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the low carb - non low carb arguement

Discussion in 'Diabetes Discussions' started by mullaneder, Oct 21, 2009.

  1. mullaneder

    mullaneder · Well-Known Member

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    i was just wondering who is getting sick of the on going arguement between the low carbers and the non low carbers.i have to say it is starting to get a bit silly.every post that is being put up is being picked apart by the other side. unfounded accusations being posted.personal attacks. how many people are getting fed up of all this and are just leaving the forum ? i am not picking on one side as i think one is as bad as the other. its all a bit childish.i think the whole lot of ye should get a grip of yourselves and just grow up or the only ones that will be left will be yourselves fighting with each other and helping nobody

    dermot
     
  2. wallycorker

    wallycorker · Well-Known Member

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    I'm with you on that Dermot!
     
  3. nannybarbara

    nannybarbara · Well-Known Member

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  4. pavlosn

    pavlosn Type 2 · Well-Known Member

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  5. Doczoc

    Doczoc · Well-Known Member

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    Post of the year!!!!! :D
     
  6. valattrevear

    valattrevear · Well-Known Member

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    Thank the lord for someone who has finally said what so many of us feel :lol: :lol: Well said Dermot!!
    Val
     
  7. sugarless sue

    sugarless sue · Master

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    Yes, well said, Dermot. Is it asking too much for each side to respect the other's views ?
     
  8. gbtyke

    gbtyke · Well-Known Member

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    I would like to say that I agree but I had Dermot down as one of the main culprits?
     
  9. RichardS

    RichardS · Member

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    Although I have found this forum very useful - there is a mass of information and advice -I haven't posted much yet for fear of provoking another feud. I have known about my T2 for over eight years, and am fairly confident in my management, which steers a wobbly line straight down the middle between the two camps. Using ideas from this site over the last two months I am getting some very encouraging reductions in my BG. But I am not sure if I had first found this site when newly diagnosed and confused I would have known what to make of the sometimes strident and antagonistic, and frequenly dogmatic posts. If some of the posters with amazing sucess stories would tone down the relentless "one way to salvation" and offer more advice and less instruction, then this place might be as approachable as it it useful.
    No offence - I am quite happy to continue lurking and gleaning the nuggets from the flames if the status quo continues.
     
  10. mullaneder

    mullaneder · Well-Known Member

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    sorry but i cant let that go.where did i attack anyones views or personally attack someone.i have stated before that the low carb is not for me.thats all.its this kind of posting that is annoying.i thought i posted a constructive post.there are too many little snide remarks being put in.please show me where i have sinned :?

    dermot
     
  11. catherinecherub

    catherinecherub · Guest

    Dermot,
    It is fairly obvious from gbtyke's response that he/she likes the aggrevation. Why else would he/she want to derail this thread :?:

    Throughout your posting you have always been fairminded and considerate and we are all aware of that.
    The aggrevation is part of forum life and will always be there. There is no answer for it and we can respond or leave well alone, the choice is ours.

    Numbers swell when there is a heated debate going on and people who never post still come and read what is going on. Human nature I suppose, a bit like rubber necking when there is an RTA.
     
  12. Administrator

    Administrator Family member · Well-Known Member
    Staff Member Administrator

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    Change occurs not through banning and threats, but through people ignoring the trolls and keep the good information and support coming. Trolls feed on attention and response, and this forum has reached a size at which there will always be trolls.

    Always worth taking a step back and remembering anyone that personally insults anyone else on a public forum is pathetic.
     
  13. Dillinger

    Dillinger Type 1 · Well-Known Member

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    This forum is a great place; it has drastically improved my diabetic control over the course of this year. I am, as a consequence of that, fairly vocal in putting forward the same advice I have been given here. I am a proponent of a low carb diet. I try to be as factual and logical and coherent as possible in my support of that low-carb approach.

    I have no ‘political’ adherence to it though; it is not an act of faith for me; if it turned out that the best way to control diabetes was to eat cheesecake and whelks whilst walking backwards I’d be shouting about that instead.

