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recent diagnosis type 2

L

liverbirdie

Member
Messages
7
Type of diabetes
Type 2
Treatment type
Diet only
Hi I was recently diagnosed with early type 2, this was a bit of a shock.
Dr suggested diet change to see how I go, and will check in 3 months time.

My hb1ac says 49 mmol/mol and above high reference limit, and plasma fasting glucose level says 7.0 mmol/L,
My cholesterol was 5.7. Dr says that whilst my cholesterol is not that high, due to the diabetes, she would prefer it to be in the 4s

She has prescribed statins, Atorvastatin 10mg. On reading the information in the pack under other possible side effects, it says 'increases in blood sugar levels (if you have diabetes continue careful monitoring of your blood sugar levels), increase in blood creatine kinase.'

If I am trying to change my diet to lower my hb1ac, then surely the statins are working against me by increasing it?

Now I am very reluctant to take any medication unless absolutley necessary at the best of times. So feel in a no win situation.
I'd value any views/advice etc from you very knowledgable people please
Maureen
 
It can be a huge shock - it certainly was for me. It took me a year to get over it enough to join this forum! Thankfully I did however change my diet and it's paying off in terms of reduced HbA1C and reduced weight.

Remember that whilst the statins *can* affect blood sugar and it is a common side effect, the Patient Information Leaflet says 'up to 1 in 10' are affected - that means at least 9 in 10 are not. I'm sure your GP is aware of this. I would take them and ring my GPs to ask for someone to give me advice.

What change in your diet did the GP suggest?
 
cut out cakes bread biscuits etc she only seemed to mention carbs
I dont actually eat much in the way of cakes and biscuits, only as occassional treats. I buy a small wholemeal bread per week, so I dont overeat on bread.
She gave me diet sheet with a list of how much of what I should eat. Much more than I would normally eat, and that includes carbs etc. Its not easy to follow at all. Its called What can I eat.

such as carbs 2-4 servings a day
fruit and veg at least 5 servings a day
protein 2-3 servings a day
dairy foods 3 servings a day
fats oils and dressings limit to 0-2 servings per day
snacks 0-1 per day
sugar and preserves 0-1 per day
 
My own approach gleaned from here was to almost completely cut out carbs. I tried brown pasta, it was sort of OK but I've not made pasta sauce for quite some time. I tried brown rice and thought it disgusting. I mostly cut out potatoes - they are a treat now (not long before new pots are available) - and make a sourdough loaf every 7-10 days. I also started looking at the GI of what I was eating.

Yes to lots of fruit & veg, Yes to plenty of protein. Yes to dairy foods - I use butter not spread and eschew low fat products. I'm not sure what is meant by the fats & oils, but I now dress salad just with balsamic vinegar. I rarely added sugar (or honey or syrup etc.) to my food, I do have marmalade mostly when I've just made a loaf.

I recently discovered cauliflower rice and find it very acceptable with curry or chilli. It probably helps that I've cooked nearly all my food more or less since leaving home 50 (gosh how did that happen!) years ago. Maybe there is a veggie substitute for tagliatelle. I must look!

But a lot of people here would disagree with 2-4 helpings of carbs per day.
 
liverbirdie said:
If I am trying to change my diet to lower my hb1ac, then surely the statins are working against me by increasing it?
Click to expand...
Precisely.. plus if you are an older woman slightly higher levels of cholesterol are deemed protective so...

Edit to add..
The dietary stuff you have been given makes little to no sense (same happened with me too).
I mainly eat meat, fish, dairy and green veg - limited berries with double cream and drink tea and coffee also with double cream.

Lost lots of excess weight and put T2 into remission.
 
I may have to do that too. I have tried brown pasta but not brown rice. cauliflower rice is an excellent alternative. I also use butter because its natural not like the other stuff. I'm finding it all very tiresome to be honest. I am now wondering if its cause I don't eat enough
 
bulkbiker said:
Precisely.. plus if you are an older woman slightly higher levels of cholesterol are deemed protective so...
Click to expand...

That's news to me that slightly higher cholesterol is protective in older women? Got any references? Even if it is, it might depend on HDL / LDL balance? I do know that it tends to be higher in older people.

However I go back to my original comment - @liverbirdie should discuss it with her GP or nurse practitioner.
 
liverbirdie said:
I may have to do that too. I have tried brown pasta but not brown rice. cauliflower rice is an excellent alternative. I also use butter because its natural not like the other stuff. I'm finding it all very tiresome to be honest. I am now wondering if its cause I don't eat enough
Click to expand...

The cholesterol or the diabetes?

