• Guest - w'd love to know what you think about the forum! Take the 2025 Survey »

Moronic Newbie Questions...

Once again, thank you all for the great advice (and the humour!)

I feel way better than I did when I posted the questions
Click to expand...

The humour comes for free.
The advice you'll get invoiced for at the end of each calendar month.
I hear Xyzzy and Grazer come a bit expensive :problem:

Not feeling better now, are we ? :lol:

Geoff
 
Just give Grazer some grass and xyzzy some research papers and they'll both be in clover. :thumbup:

Mary x
 
xyzzy said:
David

A lot of this really is counter-intuitive and goes against what most people have been told is a healthy diet. Now the problem is before you were T2D it probably was relatively healthy advice but not any more.

It really isn't just about sugar. Its about carbs. Sugar is just one kind of really powerful sort of carbs but other carbs do just as much damage. What I suggest you do is what I did. Rumage through all the stuff you have in your cupboards and fridge and look at the label on the backs of all the packets. The figure you need to pay attention to is the one called "Total Carbohydrate" Next to it will usually be a number which is how much carbohydrate in grams that stuff has per 100 grams of weight of that stuff. Get yourself an idea of the numbers associated with different kinds of food so for example:

Rice is usually around 75 / 100
Pasta is usually around 75 / 100

Chicken is 0 / 100
Cheddar Cheese is 0.1 / 100
An Egg is 0.3 / 100

Frozen mixed veg 5 / 100
Plain yoghurt 7 / 100
Strawberry yoghurt 14 / 100
Strawberries 4 / 100


So three quarters of rice IS carbs very, very bad for a diabetic as is pasta. You'll find potatoes, most bread and most breakfast cereals are in the same league which is why I and everyone else will tell you to cut them right down. Some of us have cut them right out.

Chicken contains no carbs, brilliant!
Cheese is pretty much no carbs, brilliant!
Eggs are like cheese, brilliant!

Yoghurt, veg, "berries" have relatively low carbs but have some.

Semi skimmed milk has more carbs than full fat milk - :***: lots of members drink the full fat stuff! I still do semi skimmed though.
Same thing applies to yoghurts. Full fat yoghurt has less carbs than the low fat stuff. The reason? When they take the fat of of stuff they have to replace it with something. That something is usually carb based.

Next I suggest you just weigh out straight from the packet 25g or 1oz of plain white rice. Not a lot is it? That's how much rice I can tolerate without my levels going dangerous. Swap that for brown basmati rice and I can double the amount. Still not a lot though. I found out from other members that my tolerance to carbs is quite low but even the hardy ones can probably only get away with twice that amount of rice or pasta as I can which is still loads less than you were eating I bet.

I admit as a newly diagnosed on this forum you are putting a hell of a lot of trust in non professionals who tell you what you should be eating. My reply to you is quite straightforward. On December 8th 2011 I did my first test it came back as 21.7. Yesterday my highest reading was 5.2. On December 22nd 2011 my HbA1c was 11.3% on April 20th 2012 it was 5.3% a 6% drop in 3 months. I am not the only one to get these kind of results loads of forum members have from way before my time.

When I started I took the view that the important think was to normalise my levels and to do that I ripped up the book on healthy eating for a couple months. I ate bacon, egg and mushroom fry-ups most days, stuffed so much cheese I grew whiskers, ate omelettes till I was sick of the sight of an egg but day by day my levels came down and miraculously at the same time as eating all this unhealthy stuff I started to lose loads of weight. In 4 months I've dropped 3 stone and 8 inches off my waist measurement. The crunch for me came in April when I not only had the new HbA1c done but also a retest for cholesterol. Needn't have worried despite all those evil fats I'd eaten then, for the first time in years, my cholesterol levels were normal and my good cholesterol had increased dramatically.

Like many members I had real problems convincing my dsn that what I was doing wasn't insane but give her credit she said when she saw my 3 month results she was speechless. In fact she was far more impressed with my cholesterol results than she was with my blood levels. She was so impressed she insisted she booked a double end of the day appointment with the practice specialist diabetic gp so I could tell him what I'd done.