    This approach that I support does not, as we all know, have the support of dieticians or the majority of medical practitioners in the NHS. It is by its nature controversial. But I think a bit of controversy and a bit of argument is a good thing if people’s health is being improved as a consequence. It’s important that people don’t confuse argument with instruction though; I’m absolutely sure that no one has ever posted here instructing people to follow their advice. Why would they? That would be madness and worthy of a good flaming.

    I hope that I do not offend anyone or prevent anyone from posting if they would like to but I think it is important to pick up errors or mistakes and correct them. No one likes to be corrected; we are all human with our delicate and wobbly egos, but it’s important that we try and get as many facts to the fore as possible. If I make a mistake I may wince when someone pulls me up on it, but in the end that’s for the best. It must be, right?

    I really hope that that is not controversial; I’ll give you an example. Yesterday someone as part of a critique of the low-carb bias of the site described how some low-carb advice was given to a pregnant women, when ‘everybody knows’ that pregnant women need an extra 3,000 calories a day in their diet. Here’s the problem; firstly they don’t. They require between 300 and 500 more a day and secondly there is a suggestion that low-carbing is a form of calorie restriction, which is also wrong. So, surely it’s in the interest of us all to point those type of errors out?

    Let’s not, of course, argue about who is uglier than who (I’d win :( ...) but let’s by a process of arguing and exchange try and enlighten ourselves about what is a chronic condition that left to itself will do us a lot of harm. But if we all were of one mind then there would be no need for this forum at all, so disagreement and arguments are always going to be a part of it.

    Dillinger
     
  14. gbtyke

    gbtyke · Well-Known Member

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    please show me where i have sinned


    maybe the names are too similar.is that why low carbers post in this section From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=10120&p=95224#p95224

    deadwood it isnt called the high carb forum ,its called the non low carb forum.and if you dont see the point of this forum why do you keep posting on it.personally if it shows that there is an alternative to low carbing then surely it is worthwhile.just imagine if someone new came on and saw that the only way was low carb and they couldnt do it then how would they feel then. From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8312&p=83900#p83900

    hi thirsty no problem i was thinking of starting a thread as to why i dont low carb but i didnt want it to descend to low carbers coming on disagreeing with my point of view but if you really want to know then you wish is my command i just hope low carbers dont see it as confrontational From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8312&p=83842#p83842

    with respect graham this kind of post is not helpful .yet again there is another little comment sneaked in promoting low carbs."i have seen nothing in the way of alternatives to low carbs"it is bad enough listening to low carbs being pushed at nearly every person that comes on the greetings forum without low carbs being promoted in the non low carb forum.how many times have we to put up with this .ye seem to be ignoring the many warnings from the moderators.if you read all of the posts you would see a few suggestions how you dont have to low carb.also you have to remember that this section is relatively new.also your little dig at phoenix is not very nice and getting personal as well.so please if you dont agree with what is being said in this forum put up a counter arguement in the non low carb forum.the moderators are there to police this site so nothing will be allowed to be posted that is bad advice.please could low carbers stop posting in this section of the forum. From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8225&p=80979#p80979

    no i dont think so i really dont want low carb preaching in this forum as well its not what it was set up for and from previous posts i am not the only one From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8225&p=79268#p79268


    low carbs i thought i was in the wrong forum From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8225&p=79253#p79253

    still a lot of low carb postings in this forum From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8312&p=79250#p79250

    patch you can post anything you want on it i am not offended but i am only thinking of new people ,please tell me what this thread is achieving who is it helping why not set up a new forum to **** people off From viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8191&p=79176#p79176


    there is an obvious divide here those who low carb and those who dont ,personally i like going into this forum where i know that the posts are not going to be about low carbs just look at most of the advice in the greetings section .the low carb people are just more vocal and fair play to them but if you are not into it ,it can be a bit tiresome .if you want debate and open discussions then go to the general chat section but i like a section where people who arent obsessive about carbs can speak freely what is the harm in that From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8312&p=77906#p77906