Your HbA1c is only just into the diabetic range, you probably don't have to change much to get it to go down. Mostly cut out sugary stuff - that includes brown sugar, honey and the various syrups - reduce carbs and that might be enough.

If you are concerned ring the GP and ask for a phone consultation. I know they might be hard to get, but you have been diagnosed with a serious and shocking problem and deserve the support from them especially in the first few months.

PS don't bother with brown rice. Cauliflower rice is far, far nicer!
 
OrientalSlave said:
That's news to me that slightly higher cholesterol is protective in older women? Got any references? Even if it is, it might depend on HDL / LDL balance? I do know that it tends to be higher in older people.

However I go back to my original comment - @liverbirdie should discuss it with her GP or nurse practitioner.
Click to expand...
Here's one
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Cholesterol, statins, and longevity from age 70 to 90 years - PubMed

Among older people, cholesterol levels were unrelated to mortality between the ages of 70 and 90. The protective effect of statins observed among the very old appears to be independent of TC.
pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I'm sure there will be lots more on this thread

https://www.diabetes.co.uk/forum/threads/cholesterol-and-statins.156985/ might take a while to find though..
 
bulkbiker said:
Precisely.. plus if you are an older woman slightly higher levels of cholesterol are deemed protective so...

Edit to add..
The dietary stuff you have been given makes little to no sense (same happened with me too).
I mainly eat meat, fish, dairy and green veg - limited berries with double cream and drink tea and coffee also with double cream.

Lost lots of excess weight and put T2 into remission.
Click to expand...
I am an older woman :) I am a bit overweight but not obese. So losing a bit would certainly help. This leaflet I was given doesn't really help me at all.
 
OrientalSlave said:
The cholesterol or the diabetes?

Your HbA1c is only just into the diabetic range, you probably don't have to change much to get it to go down. Mostly cut out sugary stuff - that includes brown sugar, honey and the various syrups - reduce carbs and that might be enough.

If you are concerned ring the GP and ask for a phone consultation. I know they might be hard to get, but you have been diagnosed with a serious and shocking problem and deserve the support from them especially in the first few months.

PS don't bother with brown rice. Cauliflower rice is far, far nicer!
Click to expand...
the diabetes, cause they say its lifestyle related
 
And yet the official advice is still to base meals around starchy carbohydrate. Unfortunately one of the lessons I took away from my first few months after diagnosis was that you have to forget everything you think you know about what "healthy eating" is.

If you've been diagnosed as T2 by definition you (we) have a problem managing carbohydrate intake, That problem leads to high blood sugar, which in itself causes a huge number of problems, and weight gain, which brings its own difficulties. If the problem is carbohydrate, I thought, the answer is not to eat carbohydrate. Not reduce it a bit, not wholemeals or brown "whatevers". Fruit is loaded with sugar, so that went too.

20g a day worked for me - the results are in the signature block below. I woukld recommend getting a glucose meter and testing before and after meals, to assess the effect what you eat has on your blood glucose levels. Then remove whatever causes unacceptable rises.
 
OrientalSlave said:
That's news to me that slightly higher cholesterol is protective in older women? Got any references? Even if it is, it might depend on HDL / LDL balance? I do know that it tends to be higher in older people.

However I go back to my original comment - @liverbirdie should discuss it with her GP or nurse practitioner.
Click to expand...
Every times someone checks, people with higher cholesterol live longer.
I reported the findings and - I think that people wanted a second opinion or a recount.....
Also more than half the people at a cardiology clinic had lower than average cholesterol levels.
It really doesn't add up - but it is such an accepted idea that it can't be questioned without argument and accusations.
I don't have references - I don't use the internet as a source for storing up things, just a search for function.
 
Welcome to the forum @liverbirdie. You have come to the right place.
We all have been there: being told that we have diabetes.

Most importantly don't panic!
Your HbA1c is 49 mmol/mol, which is just above the threshold of 48 mmol/mol for being diagnosed.
(Many of us including myself were over 100 mmol/mol at diagnosis.)
Thus you might only need small adjustments to get your T2 under control.

I suggest before making (big) changes educate yourself.
Generally lowering carb intake will lower blood sugar
and many T2s here have success with a low carb diet.
However individual levels of how much carbs we can tolerate vary a lot.
Consider going first for low hanging fruits, for example, cutting all fizzy drinks,
A can of coke is equivalent to eating ten cubes of pure sugar.
Don't snack, it is a habit and if you stop it, you get quickly used to it.
if you lower your carb intake, best to replace these with healthy fats.
These have the advantage of being more satiating and you might start losing weight.

