    http://www.cesphn.org.au/images/ansc/12_7_11_GTT_Instructions.pdf

    When you see your doctor, can I suggest that you mention your lack of periods to them?
    There are several health conditions that cause periods to cease, from losing too much weight, being very athletic, PCOS, or others. In my case my periods stopped for years (20+) and it was dismissed as weight and PCOS. Later turned out to be something quite different, and if proper investigations had been done 20 years earlier, then my life would have taken quite a different turn... so please make sure you get checked out.

    Hope that helps. :)
     
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  10. Traceymac23

    Traceymac23 Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    The hug is there.....but they come with a big flashing blue light on the words 'my periods stopped' and 'bowl of pasta'. I see from your profile that you are only 22 so periods stopping is definitely something worth taking up with your GP if you haven't already(obviously no-one expects you to divulge intimate details on here) and as others have mentioned, the big bowl of pasta after no carbs would affect you in the same way as drinking alcohol would after a lengthy abstinence.....you have lowered your tolerance/ability to cope with it in the short term.......a short slow reintroduction to a little carbs might help to re-balance you.

    I doubt very much whether you've broken anything permanently.....just knocked it a little.....easy enough fixed as it sounds like you have the knowledge?
     
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  11. Mbaker

    Mbaker Type 2 (in remission!) · Well-Known Member

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    Ok, @WorryingLots, you fell off the wagon. I have only seen 2 diabetics on this site who go back to carbs and it works (for now), they both do intensive exercise. It seems that once broken, our systems have a memory of Type 2.

    The good news you already know...this is in your control.

    Last week I went for a PB dead lift and the weight slipped out of my hands at two thirds distance, I sulked, as I had never missed a lift. I bought some cheap straps and attempted the same weight plus another 10 kgs....did it easily; this time around can you turn "lovely 5's" say into 4's - I think you can.
     
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  12. Oldvatr

    Oldvatr Type 2 · Expert

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    I saw the word Eatwell in there. I suspect that after you found you could eat a more normal diet, then you took your eye off the ball and you celebrated. I know that feeling. I am there at the moment having just earned that very freedom myself.

    But any carbs you eat that are excess to what you need will be stored as glycogen, and possibly as lipids in the liver, and if allowed to accumulate to any extent then insulin resistance will start to increase too taking you back to an unfixed system. So I blame Eatwell once again. You may find continuing with the low carb will produce positive results but it may take a month or so to see off the baddies.
     
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  13. Caeseji

    Caeseji Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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    @WorryingLots Sending hugs from me as well, I know how hard it is being diagnosed so young but you can get back on this wagon and keep striving for a better tomorrow. Keep it up with the low carb and like that's been already said you can blame all the high numbers on that pasta. We all have our moments of weakness but knowing that we have the strength to turn it around again is what is important.
     
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  14. daisy1

    daisy1 Type 2 · Legend

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    @WorryingLots
    Hello and welcome to the Forum :) Here is the Basic Information we give to new members and I hope you will find it both interesting and helpful.

    BASIC INFORMATION FOR NEW MEMBERS

    Diabetes is the general term to describe people who have blood that is sweeter than normal. A number of different types of diabetes exist.

    A diagnosis of diabetes tends to be a big shock for most of us. It’s far from the end of the world though and on this forum you'll find well over 147,000 people who are demonstrating this.

    On the forum we have found that with the number of new people being diagnosed with diabetes each day, sometimes the NHS is not being able to give all the advice it would perhaps like to deliver - particularly with regards to people with type 2 diabetes.

    The role of carbohydrate

    Carbohydrates are a factor in diabetes because they ultimately break down into sugar (glucose) within our blood. We then need enough insulin to either convert the blood sugar into energy for our body, or to store the blood sugar as body fat.

    If the amount of carbohydrate we take in is more than our body’s own (or injected) insulin can cope with, then our blood sugar will rise.

    The bad news

    Research indicates that raised blood sugar levels over a period of years can lead to organ damage, commonly referred to as diabetic complications.

    The good news

    People on the forum here have shown that there is plenty of opportunity to keep blood sugar levels from going too high. It’s a daily task but it’s within our reach and it’s well worth the effort.

    Controlling your carbs

    The info below is primarily aimed at people with type 2 diabetes, however, it may also be of benefit for other types of diabetes as well.

    There are two approaches to controlling your carbs:

    • Reduce your carbohydrate intake
    • Choose ‘better’ carbohydrates
    Reduce your carbohydrates

    A large number of people on this forum have chosen to reduce the amount of carbohydrates they eat as they have found this to be an effective way of improving (lowering) their blood sugar levels.

    The carbohydrates which tend to have the most pronounced effect on blood sugar levels tend to be starchy carbohydrates such as rice, pasta, bread, potatoes and similar root vegetables, flour based products (pastry, cakes, biscuits, battered food etc) and certain fruits.

    Choosing better carbohydrates

    The low glycaemic index diet is often favoured by healthcare professionals but some people with diabetes find that low GI does not help their blood sugar enough and may wish to cut out these foods altogether.

    Read more on carbohydrates and diabetes.

    Over 145,000 people have taken part in the Low Carb Program - a 10 week structured education course that is helping people lose weight and reduce medication dependency by explaining the science behind carbs, insulin and GI.

    Eating what works for you

    Different people respond differently to different types of food. What works for one person may not work so well for another. The best way to see which foods are working for you is to test your blood sugar with a glucose meter.

    To be able to see what effect a particular type of food or meal has on your blood sugar is to do a test before the meal and then test after the meal. A test 2 hours after the meal gives a good idea of how your body has reacted to the meal.

    The blood sugar ranges recommended by NICE are as follows:

    Blood glucose ranges for type 2 diabetes
    • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
    • 2 hours after meals: under 8.5 mmol/l
    Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (adults)
    • Before meals: 4 to 7 mmol/l
    • 2 hours after meals: under 9 mmol/l
    Blood glucose ranges for type 1 diabetes (children)
    • Before meals: 4 to 8 mmol/l
    • 2 hours after meals: under 10 mmol/l
    However, those that are able to, may wish to keep blood sugar levels below the NICE after meal targets.

    Access to blood glucose test strips

    The NICE guidelines suggest that people newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes should be offered:

    • structured education to every person and/or their carer at and around the time of diagnosis, with annual reinforcement and review
    • self-monitoring of plasma glucose to a person newly diagnosed with type 2 diabetes only as an integral part of his or her self-management education

    Therefore both structured education and self-monitoring of blood glucose should be offered to people with type 2 diabetes. Read more on getting access to blood glucose testing supplies.

    You may also be interested to read questions to ask at a diabetic clinic.

    Note: This post has been edited from Sue/Ken's post to include up to date information.
     
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