Really confused

I'm afraid that all and any carbohydrates are likely to send your blood sugars through the roof if you are recently diagnosed as you have seen from the weetabix and oat juice.
I'd agree that being vegan is very hard and for most doesn't really help with blood sugar control either but cutting right back on carbohydrate consumption is likely to have far better results.

Michaelsnny said:

Hi thanx what I'm trying to understand is it the rise from 5.2 to 11.7 that makes you diabetic is their a set rise from what you started at not sure I'm making sence sorry

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Well it shows that you had a "bad" reaction to the carbs in the Weetabix. In the UK the usual diagnostic test is called an HbA1c which shows "average" level of your blood sugar over the past 2-3 months. It is usually expressed in the units mmol/mol or sometime in percentage this can be converted to an average level of blood sugar on mmol/litre which is what your home glucose monitor is measuring.
Which country do you live in as sometimes diagnosis is done by different measures.

We’re you vegan before or are you trying it because you think it might improve your situation?

Michaelsnny said:

Hi thanx what I'm trying to understand is it the rise from 5.2 to 11.7 that makes you diabetic is their a set rise from what you started at not sure I'm making sence sorry

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As bulkbiker says the rise isn’t the way they diagnose diabetes but it is a clear sign that you have glucose dysfunction or diabetes in your case. A non diabetic wouldn’t have that sort of rise as they wouldn’t have the dysfunction. So we manage our dysfunction.

HSSS said:

As bulkbiker says the rise isn’t the way they diagnose diabetes but it is a clear sign that you have glucose dysfunction or diabetes in your case. A non diabetic wouldn’t have that sort of rise as they wouldn’t have the dysfunction. So we manage our dysfunction.

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Not disagreeing with your assessment, but non diabetics can and do get rises of even higher than the levels quoted, obviously depending on carb intake, portion size, insulin resistance, insulin response and even more importantly, intolerance to certain foods.

That is why a hba1c test is the clinical test used to diagnose T2, and prediabetes.
Breakfast wheat biscuits are a bad dietary example, especially for T2, because of the wheat, production sugars, production additives and because of the lactose, milk!

It's not the rise that makes you diabetic, it's your being diabetic that makes your glucose rise so much. Your weetabix is high in carbohydrates, as are mosr breakfast cereals and as such will push up your blood glucose. You don't have to adopt a vegan diet, though some folk do. All you need to do is to eat low carb foods and these include meat, fish and fowl in various guises. You can add eggs and cheese too without much if any imapact on glucose levels.

Lamont D said:

but non diabetics can and do get rises of even higher than the levels quoted, obviously depending on carb intake, portion size, insulin resistance, insulin response and even more importantly, intolerance to certain foods.

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Fair point. I was perhaps over simplifying, seeing as the op is a diagnosed type 2, in the effort to make a point. I was trying to say what Miahara said much more clearly.

Hello @Michaelsnny, and welcome to the forum.
Although an omnivore I do enjoy the salads and stirfries I can eat and still keep my blood glucose in the normal range. I roast veges too, but try to stick to things which are low in carb content.
I eat a wide variety of different plant parts - celeriac sweet pepper cucumber radish beetroot celery tomato beansprouts, small amounts of peas and runner/french beans, turnip swede, lots of herbs, bags of mixed salad, cauliflower cabbage sprouts, small amounts of carrot and parsnip. I can only eat an absolute maximum of 50 gm of cabs a day, usually I stick to less than 40 gm - which is 200 calories, so fats and protein make up the rest of my requirements.
Vegans do have the fewest options when seeking low carb foods but if you can avoid grains then you are cutting out some significantly high carb foods.

@Michaelsnny
Tofu and tempeh are low carb foods so can still eat those. And many veg.
You will need to be mindful of the carbs you consume which may make vegan too hard to continue but there are veggie leaning type 2s who manage well.
Tagging @Walking Girl @Chook

Michaelsnny said:

Hi I'm probably being premature again as I've been diagnosed T2 but haven't had doctors appointment until thursday I've managed to get hold of a tester blood before food today was 5.2 which I thought was normal 2 hours re test 11.7 is it that large rise that makes you diabetic that was 2 weetabix with oat milk I've decided being Vegan is going to be to hard so thought I would have weetabix sorry if this sounds dumb it's all really confusing

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Hello @Michaelsnny ,

It is a lot to take in, and when you have food restrictions, whether due to medical, ethical or religious reasons, well... It just makes the diet a bit harder to grasp. https://josekalsbeek.blogspot.com/2019/11/the-nutritional-thingy.html <-- this is what I wish someone'd have sat down and told me about T2 when I was first diagnosed, but it's aimed at omnivores... So just ignore the bits with animal related foods. There's other people who manage to pull it off, just make sure you keep your vitamins and minerals up to par, as there's a lot of carby foods to avoid that would've provided those otherwise... https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/category/vegetarian-diet-forum.71/ is a place on this forum where vegetarians and vegans exchange experiences. And this may help too: https://www.dietdoctor.com/low-carb/keto/vegetarian

Keep in mind, cutting carbs is a way to stop the progression of T2 in its tracks, but if it makes you absolutely miserable to go back to (organic) cheeses, eggs etc, medication is an option to complement a low-ish carb diet. It's not one or the other, you can combine diet and medication till you find the right balance for you. It's a personal choice.

Good luck,
Jo

Michaelsnny said:

Hi I'm probably being premature again as I've been diagnosed T2 but haven't had doctors appointment until thursday I've managed to get hold of a tester blood before food today was 5.2 which I thought was normal 2 hours re test 11.7 is it that large rise that makes you diabetic that was 2 weetabix with oat milk I've decided being Vegan is going to be to hard so thought I would have weetabix sorry if this sounds dumb it's all really confusing

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Hi Michael - I eat plant based (I avoid the term vegan only because I don’t otherwise live a fully vegan lifestyle, close but not quite). Anyway, there are plenty of T2s I’ve “met” over the past 2 years that successfully treat T2 with a plant based diet.

It’s not the carbohydrates that are an issue for me, it’s the type. I live in the U.S., so I’ve only looked up weetabix and not eaten it myself, but I don’t fare well with any processed grain. Whole grain or not, it’s still chopped up in little bits, breaking the bran and germ down before it enters my digestive system. I do eat whole grains, but they are truly intact whole grains and in conjunction with vegetables (Fiber) that slow down digestion. I.e. quinoa, barley, farro.

My diet is basically lots of vegetables, particularly heavy on above ground vegetables, legumes (you name a bean, I eat it), nuts and seeds, some whole grain and fruit. Whole Foods, not any processed. The plan I follow, one of the first books I read, dr. Furhman. He’s not low fat in comparison to other plant based plans, which works better for me because I like avocados, olives, nuts/seeds, etc. though there are low fat plans too.

I also lost a lot of weight - exact results in my signature, and I exercise regularly- about 5 hours per week split between aerobic and weight lifting. No meds of any kind, diabetes or otherwise. I was obese and sedentary pre-diagnosis. Now I go on hiking vacations where I’ll hike for 10+ miles a day . Quite the lifestyle change for me!

And if you do choose very low carb, there are those who follow a ketogenic vegan plan. Dr. Carrie Diulus is one you can look up.

Hope you find quickly what works for you.