Reverse Type 2 Diabetes with a LCHF diet. Is this a myth?

[Little Bird]

Yes I agree we all have to do the best we can with what we have got and if any diet or lifestyle works for you for heaven's sake keep doing it!

The reason I am bothered by the question of is it really reversal or remission is the disappointment of can potentially lead to. The more I read and learn the more it seems apparent that true reversal or remission is rarely if ever possible. Once you have diabetes you are stuck with it. You may manage it with diet and lead a healthy love consequently, and that's good, no complaints there. But you still a dianetic, for life. That's a hard thing to reconcile for me.

 

[Little Bird]

Hi Brunneria, by reversal I mean reverting to a state where one is not adversely affected by eating carbs as with someone who is non diabetic.

 

[DCUKMod]

Yes I agree we all have to do the best we can with what we have got and if any diet or lifestyle works for you for heaven's sake keep doing it!

The reason I am bothered by the question of is it really reversal or remission is the disappointment of can potentially lead to. The more I read and learn the more it seems apparent that true reversal or remission is rarely if ever possible. Once you have diabetes you are stuck with it. You may manage it with diet and lead a healthy love consequently, and that's good, no complaints there. But you still a dianetic, for life. That's a hard thing to reconcile for me.

From my personal perspective, I feel, when dealing with T2, that hope is important, but expectation can be harmful. An individual can only be disappointed if they have an unreasonable expectation of what they will or can achieve.

For me, that meant that, in adopting my personal approach of eating to my meter, post diagnosis, my first objective would be that the next A1c test would be lower. Lower was not defined. After that first one where it was indeed lower (73>37),my next objective was to maintain it.

At that time, having had a significant improvement in A1c, I realised it is not possible to stay on a downward path forever. It will, depending on the individual and their approach, it will level out, in the absence of other changes.

For me, it's a condition deserving of respect.

 

[Brunneria]

Hi Brunneria, by reversal I mean reverting to a state where one is not adversely affected by eating carbs as with someone who is non diabetic.

yes, you stated that earlier.
But that is a very vague definition, which muddies any discussion on the subject.

People who claim ‘reversal’ - especially people claiming it with respect of a way of eating, or weight loss, or lifestyle - do so with reference to blood glucose being under a specific level (usually HbA1c) for a minimum length of time, or with a specific result during a glucose tolerance test. And whether on or off medication, since different medications have different effects on blood glucose and insulin resistance.

 

[Mr_Pot]

What you seem to want is for someone to tell you that Type 2 Diabetes can be cured, although you are calling it reversed, that is very unlikely to happen on this forum. Some people, due to their genes, their medical history, their age, or whatever are susceptible to Type 2 and this shows up when they have an unsuitable diet that their body can't cope with. If you control your diabetes with a low carb diet, you will still have that susceptibility, so reverting to your previous diet will mean you will lose control again. If your previous diet was particularly carb heavy then maybe you can adopt a moderately low carb diet that some non diabetics would consider "normal" but that's about as good as it gets. You are probably a diabetic for life but that might not be any sort of a problem.

 

[jjraak]

The other thing I have learned is that if you follow certain diets, very low calorie or low carb high fat keto diets, you can lose weight and reverse Type 2 diabetes. Which sounds great except I’m not completely convinced of this by anything I have read so far here or elsewhere.

So is it really possible to truly reverse diabetes to normal without a strict lifelong commitment to low carb eating?

I would really love to hear other peoples views and thoughts on this.

For me and others I know, the answer is No.

If we eat more carbs than our bodies can cope with, our blood sugars rise.

I have accepted this, just as people accept gluten or lactose intolerance.

I have change my diet and adapted it for the long term. So far, it's been over seven years for me.

Not sure what your looking for if i'm honest.

all post so far are questioning or in relation to something that seems pretty clear is never going to be the answer you seem to be looking for.

@Lucylocket answered for herself...yet it's not what your looking for ?

MY answer is the same.... Reversed?..as in Now no longer exists ....No.

For me, a return to the diet i had before will raise the risks one more time.
and will I think, cause a return to the high numbers when i was first DX'd with T2D

i offer a simple analogy.

The advise is NOT to go stand in the the restricted zone at Chernobyl..
or you could get sick..very sick.
the advise is to avoid standing in that radiation Zone,
IF you DON't want to risk getting sick...correct ?

So by following that advise and steering clear of the possible dangers...

have i reversed the effects of Radiations ability to effect me..?
or am i in remission from the abilities of Radiation to effect me..?

Does it really matter unless my health IS compromised
IF i am alive, well and living a great life ?

i Have an illness that affects me, and could make me very ill.
i have found a way to mitigate some of the effects of that illness, by adopting some pretty simple precautions.

