Success with moderate calorie diet?

You can eat cabs as normal, to me, that's what reversed means.

If you can eat carbs after a low carb diet, you are indeed reversed as well.

I suppose you need to look at reversals on the Newcastle diet, and reversals (in the true sense) on low carb, and make your pick.
Or claim all diets for both sides, and hope.

Interestingly on my diet so far, the sharpest spike I have had was from a reading of 5 to 11 when I had two slices of toast and baked beans with an English breakfast. That spike also reversed itself sharply within 90 minutes back to 5 so I already know my body does react properly to such spikes, though maybe the spike is more severe than it would be in a non diabetic .

From what I have seen of my blood sugar behaviour now I have the 24 hour monitor the issue seems to be that until we start testing none of us know what our blood sugars are doing. When our metabolism finally decides it cannot deal with the level of throughput anymore, then we get a relentless but small daily rise in our blood sugar which then makes the actual food spikes ever greater until finally that manifests in symptoms, for me, the actual change in daily rise day on day, or even meal on meal is probably little different over time its just that every single day it is starting from a higher base .

Based on that, it seems to me that there is no reason why whatever means we all use to get back to the proper levels of glucose, once we are there, our bodies ability to deal with the ensuing spikes from what we then decide to eat, is probably little different regardless for each of us based on our own health regardless of which actual method we used to get to that point whether that be low carb, low fat or fasting. The issue is that whatever our eating habits that caused us to lose control in the first place need to be changed forever if we are not going to go back to losing control gradually all over again, so in changing our eating habits to bring down Hba1C and also weight ( the hba1C can come first in my own experience) we might as well choose the diet that most closely resembles something we can live with long term - which for me is LCHF but everyone can choose for themselves. The most vital point is to find the diet that enables blood glucose to gradually go down on average each day.

That's always going to be the difference.
I viewed my strict calorie controlled diet as a means to an end, you view yours as a low carb for life.

Now it's way more relaxed, and I just eat, and if I gain weight, I eat less for a bit.
I do eat differently, as a box of donuts and a pie from greggs aren't really my taste anymore, it's much more Mediterranean diet now.

I think that is a fundamental difference in the low calorie, and low carb forum worth remembering.

This forum tends to be a short term fix, followed by more choice, the low carb forum tends to be a way of life.

Bluetit1802 said:

@CherryAA

That is exactly how I did it until all my excess weight had melted, then I increased my calories to maintain my new weight. The only difference between your diet and my initial one is that I ate normal protein, not moderate. I counted calories, carbs, fats and proteins religiously, keeping calories to around 1200 and reducing carbs gradually until arriving at 30g a day.

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Well you had great success with it, so I hope I do too . The most encouraging part for me I that I already got my hba1C down to 6.2% and I still have a BMI of 33! i.e. its not actually been necessary to lose all the weight to get the blood sugar down, instead it was necessary to get a handle on how to bring it down through what I ate, which also caused me to lose weight1

douglas99 said:

That's always going to be the difference.
I viewed my strict calorie controlled diet as a means to an end, you view yours as a low carb for life.

Now it's way more relaxed, and I just eat, and if I gain weight, I eat less for a bit.
I do eat differently, as a box of donuts and a pie from greggs aren't really my taste anymore, it's much more Mediterranean diet now.

I think that is a fundamental difference in the low calorie, and low carb forum worth remembering.

This forum tends to be a short term fix, followed by more choice, the low carb forum tends to be a way of life.

Click to expand...

Have you found that your hba1C remains stable regardless of what you eat now that you have lost the weight- i.e. does it stay stable even if you put a few pounds on? do you still test your blood sugars a lot? for me just a couple of days of eating more food but still only a normal daily allowance was enough to change direction in average blood sugar from down to up, have people following the low calories method not had that problem?

In the end I'm used to eating a "low calorie" diet I have been doing it on and off for years - I guess the fact that I was diagnosed after havig been following one particularly strictly for two months, is why I find it a bit hard to see how it works other than through an implicit carb restriction included in it. Though obviously if it does work for some that's great news !

