Slow acting insulin once a day

[millenium]

Is this a common treatment method for type 2?

 

[bulkbiker]

Hope not.. T2's are over producers of insulin.. adding more is rarely helpful.

 

[Fenn]

Hi,

Yes it is common, when other methods, like carnivore diet for example no longer work or are difficult to stick to long term.

Personally I think you should ask for Basal/Bolus or Fast/Slow insulins as you can have better and more direct control, but thats just my experience, others may disagree.

I believe our pancreas insulin production can burn itself out over time, I am not smart enough to understand the mechanics but I'm sure it happens to some(me), so insulin may be required.

 

[Member496333]

I think everyone should be insulin tested before being given exogenous doses. Underproducing and overproducing require totally different approaches. Worth mentioning @bulkbiker that resistant overproducers (T2) can also eventually end up underproducing. Maybe even before diagnosis. In those cases insulin therapy may be beneficial even if only temporarily until their pancreas has been able to defat itself. But generally I would agree that the majority of type 2 would benefit from less insulin rather than more. Testing before making a decision really is critical but I think most of us here know that getting a GP to agree is like getting blood out of a stone.

 

[Antje77]

I think high insulin levels, wether your own or injected, are preferable over high BG levels, if that's the choice it comes to.

T2's are over producers of insulin.. adding more is rarely helpful.

Not all T2's overproduce, but even if they do, and BG doesn't come down by other means, I think they'd be better off adding insulin than keep having high BG's for years and years.

I have a low insulin production myself, but I take a rather high dose of injected insulin, so I have a lot of insulin going around, which for me is right, being an insulin resistant T1.
It might not help my insulin resistance, but I'd rather have insulin resistance and healthy BG's than having a normal amount of insulin in my body and BG's in the 20's or worse.

Is this a common treatment method for type 2?

It is for some, mainly the ones who have had diabetes for many years already, and only after many other medications have been tried. Usually the insulin is in addition to other medication.

 

[Daibell]

Is this a common treatment method for type 2?

Insulin should really only be used either after testing for your insulin production levels or when various tablets have been tried and have not brought BS down. If you have any excess weight then reducing that thru a low-carb diet should always be the first approach.

 

[bulkbiker]

Not all T2's overproduce, but even if they do, and BG doesn't come down by other means, I think they'd be better off adding insulin than keep having high BG's for years and years.

Disagree ... and I think there are plenty of better ways of lowering blood sugar levels.

 

[Member496333]

If overproducing insulin is clinically confirmed then adding more is the absolute very worst therapy imaginable. Irrespective of blood glucose. In this scenario it’s imperative to reduce the need for insulin. Only in my considered opinion, of course.

 

[Fenn]

The problem here is being allowed the test, or knowing you should have it even worse.

 

[Member496333]

The problem here is being allowed the test, or knowing you should have it even worse.

Indeed. Chances of being referred to and endocrinologist willing to do the necessary tests and evaluation is pretty slim unless exogenous insulin is already failing to cut the mustard. And anyone who reaches that stage is in pretty serious trouble. I paid Medichecks for a fasting insulin test as part of my quest to determine if I’d truly reversed my diabetes. No GP would have it done for me. Or definitely not mine at least.

 

[Antje77]

If overproducing insulin is clinically confirmed then adding more is the absolute very worst therapy imaginable. Irrespective of blood glucose.

Why?
Having continuous BG's in the twenties or so seems worse to me than having continuous high levels of insulin in your body.

What are the long time effects of high insulin levels? Genuinely interested, as I'm on rather large doses of insulin, so although this is not endogenous insulin, I still have high insulin levels.

I already know what the long time effects of high BG are: blindness, neuropathy, nephropathy, all kinds of vascular issues, a slow and miserable death.
I can't imagine high insulin levels are worse than this.

I've spoken with my endo about the possibility of adding metformin to see if this would reduce my insulin needs. She advised against it, seeing as I manage my diabetes quite well like it is. Pretty sure she would prescribe it if I really wanted to try though.
She clearly wasn't alarmed by my doses. So what is it that makes high insulin levels worse than high blood glucose?

