minimum working temperature

[smckay]

Hi I'm working in a pharmaceutical company where the workplace temperature can go down to 16.4°C, now I'm type 2 diabetic and constantly feeling cold and have been told they can't turn the temperature up because other departments will get to hot.is this acceptable or am I in my rights to demand it be adjusted.

 

[Rokaab]

As far as I can tell in the UK its 16C (for non-strenuous work)

Not sure if its actually a law mind, may just well be suggested, but 16.4 is technically above that anyway.
You could ask them but not sure its a right to demand

 

[TheSecretCarbAddict]

In the UK diabetes can be classed as an unseen disability and you could potentially ask for a reasonable adjustment to your working conditions. This probably will assume that you have declared your health condition to your employer and require agreement with your employer on what reasonable looks like.

 

[ElenaP]

Hi I'm working in a pharmaceutical company where the workplace temperature can go down to 16.4°C, now I'm type 2 diabetic and constantly feeling cold and have been told they can't turn the temperature up because other departments will get to hot.is this acceptable or am I in my rights to demand it be adjusted.

I think the easiest solution would be for you to dress appropriately for the condition. Just put thermal underwear in your bag before leaving for work, and put the thermal vest/pants under your clothes once you get to your place of work. That will make you comfortable.

 

[lovinglife]

I doubt very much that this would be considered a reasonable adjustment- 16 deg is a comfortable temperature for working, dressing appropriately for yourself like @ElenaP suggests would probably be the easiest solution

 

[mfactor]

In the UK diabetes can be classed as an unseen disability and you could potentially ask for a reasonable adjustment to your working conditions. This probably will assume that you have declared your health condition to your employer and require agreement with your employer on what reasonable looks like.

Yes you can ask, but as the temp would effect others , they can and probably will refuse, , you might get them to pay for some nice cold weather clothing tho.

 

[mfactor]

I think the easiest solution would be for you to dress appropriately for the condition. Just put thermal underwear in your bag before leaving for work, and put the thermal vest/pants under your clothes once you get to your place of work. That will make you comfortable.

Yep I run hot, another side effect from diabetes, worked in a school (caretaker) where the temp is set quite high, no way could I have asked them to turn it down and freeze the other 1000 teachers and staff..

Mind you gave my boss the shudders when she looked out at me in a T-Shirt at minus 2 ......in the snow lol

 

[mfactor]

As far as I can tell in the UK its 16C (for non-strenuous work) View attachment 69132
Not sure if its actually a law mind, may just well be suggested, but 16.4 is technically above that anyway.
You could ask them but not sure its a right to demand

There is no legal maximum or minimum working temperature. But by law, employers have a 'duty of care' to make sure working temperatures are reasonable for their staff. This includes at the workplace and working from home.

I often drove my bus at zero degrees or less (half the heaters did not work and the other half were lukewarm) the boss was ok tho , would buy us thermal socks , legging etc

 

[AloeSvea]

This just happens to be one of my favourite subjects! Many thanks @smckay, for bringing this topic up - ie the minimum temperature for comfort.

And yeah - we have so many health considerations, and our immune system and respiratory health in covid times for sure (remembering that when Covid first hit, folks with diabetes dropped like flies...) is a precious thing. We like to nurture it, I would say, for the love of life (let alone comfort).

My understanding that the minimum temperature for comfort and human health was actually 18 degrees celcius. But most folks like it between 19 and 23, where on that scale is a personal preference thing. 21 degrees is commonly nominated for the sweet point.

Re the health factor - From the World Health Organisation -" Cold and damp houses and health The World Health Organization recommends a minimum indoor temperature of 18°C, or 20°C for houses with young children, elderly people or ill people. Damp and mouldy housing can affect health in several ways, particularly respiratory health." There is a document available online giving the rationales.

I don't understand a workplace, or governments for that matter, that don't want their populations to be comfortable and as healthy as possible in winter, as comfort translates to productivity, and more robust immune systems.

 

[lovinglife]

There is no legal maximum or minimum working temperature. But by law, employers have a 'duty of care' to make sure working temperatures are reasonable for their staff. This includes at the workplace and working from home.

I often drove my bus at zero degrees or less (half the heaters did not work and the other half were lukewarm) the boss was ok tho , would buy us thermal socks , legging etc

I agree I have worked in kitchens, bakeries- cold room areas - there is no legal lower temp, the legal high temp is quite high - can’t remember what it is - in the cold areas we were supplied with thermal fingerless gloves & thermals, in the high heat areas we were provided iced drinks and t shirts, in one kitchen we use to get a drink of squash every hour and a salt tablet after 3 hrs working!

 

[Antje77]

Hi I'm working in a pharmaceutical company where the workplace temperature can go down to 16.4°C, now I'm type 2 diabetic and constantly feeling cold and have been told they can't turn the temperature up because other departments will get to hot.is this acceptable or am I in my rights to demand it be adjusted.

Are you sure that feeling constantly cold is caused by your diabetes?
I have diabetes and I'd love to work in a 16 °C environment or colder, it's my preferred temperature at home while doing nothing.

I second getting some proper clothing to keep you warm, and possibly your workplace will be willing to provide you with some.

 

[In Response]

remembering that when Covid first hit, folks with diabetes dropped like flies..