And i say simple deliberately, as i'm sure some will tell me how impossible they are.

YET..those same people will also take simple precautions on a daily basis when crossing the road, for instance
They look out for dangers and try to avoid, which is what most of us do on here also on a daily basis.,
quite successfully overall..

I do wish you well in your search for whatever it is your seeking.

i hope whatever drives you forwards, helps you find some form of solution to managing your T2D
(btw you never mentioned your HBA1c or diet, maybe those on here could be of service ? )

I'd very much like to see your signature matching so many others, remission, reversed or cured,..
at some point soon.

Members, who day by day manage their T2D in the best way imaginable for them,
rather then joining the vast Majority,.....
slipping slowly along on the 'Progressive' conveyor belt the usual health care advise so clearly
directs so many towards.

 

[Little Bird]

Yes I think you have got the nail on It's head. It's about expectation rather than hope. I think there is so much talk about reversing diabetes it can set up ones expectations only to dashed when you learn that management is more likely.

I don't know what to say about respect since my diabetes feels like my master and a capricious one at that. I feel like I'm my diabetes ***** (if I say that here).Can I respect such a master?

 

[Little Bird]

What you seem to want is for someone to tell you that Type 2 Diabetes can be cured, although you are calling it reversed, that is very unlikely to happen on this forum. Some people, due to their genes, their medical history, their age, or whatever are susceptible to Type 2 and this shows up when they have an unsuitable diet that their body can't cope with. If you control your diabetes with a low carb diet, you will still have that susceptibility, so reverting to your previous diet will mean you will lose control again. If your previous diet was particularly carb heavy then maybe you can adopt a moderately low carb diet that some non diabetics would consider "normal" but that's about as good as it gets. You are probably a diabetic for life but that might not be any sort of a problem.

Thank you Mr Pot i think that is one of the most honest and sincere responses i heatd. If someone had just explained this in the beginning without all the remission talk i would have responded very differently. Thank you for your reply.

 

[Oldvatr]

The NHS only recognises one treatment for T2D that can be used to attain reversal, and that is Bariatric surgery, which they offer, which is the only official pathway they offer at the moment, I believe. . However, they are beginning to support the Ultra Low Calorie diet based on the Newcastle research studies as a valid means of control and have started supported trials in some areas,. The NHS does not recognise any keto or LCHF diets and will not reecommend these at all. The other diets the NHS recognise as being helpful for diabetics are the Mediterranean diet and the vegetarian / vegan diet. But the only official diet is Eatwell 2 which is currently mandated through NICE.

I have used LCHF to attain reversal recently. I was in hospital for an ectended in patient stay, and my meds were all stopped while they investigated my other problems. I was eating hospital food, and by a miracle it seems, my sugars behaved themselves impeccably. I found I was able to eat high carb meals and snacks with impumity. I was eating danish pastries, standard icecream, and puddings like poly poly with jam and custard. It was like I was freed from the shackles at last.

But it did not last. I had an operation, and the anaeshetic mashed up my pancreas, and I had to go onto insulin since I was in effect LADA all of a sudden. Thankfully, I have recovered and am now approaching the non diabetic sugar ranges again on a low carb diet with small amount of oral medication,

While I waa gorging it, my HbA1c for the year previous gave me two successive HbA1c's in the Normal range, and I had two consultants declare me officially as In Remission. So technically I did it. but I also proved that it can be undone and is not a permanaent state. This is my (n=1) experiment which I am trying to repeat.

 

[Little Bird]

Not sure what your looking for if i'm honest.

all post so far are questioning or in relation to something that seems pretty clear is never going to be the answer you seem to be looking for.

@Lucylocket answered for herself...yet it's not what your looking for ?

MY answer is the same.... Reversed?..as in Now no longer exists ....No.

For me, a return to the diet i had before will raise the risks one more time.
and will I think, cause a return to the high numbers when i was first DX'd with T2D

i offer a simple analogy.

The advise is NOT to go stand in the the restricted zone at Chernobyl..
or you could get sick..very sick.
the advise is to avoid standing in that radiation Zone,
IF you DON't want to risk getting sick...correct ?

So by following that advise and steering clear of the possible dangers...

have i reversed the effects of Radiations ability to effect me..?
or am i in remission from the abilities of Radiation to effect me..?

Does it really matter unless my health IS compromised
IF i am alive, well and living a great life ?

i Have an illness that affects me, and could make me very ill.
i have found a way to mitigate some of the effects of that illness, by adopting some pretty simple precautions.

And i saw simple deliberately, as i'm sure some will tell me how impossible they are.
YET..those same people will take simple precautions on a daily basis when crossing the road, for instance
They look out for dangers and try to avoid.