So without wishing to sound a real pain. Here I sit with my 5.3% HbA1c, normal cholesterol and a BMI back in the normal range just under 20 weeks further down the T2D road than you are now. 20 weeks not a long time but that 20 weeks has undoubtedly saved my life.
Click to expand...

Very clear sound advice xyzzy, I read your posts with gusto and they drive and inspire me, you never falter with the clarity and concise information just what a newly diagnosed Diabetic needs. why don't you put all this info on a single thread.
 
In response to above, sound advice. I have just cut mine to around 25-30 grams of carbs a day to be sure. I have eggs for breakfast or cheese and ham or berry's with cream and yoghurt. and keep to meat and salad rest of day with a few Almonds as a snack if I get the sweety craving, may have pepperami or Spanish spicy sausage with cheese for supper if I am still hungry, its working Ok, but from full blown carb monster to above, I really never thought I would manage it, However If I doubt my commitment to this diet I revert back to forum and see it works and it works and it keeps on working, just throw in the exercise and bingo recipe for success. So my advise would be try it. As alien as it is to all the diet advice you are told by NHS, and weight loss programmes, at the end of the Day it's your life and your Body.
 
Hi David, and welcome to the mad house! A sense of humour is essential - and we're most of us old enough to know better! :wink:

I'm a very low carber because I have a lot of weight to lose. My diet is a Sticky Thread on the Low-carb Forum called Viv's Modified Atkins Diet. I wouldn't necessarily advise you to go as low as me (and several others) - less than 30g of carb per day. Have a look, though. It's a good basic list of low-carb foods, and you can always add on more Low GI carbs from a carb-counter book or app until you reach the level you want to aim for.

There are several good books. One is Jean (?) Ruhls' Blood Sugar 101 - written by an American so the figures are different, but she has a converter (I think!), and tells it like it is. I like Atkins Diabetes Revolution by M C Vernon and J A Eberstein, which is based on the late Dr Atkins' work. Also American. I find it readable, and a good explanation of Type 2. Very good for low-carbing.

Please don't ever be afraid to ask questions. There's no such thing as a silly question on here. We've all been newbies once, and there's an awful lot to learn.

Let us now how you go on. :D

Viv 8)
 
RoyG said:
Very clear sound advice xyzzy, I read your posts with gusto and they drive and inspire me, you never falter with the clarity and concise information just what a newly diagnosed Diabetic needs. why don't you put all this info on a single thread.
Click to expand...

Roy like I said to you the other day sometimes it pays to be angry and tonight is one of those nights. I will write my reply based on how I feel at the moment which is well pi**ed off.

When you joined and I (or Grazer or Viv or whoever) told you what helped us or when other T2's like us then came in and backed us up to re-enforce our initial message to you we are just about "tolerated" in doing so. It's rightly frowned upon to have an argument on a thread a any new member starts it's not "etiquette" but other threads well they're fair game.

Remember Roy I've only been here 5 months others have been trying to put the same message over for years and those same voices have opposed that message all the way despite all the evidence from not just forum members overjoyed to get their life back but also increasingly from research around the world that says what we advocate works and works well for the average newly diagnosed T2.

When we try and move the debate on in anyway... well you can see what happens. If we put all our advise in one thread it would just get the normal troll and trash treatment as we all saw earlier. The thread would get locked or taken down, it happens nearly every time in the end. Like I said earlier I don't understand what motivates these people and they never have any positive criticism or ideas. They can see from mine and other T2's sigs how well we do. Why they constantly try and stop us get our self respect back and our lives sorted out is beyond me.

So that's the honest reason Roy why my advice (and others like me) isn't in it's own thread and unless the Admin team ban me I'm not going to stop pushing that message as it saves lives and limbs something these people seem to ignore.