 

[zand]

Why?
Having continuous BG's in the twenties or so seems worse to me than having continuous high levels of insulin in your body.

What are the long time effects of high insulin levels? Genuinely interested, as I'm on rather large doses of insulin, so although this is not endogenous insulin, I still have high insulin levels.

I already know what the long time effects of high BG are: blindness, neuropathy, nephropathy, all kinds of vascular issues, a slow and miserable death.
I can't imagine high insulin levels are worse than this.

I've spoken with my endo about the possibility of adding metformin to see if this would reduce my insulin needs. She advised against it, seeing as I manage my diabetes quite well like it is. Pretty sure she would prescribe it if I really wanted to try though.
She clearly wasn't alarmed by my doses. So what is it that makes high insulin levels worse than high blood glucose?

Many of us T2's (like me) had high insulin levels for maybe 20 years before T2 diagnosis.
Hyperinsulinemia - Causes, Risks & Hyperinsulinemia Symptoms (diabetes.co.uk)

 

[Antje77]

Many of us T2's (like me) had high insulin levels for maybe 20 years before T2 diagnosis.
Hyperinsulinemia - Causes, Risks & Hyperinsulinemia Symptoms (diabetes.co.uk)

I know. But I don't understand why you'd prefer high BG levels over high insulin levels.
We know high BG levels lead to complications, how are high insulin levels with healthy BG's worse than high BG levels?

 

[bulkbiker]

I know. But I don't understand why you'd prefer high BG levels over high insulin levels.
We know high BG levels lead to complications, how are high insulin levels with healthy BG's worse than high BG levels?

Hyperinsulinaenmia is thought by many experts to be the cause of most of the things that kill T2's so.....

 

[Member496333]

What are the long time effects of high insulin levels?

Metabolic syndrome. Less commonly known as insulin resistance, or hyperinsulinemia. Including but not limited to hypertension, obesity, heart disease and of course…diabetic pathology. Possibly some cancers. High circulating insulin is thought by many to be the root of all modern non-communicable disease. Of course, I’m not suggesting insulin therapy doesn’t have its place for type 2. It definitely does, but should only be prescribed as part of a plan to cover high glucose while the liver and pancreas are given a chance to react favourably to dietary changes. Adding more insulin can only ever make everything worse in the longer term. It is after all the aetiology of type 2 diabetes to begin with.

I will add that I’m not offering prescriptive advice or passing judgment on anyone. Merely stating the cold facts as I understand them. The whole situation is dramatically worsened by a healthcare system that really doesn’t understand type 2 diabetes. Some might argue there are commercial parties involved whose influence aims to keep it this way.

 

[Fenn]

Well that’s not good news lol

 

[Jaylee]

Disagree ... and I think there are plenty of better ways of lowering blood sugar levels.

Try telling that to a possible misdiagnosed T1?

 

[Antje77]

Try telling that to a possible misdiagnosed T1?

Or a T2 depending on meal service. Or a T2 on steroids. Or a T2 with vision loss, unable to prepare their own meals. Or a T2 who simply doesn't want to go lower and lower on carbs, for some people this affects their quality of life simply too much. Or a T2 depending on the food bank, where everything is carbs. Or a T2 with a learning disability making it impossible to do their own research or shopping. Or a T2 dealing with depression, making eating and preparing food a big achievement, even if it's not the food you would eat.

There are many, many reasons why people cannot or would not follow in your footsteps, @bulkbiker , and they're all valid. Like our forum ethos says: "There is rarely one way of dealing with diabetes. Be tolerant and courteous to those preferring to adopt a different approach."
I think this is a very true thing.

 

[Fenn]

Low carb high fat diet suggestions would earn me a slap from the cardiac doctors, ex smokers are the worst

 

[bulkbiker]

Try telling that to a possible misdiagnosed T1?

Who would not be an insulin overproducer.. please don't try and twist what I said initially..

T2 is a condition of insulin overproduction and adding more will not do much good.