I do wish you well in your search for whatever it is your seeking.

i hope whatever drives you forwards, helps you find some form of solution to managing your T2D
(btw you never mentioned your HBA1c or diet, maybe those on here could be of service ? )

I'd very much like to see your signature matching so many others, remission, reversed or cured,..
at some point soon.

Members, who day by day manage their T2D in the best way imaginable for them,
rather then joining the vast Majority,.....
slipping slowly along on the 'Progressive' conveyor belt the usual health care advise so clearly
directs so many towards.

Thank you for kind and candid reply, I love your Chernobyl analogy!

 

[lucylocket61]

Hi Lucielocket61 (great name by the way!) Its great that yours blood sugars are under control and you are happy, but my question is, if you still react to carbohydrates with a high spike then have you reversed your diabetes or are you controlling it with your diet? Either way sounds like your doing great!

I still have type 2 diabetes. I am controlling it through my diet.

I use LCHF, not HCLF as you mentioned in an earlier post.

However, by controlling my diabetes I have halted it's progress for nearly 8 years so far.

 

[Little Bird]

Yay jackpot! Someone who did not have an immediate surge after just one carb meal. It's goes without saying that once you've had a diabetes diagnosis your Danish pastry days are over, period! But to never eat any kind of carb without a reaction is something different. Maybe there is wiggle room for some afterall. I will look more closely at other dietary interventions to see if I can at least reach a state of happiness even if not cured. Thank you so much for your post.I feel encouraged. Hope you continue to have good results from your own endeavours.

 

[Little Bird]

I still have type 2 diabetes. I am controlling it through my diet.

I use LCHF, not HCLF as you mentioned in an earlier post.

However, by controlling my diabetes I have halted it's progress for nearly 8 years so far.

Apologies I meant LCHF, I hope you continue to reap the rewards from your chosen lifestyle. 8 years! That's fantastic!

 

[lucylocket61]

But to never eat any kind of carb without a reaction is something different. Maybe there is wiggle room for some afteral

Did you read all of his post?

I fear you are clutching at straws rather than facing reality. What specific foods are you wanting to continue eating?

 

[Little Bird]

yes, you stated that earlier.
But that is a very vague definition, which muddies any discussion on the subject.

People who claim ‘reversal’ - especially people claiming it with respect of a way of eating, or weight loss, or lifestyle - do so with reference to blood glucose being under a specific level (usually HbA1c) for a minimum length of time, or with a specific result during a glucose tolerance test. And whether on or off medication, since different medications have different effects on blood glucose and insulin resistance.

Yes I agree and think that is the real problem. Reversal has yet to be defined by anyone and that's leaves it open to interpretation. It's a dilemma.

 

[lucylocket61]

Yes I agree and think that is the real problem. Reversal has yet to be defined by anyone and that's leaves it open to interpretation. It's a dilemma.

I notice you are only 51 years old. So you have a reasonable expectation of another 30+ on earth. Isn't it worth finding a way of eating you like which also makes those years healthier? Tell us how we can help you to find an eating plan for the long term which works for you. It's worth it.

 

[Little Bird]

Did you read all of his post?

I fear you are clutching at straws rather than facing reality. What specific foods are you wanting to continue eating?

Hi lucielocket. I fully and completely accept that a rubbish diet loaded with sugar and starch is simply not possible, I don't wish to eat that way but at the same an entire lifetime of strict LCHF adherence sounds like a life sentence. I realise for some there may be no middle ground. I've yet to determine if this is the case for me.

 

[bulkbiker]

LCHF adherence sounds like a life sentence.

Certainly is.. for me a life sentence of improved health, sustained weight loss and delicious food.

Why not stop thinking/fretting about it and give it a go? Turn it into a positive and not a negative.. or not ...up to you entirely.

 

[Little Bird]

I notice you are only 51 years old. So you have a reasonable expectation of another 30+ on earth. Isn't it worth finding a way of eating you like which also makes those years healthier? Tell us how we can help you to find an eating plan for the long term which works for you. It's worth it.[/Q

Certainly is.. for me a life sentence of improved health, sustained weight loss and delicious food.

Why not stop thinking/fretting about it and give it a go? Turn it into a positive and not a negative.. or not ...up to you entirely.

If you personally find the low carb approach delicious and you are healthy and happy then for goodness sake keep doing it! It's truly great that you have found what works for you. Long may it continue!

 

[lucylocket61]

If you personally find the low carb approach delicious and you are healthy and happy then for goodness sake keep doing it! It's truly great that you have found what works for you. Long may it continue!

Can you tell me what you mean by low carb? Different people mean different things. When you think of lo carb, what do the meals look like to you?