    kegstore i saw the same thread and laughed we must have them worried only joking
    its all so silly and childish we are all in the same boat all trying to do our best i find it weird that on a site where people are so helpful they cant accept other peoples wiews without taking it personally i was afraid that this forum would actually become more devisive but it is probably the only solution .for new people coming on it must be very offputting to see people bickering
    From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8181&p=77615#p77615

    in fairness this forum was set up to stop this silly bickering and where people who dont low carb can discuss this low carbers have their own forum and shouldnt be trying to convert the non believers we are all trying our best and trying to find what helps us and this kind of bickering isnt helpful From viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8225&p=76733#p76733


    I don't think that I said that Dermot personally attacked anyone but intimated that he was part of the low / high carb conflict. I consider myself lowish carb although I don't count them so do not know if I would qualify with anyones definition and considering myself lowish carb I had just picked up his agressive stance against low carb. As I always click view new posts it is not obvious to me which forum I am in and I did post a reply in the Berstein thread which was in the non low carb section and got an instant rebuff from Dermot so that is why it then stuck with me. I have no notion of what a troll is but do not consider myself one of those either.
     
  15. mullaneder

    mullaneder · Well-Known Member

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    thank you gbtyke for going to the trouble to try and find where i have personally attacked or tried to pick someones post apart.i dont think you have achieved this.if you notice a common theme in those posts ,they are all about low carbers posting in the non low carb forum.if you look through the non low carb forum you will find many posts from low carbers.you are not the only person making this mistake.i dont feel that i have an agressive stance against low carbing.it just isnt for me.

    thanks gbtyke dermot

    ps.what you said was that i was one of the the biggest culprits of doing what i was complaining about
     
  16. Administrator

    Administrator Family member · Well-Known Member
    Staff Member Administrator

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    Fantastic post Dillinger.
     
  17. sugarless sue

    sugarless sue · Master

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    If members would stop being so dogmatic about 'this' is the only way to do it then we could move on and get on with the business of controlling our diabetes whichever way we can. I'm fed up writing ,'we are all different' but that is the whole point !!
    I have learned a lot from this forum, it changed my life, probably why I stick with it and still think it is the best for information on the net because we cater for ALL diabetics not a narrow band like many of the others on the net.
    It's simple really, find which way controls your blood sugar levels and stick with it. If you don't agree with others then ignore the post unless it contains some inaccuracy which you feel you can correct stating sources as well for the correction.
    However, by reading all points of view we all learn a bit more about diabetes. The members on here probably know more about their diabetes and other types just from reading all the different sections and, I dare say, know more than many doctors/nurses do.
    There are many on here who only have to see the word,' reduce' and automatically assume that they are being told to low carb. Reducing carb intake is surely the aim of all diabetics given that diabetes is a metabolic inability to use carbohydrate correctly.
    The argument on how much to reduce is an ongoing one, bit like the 'Never-ending Story',
    eating to your meter is a sensible way to determine how well you are controlling your diabetes,some can do this with more carbs than others but the key word is always control.
     
  18. jdesn

    jdesn · Newbie

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    Now now children, Daddy has a headache :wink:
     
  19. mullaneder

    mullaneder · Well-Known Member

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    thanks a million for what you said yesterday catherine

    dermot
     
  20. kegstore

    kegstore · Well-Known Member

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    Dermot I was quite frankly stunned that someone would trawl through all your previous posts and quote some of them in an attempt to prove their point?!?! I call that obsessive.

    One thing that really annoys me on here is the detail that some people will go into and the word count used when posting, resulting in great tomes appearing in a single post. If you can't get your point across in 3 or 4 shortish paragraphs, you risk losing the audience as people will just skip over the waffle, and probably miss out on an important point you're trying to make.

    I now wait for someone to trawl my previous posts and highlight where I've been guilty of this. Get a life? :roll:
     
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