I have written about statins in the following post:

Cholesterol and Statins

If memory serves me right someone quoted on another statin thread that the surgery ( not the individual doctor) gets £1245 a year if they get enough of their patients who the nhs think should be taking a statin to take one, given surgeries now regularly have thousands of patients ...... do we...
www.diabetes.co.uk www.diabetes.co.uk
and don't see a good reason why you would want to take them.
There is essentially little (if any) benefit with such a low cholesterol below 5.
That said you will need to decide for yourself,
so you should discuss this with your GP, but it is in your right to refuse statins.

Please don't hesitate to ask further questions.
 
Last edited:
Statins are a trillion dollar a year industry, the only way to increase profits, is to put pressure on health services to keep reducing the level at which they are prescribed. every .5 drop increases the number of (victims) taking them worldwide by many millions. They complain my levels are a little high, but they are actually lower than when i was 17.
Even the inventor of Statins wouldn't take them.
 
liverbirdie said:
Hi I was recently diagnosed with early type 2, this was a bit of a shock.
Dr suggested diet change to see how I go, and will check in 3 months time.

My hb1ac says 49 mmol/mol and above high reference limit, and plasma fasting glucose level says 7.0 mmol/L,
My cholesterol was 5.7. Dr says that whilst my cholesterol is not that high, due to the diabetes, she would prefer it to be in the 4s

She has prescribed statins, Atorvastatin 10mg. On reading the information in the pack under other possible side effects, it says 'increases in blood sugar levels (if you have diabetes continue careful monitoring of your blood sugar levels), increase in blood creatine kinase.'

If I am trying to change my diet to lower my hb1ac, then surely the statins are working against me by increasing it?

Now I am very reluctant to take any medication unless absolutley necessary at the best of times. So feel in a no win situation.
I'd value any views/advice etc from you very knowledgable people please
Maureen
Click to expand...
Statins are tossed the way of the newly diagnosed, almost always. What is an acceptable level for a non-diabetic, isn't for someone who does have diabetes. We're held to impossible thresholds and standards a healthy 22 -year old might not even manage, so yeah. Do you need them? If you haven't had a cardiac event in the past, and don't have familial hypercholesterolemia, probably not, really... Statins can indeed up blood sugars, and have more side effects than one might wish for. For me, they made my rheumatism flare like mad. Others started experiencing alzheimer-esque symptoms, which isn't surprising as our brainmatter is largely made up out of cholesterol. And when you re-test in a few months time, should you change your diet to LCHF or keto for instance, well, your cholesterol might be up because you're losing weight and what they're measuring is material that was previously stored, and is now on the way out, so it shows up in the bloodstream. You decide what you take. No-one's going to stand by your breakfast table and slap your fingers if you decide not to take it in the morning. It's entirely your choice.
 
OrientalSlave said:
That's news to me that slightly higher cholesterol is protective in older women? Got any references? Even if it is, it might depend on HDL / LDL balance? I do know that it tends to be higher in older people.

However I go back to my original comment - @liverbirdie should discuss it with her GP or nurse practitioner.
Click to expand...
Here is a link to the HUNT2 study conducted over ten years in Norway. It looked at what people actually died of, rather than predicted risk.

Is the use of cholesterol in mortality risk algorithms in clinical guidelines valid? Ten years prospective data from the Norwegian HUNT 2 study - PMC

Many clinical guidelines for cardiovascular disease (CVD) prevention contain risk estimation charts/calculators. These have shown a tendency to overestimate risk, which indicates that there might be theoretical flaws in the algorithms. Total ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

These below are the "Results" and "Conclusions" sections of the study:

Results​

Among women, cholesterol had an inverse association with all-cause mortality [hazard ratio (HR): 0.94; 95% confidence interval (CI): 0.89–0.99 per 1.0 mmol L−1 increase] as well as CVD mortality (HR: 0.97; 95% CI: 0.88–1.07). The association with IHD mortality (HR: 1.07; 95% CI: 0.92–1.24) was not linear but seemed to follow a ‘U-shaped’ curve, with the highest mortality <5.0 and ≥7.0 mmol L−1. Among men, the association of cholesterol with mortality from CVD (HR: 1.06; 95% CI: 0.98–1.15) and in total (HR: 0.98; 95% CI: 0.93–1.03) followed a ‘U-shaped’ pattern.

Conclusion​

Our study provides an updated epidemiological indication of possible errors in the CVD risk algorithms of many clinical guidelines. If our findings are generalizable, clinical and public health recommendations regarding the ‘dangers’ of cholesterol should be revised. This is especially true for women, for whom moderately elevated cholesterol (by current standards) may prove to be not only harmless but even beneficial.
 
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