I assume at some point my Hba1C will reach whatever it stable minimum is supposed to be - it will be interesting to see at that point what actually happens when I then eats carbs!

douglas99 said:

I think you have very succinctly summed it up.
I have normal bloods, BP, BMI, kidney, liver, cholesterol, (NHS cholesterol targets), and I do eat what a NORMAL person does.
Personally speaking the Mediterranean diet gives me a great variety of choice, for example, if I'm out, grains will not cause problems, if I am somewhere were it's difficult to avoid them if they are the predominant choice.

However, my proviso is that if I do gain weight, I expect my BG to do the same, and vice versa.
The scales and fasting test are my guides.

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From my previous response in this thread, to another poster.

I suspect that there is variation in how Humans handle various amounts of carb - and it doesn't always follow the blood groups - I am type A and my tolerance is low, which is not what is expected, apparently.
Just as Dr Atkins pointed out all those years ago, we need to fine tune our carb intake to discover what the limits are, but after that it is our choice to maintain or lose weight at a rate that suits the individual - doing so from knowledge rather than a diet sheet.
The medics and dieticians need to realise that their one size fits all approach is just too simplistic an approach to eating in general. I think that I will try to keep on losing weight at a rate which feels right, my skin is already looking less plumped out so I suspect I will begin to look a lot older quite quickly, but it is a privilege denied to many. I will get another lot of testing strips for the blood glucose meter in a while and see if my BG alters over the months ahead.

Resurgam said:

I suspect that there is variation in how Humans handle various amounts of carb - and it doesn't always follow the blood groups - I am type A and my tolerance is low, which is not what is expected, apparently.
Just as Dr Atkins pointed out all those years ago, we need to fine tune our carb intake to discover what the limits are, but after that it is our choice to maintain or lose weight at a rate that suits the individual - doing so from knowledge rather than a diet sheet.
The medics and dieticians need to realise that their one size fits all approach is just too simplistic an approach to eating in general. I think that I will try to keep on losing weight at a rate which feels right, my skin is already looking less plumped out so I suspect I will begin to look a lot older quite quickly, but it is a privilege denied to many. I will get another lot of testing strips for the blood glucose meter in a while and see if my BG alters over the months ahead.

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I didn't even think of getting that complicated.

I just ate a lot less, and didn't stress over carbs, maybe simplistic, but the mirror, scales, and meter didn't lie, despite them knowing nothing of the experts.
But as you say, we all need to find what works.

NonStop said:

Hi there,

After reading a fair bit about the newcastle diet, I wanted to know if people have had success with reversing diabetes via a more moderate calorific deficit rather than the more extreme deficits presented in the studies.

I know Roy Taylor himself seems to argue that moderate calorie diets would work; "The essential point is that substantial weight loss must be achieved. The time course of weight loss is much less important." - http://www.ncl.ac.uk/media/wwwnclac...re/files/reversing-type2-diabetes-leaflet.pdf

But I really would be keen to know if people here on this forum have seen success with a more moderate calorific deficit?

Thanks in advance!

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Interesting link. It seems our best bet is an acute weight loss.
Scientist tried to repeat dm reversal after Taylor s research. For them it seemed that the acute calorie deficit has to be as big as with bariatric surgery. To see the discussion,Check

Very Low–Calorie Diet Mimics the Early Beneficial Effect of Roux-en-Y Gastric Bypass on Insulin Sensitivity and β-Cell Function in Type 2 Diabetic Patients.

I strongly believe low carbs diet is very beneficial for a healthy body. Those without diabetes yet must also discipline theirselves through eating healthy foods and minimize their intake of calories. On the other hand, those already have diabetes regardless of what type they have must be conscious enough on the food they eat in order to save their lives and as well improve their health.

Protein and healthy fats rich foods as well as vegetables are mainly the diet suggested by my dietician. I always have tuna and salad in my meal.