Right I'm off to help carilina some more.
 
xyzzy said:
RoyG said:
Very clear sound advice xyzzy, I read your posts with gusto and they drive and inspire me, you never falter with the clarity and concise information just what a newly diagnosed Diabetic needs. why don't you put all this info on a single thread.
Click to expand...

Roy like I said to you the other day sometimes it pays to be angry and tonight is one of those nights. I will write my reply based on how I feel at the moment which is well pi**ed off.

When you joined and I (or Grazer or Viv or whoever) told you what helped us or when other T2's like us then came in and backed us up to re-enforce our initial message to you we are just about "tolerated" in doing so. It's rightly frowned upon to have an argument on a thread a any new member starts it's not "etiquette" but other threads well they're fair game.

Remember Roy I've only been here 5 months others have been trying to put the same message over for years and those same voices have opposed that message all the way despite all the evidence from not just forum members overjoyed to get their life back but also increasingly from research around the world that says what we advocate works and works well for the average newly diagnosed T2.

When we try and move the debate on in anyway... well you can see what happens. If we put all our advise in one thread it would just get the normal troll and trash treatment as we all saw earlier. The thread would get locked or taken down, it happens nearly every time in the end. Like I said earlier I don't understand what motivates these people and they never have any positive criticism or ideas. They can see from mine and other T2's sigs how well we do. Why they constantly try and stop us get our self respect back and our lives sorted out is beyond me.

So that's the honest reason Roy why my advice (and others like me) isn't in it's own thread and unless the Admin team ban me I'm not going to stop pushing that message as it saves lives and limbs something these people seem to ignore.

Right I'm off to help carilina some more.
Click to expand...



BRAVO!!! In my opinion it's about time people stood up and said what you have Steve. MANY of us here feel exactly the same way as you. Thank you for being a fantastic voice for so many people on this forum.

Joanna.
 
Hmmmm, interesting I am new on this forum, and have always taken the notion that there is always more than one way to skin a cat, Above comments being correct, and I cannot be sure one way or the other as to it's credence, surely yours and others with the same opinion should not be discredited or treated with any more disdain than any other method as to how to get things ticking along nicely.
I happened to be given that daft diet sheet, and from the off thought something was just not right in what A/ the information I was given by PN and B/ what was written on it, sort of contradicted itself. Now I am no expert nor would I ever profess to knowing more than my doctor or the trained professionals who will see me, to date being treated as an Idiot and being told I will make myself paranoid if I use a blood test meter does not seem conducive to good care, but what I also want to know is, is it correct information and is it up to date information, (not so) and I am seeing the holes in it. As for me, I look at as much evidence and other information as possible before making my own "informed opinion" Now taking that on-board.
I can see by the people on here that Low carb is working, and I myself should see the results of my labour over a period of time, if it does not happen then try a different route, again not the end of the world. But I would say to any scoffers, free speech is a right, and everybody's opinion matters, or do you have a closed shop where anybody who strays from the straight and narrow is vilified and cast out. In a nutshell it is down to the person reading the advice to make the decision and their own "informed opinion" not the moderator. So rock on you guy's and give you experience and information to whom ever wants to read it, if they don't like it click off!!!

In addition to above I have had the same old rubbish regarding E-Cigs and the validity of a safer way to quitting both with my own doctor and NHS stop smoking practices. Argument against being that E-cigs have not been tested, I think we all know the answer to it, if a product has a 70% success rate and the tried and trusted method only has 10% success rate, Then common sense dictates, try the new method and test it. but no they prefer to try and ban them. personally I had years of trying to quit the evil weed and found the E-Cig to be my life saver, Once I tried one I never touched another cigarette 21/2 years now. Ignorance and lack of will can be are own worst enemy's my friends.
 