The scientists soon realised the risk was if you had high BG. People with well managed diabetes were no more likely to die of covid.
My understanding is that the reason we are entitled to autumn covid jabs is the same as the reason why we are entitled to flu jabs - we are no more likely to get ill but, if we do, it will make it harder to manage our diabetes.

 

[AndBreathe]

Hi I'm working in a pharmaceutical company where the workplace temperature can go down to 16.4°C, now I'm type 2 diabetic and constantly feeling cold and have been told they can't turn the temperature up because other departments will get to hot.is this acceptable or am I in my rights to demand it be adjusted.

I doubt very much you can demand they raise the temperature. I imagine they may even have an argument that higher temperatures could impact the storage of their product (pharmaceuticals).

If anything, you may have a scant case for thermals, a coat or such likes, but you'd have to be doing something for yourself too.

If you are constantly cold, it could be worthwhile having some bloods done. Low thyroid hormones can cause tricky temperature regulation. In fact, feeling the cold was my primary symptom.

 

[KennyA]

Hi I'm working in a pharmaceutical company where the workplace temperature can go down to 16.4°C, now I'm type 2 diabetic and constantly feeling cold and have been told they can't turn the temperature up because other departments will get to hot.is this acceptable or am I in my rights to demand it be adjusted.

I don't think you have any such "right to demand it be adjusted". The most you might be able to do is ask your employer to make a "reasonable adjustment". The employer might well believe that it would not be "reasonable" to raise the temperature whether because of other employees or because the product requires it. Testing whether it was reasonable or not (if disputed) would need an employment tribunal. They would look at other possibilities - eg putting a fleece jacket on.

There's sometimes an assumption that everything is diabetes-related...not everything is.

 

[AloeSvea]

The scientists soon realised the risk was if you had high BG. People with well managed diabetes were no more likely to die of covid.
My understanding is that the reason we are entitled to autumn covid jabs is the same as the reason why we are entitled to flu jabs - we are no more likely to get ill but, if we do, it will make it harder to manage our diabetes.

My understanding is it's immune system related. Around 30% of the Italians dying of Covid in the European first wave had diabetes.

Hence diabetes being a big alert on the 'pre-existing conditions' list.

I researched this at the time, have no idea where that material is. But I assume this can be checked online fairly easily. I am as always very happy to be corrected.

I have quoted this to medical professionals in my own home country ever since and have never been contradicted. But, yes, very happy to be wrong! .

 

[AloeSvea]

I doubt very much you can demand they raise the temperature. I imagine they may even have an argument that higher temperatures could impact the storage of their product (pharmaceuticals).

If anything, you may have a scant case for thermals, a coat or such likes, but you'd have to be doing something for yourself too.

If you are constantly cold, it could be worthwhile having some bloods done. Low thyroid hormones can cause tricky temperature regulation. In fact, feeling the cold was my primary symptom.

My understanding is it is part of being a normal animal to feel the cold in cold conditions. At least where discomfort is experienced. Not a sign of illness or being damaged. To be sedentary in 16 degrees - feeling cold would be a normal response. It's not freezing by any means! But it is less than comfortable.

And we are not even talking OECD countries where citizens die of the cold (my own home country is one of them), because warming houses and work places, schools, shops, places of recreation etc, is not budgeted appropriately for and routinely under-heat during winter/cold months, due to lack of household funds to do so, workplace budgeting issues, Govt tolerance for this, profit principle etc.

I believe the UK is one of those OECD countries?

 

[KennyA]

My understanding is it's immune system related. Around 30% of the Italians dying of Covid in the European first wave had diabetes.

Hence diabetes being a big alert on the 'pre-existing conditions' list.

I researched this at the time, have no idea where that material is. But I assume this can be checked online fairly easily. I am as always very happy to be corrected.

I have quoted this to medical professionals in my own home country ever since and have never been contradicted. But, yes, very happy to be wrong! .

I think the point is was it the fact of an extant diagnosis of (t2) diabetes, or was it because the diabetes was uncontrolled, with high BGs, morbid obesity, various co-morbidities etc? Most of the deaths have been of people over the age of 80, and it is currently (IIRC) more likely than not that people over the age of 80 will have T2. So - is it the age, or the diabetes, or a combination, or another factor that is the main driver?

 

[AloeSvea]

Hi @KennyA. Ah! I thought there was no question about folks with chronic conditions and compromised immunity being more vulnerable to covid? (Or any viral threat etc etc). I didn't know it was about obesity levels. Yes, to more predominant in the elderly, but chronic conditions, diabetes in particular, was an 'alert' status all on its lonesome, at least it was in Aotearoa/NZ. And in Sweden, the two countries I know well. (And interesting for their opposite way of dealing with the pandemic, due to geo-political factors.)

 

[KennyA]

Hi @KennyA. Ah! I thought there was no question about folks with chronic conditions and compromised immunity being more vulnerable to covid? (Or any viral threat etc etc). I didn't know it was about obesity levels. Yes, to more predominant in the elderly, but chronic conditions, diabetes in particular, was an 'alert' status all on its lonesome, at least it was in Aotearoa/NZ. And in Sweden, the two countries I know well. (And interesting for their opposite way of dealing with the pandemic, due to geo-political factors.)

We are at risk of totally derailing this thread - want to go to PM?

 

[AloeSvea]

Sure!