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The role of ketones in health?

Ok, so a low carb diet I can see the point of, lose weight, keep insulin usage low both types 1 and 2. personally not for me, however as Ive said on other posts would consider reducing carbs should I ever need to loose weight or develop insulin resistance, till then....
Interesting to read sams post as I know he is a type 1 low carber and has said not had ketones. I would take from that although low carbing, having enough carbs to not develop ketones, fair enough.
Would still say a long term ketogenic diet would be harmful in the long term, and **** advice, however thats my opinion only.



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Im new to all this and have been low carbing with success both in weight and levels. However am now confused.. Have gone and read some stuff and i
Now concerned that other than very short term this may well have implications for my health and it seems that u cant win either way


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Pompeygirl, low carb diets should not cause any problems by itself. Just curious though have you tested for ketones ? Very low levels is nothing of concern I should adf.

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douglas99 said:
Patch13 said:
The Inuit and the Masai people's traditional diet has been based on meat, fat and animal consumables and they have had little modern disease except when they have chosen to switch to a modern ( carb) based diet. However we also need to note that these people tend to eat the majority of the animals they kill including liver, heart, etc which low carbers in studies may not have been eating (just a suggestion as I haven't read the studies themselves. I have read a few books around the subject and intend to read the actual studies when I have time).

Also dr Richard Bernstein has lived on a low carb, ketogenic diet for about 40+ years and has reversed complications he had due to diabetes. His blood profiles have never looked so good.




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I suggest reading more as well.

"The Inuit (Eskimo) have the highest osteoporosis rates in the world. In a study of 217 children, 89 adults, and 107 elderly Inuit in Alaska, researchers found that they had lower bone mineral content, onset of bone loss at an earlier age, and development of bone thinning with a greater intensity than white Americans"

"The Masai have the highest osteoporosis rates in Kenya"

But, to be fair, that's google, so I don't have the references to hand.
If you want to check them out, you can. If you want to dismiss it out of hand, that's an option as well.

But even Bernstein devotes chapters in his books to vitamin and mineral supplements in his diet.

And here's a final quote from a poster on marksdailyapple.
Make of it what you will.

"Also, I would like to point out something. Historically, all the larger and more dominant civilizations regularly ate grains and potatoes and were still healthy. For example, Romans Greeks, Mongols, and Japanese. Most of the civilizations eating mainly meat-based diets are very small and not very advanced even though they were healthy. For example, the Inuit, Eskimos, Native Americans, and the Maasai. Americans basically wiped out the native Americans, and at the time, the Americans were still eating grains and potatoes, and were more fit because of more walking and other manual labor. Obesity and type 2 diabetes are recent illnesses. These diseases have been more recent to us than the discovery of cooking grains."
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Thanks for the info, I shall look into that. I like learning new things.

However I don't see why Bernstein having a section on vitamins and minerals as you point out should be a big deal or mean the diet is dangerous/unhealthy.
After all we are told by doctors to take vitamin / mineral supplements when eating high carb diets , so shouldn't that suggest these are deficient somehow too?

How come Sweden recommend a high fat, low car diet if research suggests they cause osteoporosis etc? (I'm just wondering, and am not trying to be antagonistic!)

I personally think that everyone just needs to find something they are happy with and helps control their diabetes. For me that's low carb, but for others high carb is fine.
 
Brett said..."Interesting to read sams post as I know he is a type 1 low carber and has said not had ketones"

You can be keto adapted through a low carb diet YET not show any ketones on the urinary ketostix for a couple of reasons...

1. You are burning all the ketones produced by fuelling your bodies needs as opposed to spilling them out in your urine.

2. Urinary ketones can depend on how hydrated you are at the time-a blood ketone reading is much more accurate although quite expensive a measuring tool.

Paul
 
Well I would say to do so, though please don't panic. As said it is known to be dangerous to have both high sugars and high ketones (diabetic ketoacidis) mentioned earlier. Debatable if showing ketones with normal sugars is ok, though I personally don't think its good, others do.

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brett said

"Debatable if showing ketones with normal sugars is ok, though I personally don't think its good, others do."

Please could you explain what is debatable and why you don't think it is good-thank-you.

FB
 
Cause its my opinion, and although there is research about it as previously stated by other posters, cba to post links and continue to bang my head against a brick wall on this thread anymore. yes it MAY be good SHORT term to shock the system. Yes you will have good sugar levels with reduced/no meds. Imo long term ketones= trouble, possibly causing OTHER complications down the track

Again, imo I would prefer to have a diet that causes no ketones, and be medicated properly to control sugar levels. If needed, would do anything possible, such as exercise, reduce carbs to possibly reduce meds, insulin whatever but without having ketones.


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Thundercat said:
I am not a low carber but have reduced them significantly. I have learned a lot on this forum about low carb diets but know it would be difficult for me personally. If my reduced carb diet stopped being effective I would be prepared to try the very low carb diet. So, right up front I am not opposed to ketosis as a fuel method. What I am getting from Douglas on this thread is that if you choose this diet keep an eye out for side effects and take precautions. I don't feel that he is trying to convert people back to carbs.

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Thank you.
 
noblehead said:
To ketone or not to ketone........that is the question :lol:

Seriously though, I don't think for those that see it as unnecessary and have doubts about its safety are going to be persuaded otherwise by what's said on this thread, the same can be said for those on the other-side..... so we are going round and round in circles here yet again :crazy:
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I agree, there are some that will have a ketogenic diet regardless, some that won't.
I'm not at the moment. If I ever do, I'll certainly do it with more research into the possible side effects, and aware I could be swopping the symptoms one long term illness for another.
And others reading the post can be aware of possible side effects, that I haven't seen posted here before, before they make their choices.
 
brett said:
Cause its my opinion, and although there is research about it as previously stated by other posters, cba to post links and continue to bang my head against a brick wall on this thread anymore. yes it MAY be good SHORT term to shock the system. Yes you will have good sugar levels with reduced/no meds. Imo long term ketones= trouble, possibly causing OTHER complications down the track

Again, imo I would prefer to have a diet that causes no ketones, and be medicated properly to control sugar levels. If needed, would do anything possible, such as exercise, reduce carbs to possibly reduce meds, insulin whatever but without having ketones.


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Three times IMO have you got any studies or trials to back ketones in a healthy subject is not safe? Thank-you.

FB
 
Yeah, read the info booklet that comes with keto sticks/ketone strips. There not limited to only diabetics and info for general public.

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its scarey stuff this, if for example someone was about to try a ketogenic diet that would maybe save their life or lengthen it, after reading this could be put off, therefore not achieve what they may have, or visa versa, scarey scarey stuff indeed
 
Andy12345 said:
its scarey stuff this, if for example someone was about to try a ketogenic diet that would maybe save their life or lengthen it, after reading this could be put off, therefore not achieve what they may have, or visa versa, scarey scarey stuff indeed
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Very true andy, who knows? The infos there but ultimately as all things diabetic an individual choice.

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