Well Roy I've said my piece. Like you I don't take things at face value and like to do my own research. Now if you disagree with something because you think something else applies and have an informed debate with me that's fine. We might debate back and forth and it might get heated but as you say that's fine to. However if you put up your argument and my response was not to argue the detail or show counter examples but simply to post back aggressive, personal, bullying or offensive posts JUST to get the debate stopped by FORCING the moderators take the thread down out of common decency and do that time after time is that fine too? Now if this was a non health related forum then maybe just maybe that kind of trick might be excusable in some peoples eyes now and again but when you are dealing with peoples lives well words fail me.
 
Hi All,
I hope you don't mind me joining you as I'm not diabetic? I was diagnosed with impaired glucose tolerance at the beginning of the year and stumbled across your forum when looking for more information. My GP advised me that a low GI diet had proved beneficial for many pre diabetics and gave me a guide which listed most fruit and juices, pulses, wholegrain and multigrain bread, durum wheat pasta, noodles and brown rice, porridge, sugar free muesli and bran flakes as low GI leading me to the assumption that they were safe to eat! She also prescribed statins and said these were for life.

During an eye test my optician struggled to get a reading and said it could be down to sugar levels not being stable. This didn't seem to improve even after I'd been relatively good (or so I thought) for a few weeks. Went to see another GP as wanted second opinion about the statins. Although she didn't think the unstable prescription was down to sugars she did refer me to an opthamologist and also said that I could try coming off the statins if my repeat blood tests in September indicated an improvement. Saw the opthamologist on Thursday who thinks my problem is down to a combination of factors - very complex prescription; very early stage of cataracts (causes focusing issues before clouding shows) and... unstable sugar levels!!! He runs a diabetes eye clinic and is all for testing - can't get control if you don't know what affects you. I can't see the GP until 30th but am seriously debating biting the bullet and buying my own monitor. My main concern though is how to dispose of the lancets? In the meantime, I've taken on board a lot of the information you've shared. I'm trying to keep carbs around 150g spread evenly throughout the day. When I start monitoring this should at least give me a base from which to work.

If I'm going to need to test regularly to see what affects my blood sugar and, therefore, my sight then it seems logical that any diabetic also needs to test and the means for doing so should be provided.

Many thanks for the easy to understand information.
 
Hello Dawn and welcome.

Low GI is a good method and 150g is a reasonable place to start from. Many of us will reduce carbs because that seems to make the most difference but then use GI principles on things like the starchy foods that are left as that will make things even better. Like you say if you get a meter you will be able to then fine tune your daily carb intake so that you know you are safe.

Take care
 
xyzzy I would say that bullying a point is not conducive to educating or enlightening, the Idea would be to offer informed clear advice with pointers as to where you took that advice from, as you tend to do along with every one else who offers advice. Again it really is down to the other party to use that information to make their own decisions, often the question is asked out of lack of understanding, poor dissemination of initial advice, confusion and worry. As to should the post be removed I would think that is down to the moderators stand, as to the tone of the argument being debated, and the rules that apply to that particular forum.
That is the sit on the fence answer.
 
Roy this is the thread I started that roughly does what you are suggesting. It shows where I got my info from and my philosophy. It took blood sweat and tears to keep it running...

http://www.diabetes.co.uk/diabetes-forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=28402

I never claim my way is the only way and I know others would like to do similar threads which but forward similar but subtly different views on the low carb message.
 
Hi Dawnb64

If you do go down the line of paying for your own monitoring, enquire about disposing of the lancets with your doctor. Not only will the GP realise you're serious, s/he may even provide you with a sharps box, to exchange for a fresh one whenever you bring it in.

I use the same lancet until it starts hurting or I start bruising, in fact I'm still on the sharps box issued 16 Dec 2010 :shock: , and on my first prescription of lancets. As long as it's just you using them, I personally feel there's no need to worry. Of course, if you test anyone else, change the lancet before and after.

Failing any help from your surgery, ask at your local pharmacy. In my experience the pharmacists are usually falling over themselves to help - they are among the highest-trained and most knowledgeable HCPs, and they love to answer questions! Ours is always my first port of call if I have problems with medication - even though my drugs are dispensed by the surgery!

Viv 8)
 
Back
Top